Michael Beasley and Jared Dudley must step up or step down

[Kyler Murray]

Miami got 2nd rounders becuz that's all it wanted. (no salary coming back)
Minessota didnt find any partners becuz beasly had only some months left in his contract, why would anyone give assets for him and not just w8 some months to sign him? (and he couldn't be acquired as an expiring because minny didnt want extra salary in the next years)

In terms of chucking he's 3rd in this team, Brown and Morris chuck more and distribute far less.
I'm watching the same games. He reduced his stupid shots to 2-3 a game, and yeah he attacks the rim, I've seen him do it with sucess occasionally.

He's played most of his NBA career not in his natural spot and with longjams in the spot he's given, i believe he can be given some time to see if he can flourish. And we can afford it, we're not going anywhere with this team, so what if he causes more losses? Better draft pick.

[phrazbit]

Miami got 2nd rounders becuz that's all it wanted. (no salary coming back)
Minessota didnt find any partners becuz beasly had only some months left in his contract, why would anyone give assets for him and not just w8 some months to sign him? (and he couldn't be acquired as an expiring because minny didnt want extra salary in the next years)

In terms of chucking he's 3rd in this team, Brown and Morris chuck more and distribute far less.
I'm watching the same games. He reduced his stupid shots to 2-3 a game, and yeah he attacks the rim, I've seen him do it with sucess occasionally.

He's played most of his NBA career not in his natural spot and with longjams in the spot he's given, i believe he can be given some time to see if he can flourish. And we can afford it, we're not going anywhere with this team, so what if he causes more losses? Better draft pick.

Any team that traded for him last year would have had him as a restricted free agent, Minnesota ALSO could have had the option of putting an RFA tag on him but they chose to let him walk for nothing, anyone trading for him could have kept him if they wanted to. And Miami could have taken at least ONE first back for Beasley... but the market value for him to even land that didnt exist. There flat out is not a market for Beasley around the league because most teams have figured out that he stinks.

Beasley leads the team in shot attempts despite shooting terribly. Brown is taking less shots than Beasley but scoring MORE points. As for Morris... right now Morris is a train wreck, outside of the last couple days Morris was playing at a level below what you would expect from a D-leaguer. But thats still no defense for Beasley's total ineptitude.

Its a poorly constructed roster and right now Beasley is a huge part of the problem. And while his sucking does only improve our draft stock, he is also unfortunately chewing up cap space for the next several years and is absolutely worthless as a trade chip... and a team in the Suns position needs assets badly.

[Kyler Murray]

Miami got 2nd rounders becuz that's all it wanted. (no salary coming back)
Minessota didnt find any partners becuz beasly had only some months left in his contract, why would anyone give assets for him and not just w8 some months to sign him? (and he couldn't be acquired as an expiring because minny didnt want extra salary in the next years)

In terms of chucking he's 3rd in this team, Brown and Morris chuck more and distribute far less.
I'm watching the same games. He reduced his stupid shots to 2-3 a game, and yeah he attacks the rim, I've seen him do it with sucess occasionally.

He's played most of his NBA career not in his natural spot and with longjams in the spot he's given, i believe he can be given some time to see if he can flourish. And we can afford it, we're not going anywhere with this team, so what if he causes more losses? Better draft pick.

Any team that traded for him last year would have had him as a restricted free agent, Minnesota ALSO could have had the option of putting an RFA tag on him but they chose to let him walk for nothing, anyone trading for him could have kept him if they wanted to. And Miami could have taken at least ONE first back for Beasley... but the market value for him to even land that didnt exist. There flat out is not a market for Beasley around the league because most teams have figured out that he stinks.

Beasley leads the team in shot attempts despite shooting terribly. Brown is taking less shots than Beasley but scoring MORE points. As for Morris... right now Morris is a train wreck, outside of the last couple days Morris was playing at a level below what you would expect from a D-leaguer. But thats still no defense for Beasley's total ineptitude.

Its a poorly constructed roster and right now Beasley is a huge part of the problem. And while his sucking does only improve our draft stock, he is also unfortunately chewing up cap space for the next several years and is absolutely worthless as a trade chip... and a team in the Suns position needs assets badly.

Brown has taken worse shots than Beasley by far. 2/3 of his shots are contested or overdribbled. Only reason he has more points is because our 2nd unit is actually playing better and he has many transition baskets/kobe-like hot streaks.

And Beasley only has this and the next year fully guarenteed, the last one is partially. You really believe we will be done with our rebuilding by the end of the next season? That we will need the 3-4m he will hold in the last year so desperately?

[phrazbit]

Brown has taken worse shots than Beasley by far. 2/3 of his shots are contested or overdribbled. Only reason he has more points is because our 2nd unit is actually playing better and he has many transition baskets/kobe-like hot streaks.

And Beasley only has this and the next year fully guarenteed, the last one is partially. You really believe we will be done with our rebuilding by the end of the next season? That we will need the 3-4m he will hold in the last year so desperately?

Barring luck the rebuild is going to last a while. But having dead money in awful players is never a good thing.

And while Brown has poor shot selection its almost impossible to claim Beasley's is better. The guy dribbles into the teeth of the defense on a regular basis and virtually all of his attempts are contested. And the biggest reason the 2nd unit is playing so well is because Beasley is not on the floor.

