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Offseason Thread 6: The Not So Mexican Stand-off Continues

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Re: Offseason Thread 6: The Not So Mexican Stand-off Continu 

Post#1821 » by Jdiddy701 » Sun Sep 28, 2014 2:39 am

Anybody else find it weird that Suns Twitter page ask to submit questions for Suns players except Eric Bledsoe? They must be expecting questions that wouldn't be appropriate.


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Re: Offseason Thread 6: The Not So Mexican Stand-off Continu 

Post#1822 » by bwgood77 » Sun Sep 28, 2014 2:41 am

Sunsdeuce wrote:
carey wrote:Y'all are still underestimating how much Tolliver is going to play for us. There's a reason we went after him as soon as we knew Frye was gone. He won't start unless Kieff wets the bed, but he's going to play. A lot.

If tolliver plays "a lot" were in big trouble.


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How about we wait and see what Hornacek gets out of people.

Anyone could have said the same about Green, Plumlee, Frye, or whoever else last year and we were a game from the playoffs.
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Re: Offseason Thread 6: The Not So Mexican Stand-off Continu 

Post#1823 » by bwgood77 » Sun Sep 28, 2014 2:42 am

Jdiddy701 wrote:Anybody else find it weird that Suns Twitter page ask to submit questions for Suns players except Eric Bledsoe? They must be expecting questions that wouldn't be appropriate.


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Honestly if anything it probably has more to do with them wanting to focus on other things with him at the moment. Everyone else has been in the gym, preparing, probably talking to coaches and working on things, etc, and Eric should probably focus just on that. The other guys are probably ready to go.
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Re: Offseason Thread 6: The Not So Mexican Stand-off Continu 

Post#1824 » by KLEON » Sun Sep 28, 2014 3:01 am

aIvin adams wrote:
LukasBMW wrote:What about Hibbert?

PG is done for a year and Lance left. If Indiana decides to rebuild, we've got some quality rebuilding pieces to offer.

I want a massive starting center for rim protection, rebounding and a post up game.

We can still have 4 other guys on the court to run.


would love to get Hibbert here and get him a fresh start. that guy has no comparison in terms of rim protection; he's a tier above the other bigs who do what he does.

his rebounding numbers might be underwhelming, but i wouldn't be surprised if he had a positive impact on team rebounding a la Robin Lopez.

the only player int he league who attacks Hibbert fearlessly is Dragic. so if Hibbert played here, he'd be impenetrable :D

I don't want him here because he simply doesn't fit the Suns' system. He's slow and weak both mentally and physically. BTW is it really true that PG smashed Hibbert's wife?
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Re: Offseason Thread 6: The Not So Mexican Stand-off Continu 

Post#1825 » by carey » Sun Sep 28, 2014 3:11 am

bwgood77 wrote:
Sunsdeuce wrote:
carey wrote:Y'all are still underestimating how much Tolliver is going to play for us. There's a reason we went after him as soon as we knew Frye was gone. He won't start unless Kieff wets the bed, but he's going to play. A lot.

If tolliver plays "a lot" were in big trouble.


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How about we wait and see what Hornacek gets out of people.

Anyone could have said the same about Green, Plumlee, Frye, or whoever else last year and we were a game from the playoffs.

Agreed. He was a net positive for Charlotte last year. We need floor spacers and I would rather Kieff not regress to his '11-'13 form of jacking threes but rather continue taking it to the hole and abusing the mid-range. I'd pair Tolliver with TJ & IT. I guess we will see. I'm no X's & O's genius. Just connecting the dots.
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Re: Offseason Thread 6: The Not So Mexican Stand-off Continu 

Post#1826 » by Suns Court 23 » Sun Sep 28, 2014 3:40 am

Split T wrote:
BurningHeart wrote:Al Horford is really, really, really overrated. My goodness. Really damn good player, no doubt, but you'd think the guy is Tim Duncan the way people carry on about him.

Markieff Morris, Marcus Morris, Alex Len, AND the Lakers pick? AND that's only if Markieff takes "another step"?!

Hooooooooooooly mackerel, dude.

Markieff Morris is fine. More than fine. We need depth behind the bigs and for Alex Len to continue improving. That's all.


We've got depth, what we need is a difference maker that can start and give us 30-35 minutes of all-star level play. I don't see markieff ever becoming that. Horford is that. And Len is a mystery, who knows what he turns into. I'd turn the Morri, Len and the lakers pick into horford in a heart beat. And Atlanta would shoot it down in a heart beat too.

I would rather take out Len and put in our 2014 pick and a future pick and Goodwin in addition to the Morri and Laker's pick for Horford.
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Re: Offseason Thread 6: The Not So Mexican Stand-off Continu 

Post#1827 » by DRK » Sun Sep 28, 2014 4:16 am

If Len can hit the elbow jumper consistently this season, as well as finish inside and hit free throws it'll be huge. We'll be a playoff team. Mark my words.