[Klomp]

I'm curious about Dudley. Seems somewhat in the same position as Derrick Williams is in Minnesota...good player that looks bad because he's forced to play out of position. Dudley is not a SG. He's just not. It baffles me why you guys try to play him there.

What are your thoughts on a Dudley for Williams swap? Since you guys are getting the better upside, maybe a return of the pick we owe you from the Wes Johnson deal? So Derrick Williams for Jared Dudley and pick returned?

Saying that Beasley has "never been a good NBA player" is stretching it. You have to be at least a decent NBA player to earn a starting job, and at least a "good NBA player" if you can average 19.2 points per game. Beasley is a good NBA player. In fact, he is a very good NBA player, with the potential of being a star in this league. Yes he has his faults, but the problem is, people are writing him off too early, and not giving him time to get over these faults and improved his game.

You've been sucked into his trap. Minnesota fans thought the same thing that first year.

[sunskerr]

I'm curious about Dudley. Seems somewhat in the same position as Derrick Williams is in Minnesota...good player that looks bad because he's forced to play out of position. Dudley is not a SG. He's just not. It baffles me why you guys try to play him there.

What are your thoughts on a Dudley for Williams swap? Since you guys are getting the better upside, maybe a return of the pick we owe you from the Wes Johnson deal? So Derrick Williams for Jared Dudley and pick returned?

You've been sucked into his trap. Minnesota fans thought the same thing that first year.

I wouldn't mind that deal but you guys wouldn't want to trade a shiny new young player full of potential to us. We'll take that old and worn down Kirilenko instead

[Klomp]

I wouldn't mind that deal but you guys wouldn't want to trade a shiny new young player full of potential to us. We'll take that old and worn down Kirilenko instead

Nice try Kerr.

[rsavaj]

I'm curious about Dudley. Seems somewhat in the same position as Derrick Williams is in Minnesota...good player that looks bad because he's forced to play out of position. Dudley is not a SG. He's just not. It baffles me why you guys try to play him there.

What are your thoughts on a Dudley for Williams swap? Since you guys are getting the better upside, maybe a return of the pick we owe you from the Wes Johnson deal? So Derrick Williams for Jared Dudley and pick returned?

Dudley's played successfully as a SG for the past two years...that's why his sudden drop in production is particularly mindboggling.

I would do the Dudley/Williams trade in a vacuum, but we'd have the same problem with Williams as you guys would...he's a tweener SF/PF who plays better as a small 4, and there's no room for him at that spot.

Besides...I've seen the first chapter of the Beasley/Williams pairing, and I'm not too optimistic about Chapter 2.

[GrantHill]

Dudley's played successfully as a SG for the past two years...that's why his sudden drop in production is particularly mindboggling.

It worked in a combination with Grant Hill, an athletic, smart wing defender that can guard every position. Now, Dudley has to guard all those two-guards (for instance D-Wade) and his offense suffers because of it. Also, he tries to do too much on his own (like nevetsov pointed out in another thread).

[RunDogGun]

Dudley's played successfully as a SG for the past two years...that's why his sudden drop in production is particularly mindboggling.

It worked in a combination with Grant Hill, an athletic, smart wing defender that can guard every position. Now, Dudley has to guard all those two-guards (for instance D-Wade) and his offense suffers because of it. Also, he tries to do too much on his own (like nevetsov pointed out in another thread).

He didn't play too poorly with Brown next to him, and Brown isn't a defensive juggernaut.

Dudley's shot looks terrible. In the laker game, he was to the right pretty bad, I don't know why.

[GrantHill]

Brown has the atletism to guard athletic two guards but you are right, sometimes his shot looks completely changed.

[RunDogGun]

Brown has the atletism to guard athletic two guards but you are right, sometimes his shot looks completely changed.

He is athletic, but you also said smart, which I thought disqualifies Brown.

[GrantHill]

[lilfishi22]

You've been sucked into his trap. Minnesota fans thought the same thing that first year.

It's the only thing his supporters use to justify his contract, playing time and starting gig.

The fact is this, he's a 5th year player and while he may not play well, he needs to know *how* to play well. Just the way he's played and developed over the years has provided zero evidence that he's learning how to be a better, more productive player. He's still taking long shots (whether contested or not), still not giving 100% on D and not getting to the line, the same things he's *not* been doing since he got in the league.

[DRK]

Dudley's played successfully as a SG for the past two years...that's why his sudden drop in production is particularly mindboggling.

Disagree. Dudley has been as much as a "sg" for us as Marion was a "Power Forward" for us.

On paper, Dudley played as the sg, but in reality, his game is nothing like a SG in this league. He was too slow to defend the other SG's in the league, and was really not much of a factor on offence ever since he decided to stop spreading the floor by shooting threes, and drive to the hoop instead. (Idiot)

We usually saw Grant Hill guard the other team's SG. Monta, Crawford, Joe Johnson.... So maybe you could say that Grant Hill was our SG.

Dudley need to go back to the bench. Period, as a backup 3. There is no question about it.

[lilfishi22]

Dudley need to go back to the bench. Period, as a backup 3. There is no question about it.

That I can agree with.