Last season we got literally no offence out of our true "centers." Plumlee was trash on offence, and Len hardly played. When they were on the court, we were a liability on offence, and when they were off the court, our rebounding took a big hit.

Lets hope we see some offensive improvement out of Len and Plumlee next year. That'll be the key to whether we can make the Playoffs
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Re: Offseason Thread 6: The Not So Mexican Stand-off Continu 

Post#1828 » by Split T » Sun Sep 28, 2014 4:33 am

Suns Court 23 wrote:
Split T wrote:
BurningHeart wrote:Al Horford is really, really, really overrated. My goodness. Really damn good player, no doubt, but you'd think the guy is Tim Duncan the way people carry on about him.

Markieff Morris, Marcus Morris, Alex Len, AND the Lakers pick? AND that's only if Markieff takes "another step"?!

Hooooooooooooly mackerel, dude.

Markieff Morris is fine. More than fine. We need depth behind the bigs and for Alex Len to continue improving. That's all.


We've got depth, what we need is a difference maker that can start and give us 30-35 minutes of all-star level play. I don't see markieff ever becoming that. Horford is that. And Len is a mystery, who knows what he turns into. I'd turn the Morri, Len and the lakers pick into horford in a heart beat. And Atlanta would shoot it down in a heart beat too.

I would rather take out Len and put in our 2014 pick and a future pick and Goodwin in addition to the Morri and Laker's pick for Horford.


Fair enough, I put Len in there to make it work salary wise and because I've never been a big fan, but there would be other ways to make the salaries work. But all this is pointless anyways, the East is so bad that Atlanta will be a 5-7 seed and hold on to Horford anyways. Here's to Markieff building off his breakout year and turning into a solid starter and Len staying healthy and looking like a legit NBA center.
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Re: Offseason Thread 6: The Not So Mexican Stand-off Continu 

Post#1829 » by letsgosuns » Sun Sep 28, 2014 5:36 am

I cannot believe so many people want to trade Alex Len. Do you not understand that centers win championships? He is a 7'1", 21 year old center with legitimate offensive skills. Can anyone name one time in Suns history that the organization had a player like that ever? I cannot think of any. How many championship banners are hanging in the Suns arena? That's right, zero. The Suns have a history of great power forwards and great point guards. They do not have a history of great centers. It blows my mind that some fans want to trade away the first young guy the Suns have had that has potential to be a truly impact center. You do not give up on a player like that after one season no matter what he looked like his first year. Not every player is like Magic Johnson, Shaquille O'Neal, or Lebron James and can dominate the league as a rookie. Especially a player that had no training camp and missed a large part of his first season due to injury. I am going to give Alex Len the full four years of his rookie contract to see if he develops. Some of you want to just throw him away like he is garbage. 7'1" centers do not grow on trees.
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Re: Offseason Thread 6: The Not So Mexican Stand-off Continu 

Post#1830 » by DirtyDez » Sun Sep 28, 2014 6:10 am

7'1" centers do grow on trees. There are so many terrible big men...

All I want from him is positive minutes. That is all I ask of you Alex.
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Re: Offseason Thread 6: The Not So Mexican Stand-off Continu 

Post#1831 » by Revived » Sun Sep 28, 2014 6:24 am

Yea I don't understand why people act like 7 ft centers are scarce or something.

There's plenty of guys that height or really close to it who suck at basketball. Not that hard to find, plenty of them in the NBA also and plenty in college.

The better way to put it would be "Skilled 7 ft centers don't grow on trees".
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Re: Offseason Thread 6: The Not So Mexican Stand-off Continu 

Post#1832 » by letsgosuns » Sun Sep 28, 2014 6:54 am

I just looked at every single active center in the league on here: http://espn.go.com/nba/players/_/position/c/league/nba

Only ten of them are at least 7'1" or taller. There are about 400 players in the NBA. So around 2.5% of the NBA consists of centers that are 7'1" or taller. So I would say that 7'1" centers do not grow on trees. In Len's brief playing time last year, I saw him do things that Jake Tsakalidis, Robin Lopez, and Luc Longley could never dream of doing. Those are some of the centers that the Suns used during the past 15 years. Those guys all SUCKED. Yet the Suns tried them for years because they were so desperate for a center. Jerry Colangelo wanted a good center so badly he traded Dan Majerle for Hot Rod Williams. The center position is the hardest position to find a good player for. That is why I do not understand fans wanting to give Len up before he ever even gets a chance. Do I think he is going to end up an all-star? I have no idea, but I hope so. All I know is that I saw glimpses from him last season where I said whoa, this guy actually made a really good offensive move, I want to see him play more. He hardly ever played.
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Re: Offseason Thread 6: The Not So Mexican Stand-off Continu 

Post#1833 » by AtheJ415 » Sun Sep 28, 2014 7:25 am

letsgosuns wrote:I just looked at every single active center in the league on here: http://espn.go.com/nba/players/_/position/c/league/nba

Only ten of them are at least 7'1" or taller. There are about 400 players in the NBA. So around 2.5% of the NBA consists of centers that are 7'1" or taller. So I would say that 7'1" centers do not grow on trees. In Len's brief playing time last year, I saw him do things that Jake Tsakalidis, Robin Lopez, and Luc Longley could never dream of doing. Those are some of the centers that the Suns used during the past 15 years. Those guys all SUCKED. Yet the Suns tried them for years because they were so desperate for a center. Jerry Colangelo wanted a good center so badly he traded Dan Majerle for Hot Rod Williams. The center position is the hardest position to find a good player for. That is why I do not understand fans wanting to give Len up before he ever even gets a chance. Do I think he is going to end up an all-star? I have no idea, but I hope so. All I know is that I saw glimpses from him last season where I said whoa, this guy actually made a really good offensive move, I want to see him play more. He hardly ever played.


I agree. Len's potential is obvious. People are a little quick to judge him, which I found particularly surprising because (1) he was always considered a project, and (2) big guys take a long time to develop. We won't know what we have in Len for a couple more years imo, and we certainly don't know anything at this point given he's been hurt. All we can say for sure is that he's a very big, long guy who has rare athleticism and touch for his size. We'll see what he becomes.
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Re: Offseason Thread 6: The Not So Mexican Stand-off Continu 

Post#1834 » by Zelaznyrules » Sun Sep 28, 2014 7:54 am

AtheJ415 wrote:
letsgosuns wrote:I just looked at every single active center in the league on here: http://espn.go.com/nba/players/_/position/c/league/nba

Only ten of them are at least 7'1" or taller. There are about 400 players in the NBA. So around 2.5% of the NBA consists of centers that are 7'1" or taller. So I would say that 7'1" centers do not grow on trees. In Len's brief playing time last year, I saw him do things that Jake Tsakalidis, Robin Lopez, and Luc Longley could never dream of doing. Those are some of the centers that the Suns used during the past 15 years. Those guys all SUCKED. Yet the Suns tried them for years because they were so desperate for a center. Jerry Colangelo wanted a good center so badly he traded Dan Majerle for Hot Rod Williams. The center position is the hardest position to find a good player for. That is why I do not understand fans wanting to give Len up before he ever even gets a chance. Do I think he is going to end up an all-star? I have no idea, but I hope so. All I know is that I saw glimpses from him last season where I said whoa, this guy actually made a really good offensive move, I want to see him play more. He hardly ever played.


I agree. Len's potential is obvious. People are a little quick to judge him, which I found particularly surprising because (1) he was always considered a project, and (2) big guys take a long time to develop. We won't know what we have in Len for a couple more years imo, and we certainly don't know anything at this point given he's been hurt. All we can say for sure is that he's a very big, long guy who has rare athleticism and touch for his size. We'll see what he becomes.


I also like the fact he doesn't shy away from contact, he clearly has a nasty streak in him. And I don't mean like the borderline psycho spoiled brat temper-tantrum driven Robin Lopez either. I think we just need to accept the fact that he's likely to come up for his extension before he shows us what he really can be. Hopefully he'll have value long before that but given his age, his lack of experience and the fact he basically missed his rookie season, his development could take a while.
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Re: Offseason Thread 6: The Not So Mexican Stand-off Continu 

Post#1835 » by phrazbit » Sun Sep 28, 2014 8:53 am

I hope Len makes some major strides but to rip on the doubters and then claim he has "legit offensive skills" and did things last year that several other guys can "only dream of doing"... i mean, thats all fantasy right now. He didnt do anything well last year. He looked a lot worse than Lopez did his rookie season.

If you want to say "be patient" and lets wait and see, fine, I have no problem with that, but lets not start shoveling a bunch of bull, that only makes the doubters (like myself) more irritated with the entire situation.
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Re: Offseason Thread 6: The Not So Mexican Stand-off Continu 

Post#1836 » by Revived » Sun Sep 28, 2014 9:09 am

Jdiddy701 wrote:Anybody else find it weird that Suns Twitter page ask to submit questions for Suns players except Eric Bledsoe? They must be expecting questions that wouldn't be appropriate.


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They didn't ask for questions for Gerald Green, Miles Plumlee, Archie Goodwin, Alex Len and Anthony Tolliver either.
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Re: Offseason Thread 6: The Not So Mexican Stand-off Continu 

Post#1837 » by thamadkant » Sun Sep 28, 2014 9:12 am

The Suns system is biased towards guards and wingmen...


Len would need to focus on rebounding and defense to get minutes... offensively he needs to practice catching lobs, quick finishes, running/trailing fast breaks.. and hitting mid ranges.

Tim Duncan like moves, where he receives the ball with his back to the basket will indeed be scarce, as Hornacek will maybe call 2-3 plays in a game... and wont be increasing that until Len proves he can do it in a real game situation, but the only way he can improve there is to get as much practice and "attempts" in-game as possible.

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