Should Ryan Mcdonough be fired?

Frank Lee · Post #61 » by **Frank Lee** » Mon Aug 17, 2015 9:08 pm

Dude...you talk in circles... Dragic's play fell off... so he complained... but he wouldn't have complained if his play remained as productive as the prior yr... yet he played PG the prior yr... then was moved to SG/SF and his production and involvement dropped off.

So he complained.

Dragic's fault ?

Granted, he went public..but he felt forced to...force a change. Chicken and Egg it all you want.... And at the end of the day, the professional basketballer apologized... meanwhile the professional executive(s) threw a fit.

bigfoot · Post #62 » by **bigfoot** » Mon Aug 17, 2015 10:18 pm

Frank Lee wrote:Dude...you talk in circles... Dragic's play fell off... so he complained... but he wouldn't have complained if his play remained as productive as the prior yr... yet he played PG the prior yr... then was moved to SG/SF and his production and involvement dropped off.

So he complained.

Dragic's fault ?

Granted, he went public..but he felt forced to...force a change. Chicken and Egg it all you want.... And at the end of the day, the professional basketballer apologized... meanwhile the professional executive(s) threw a fit.

Come on now Frank ... Dragic, his agent, and his little brother aren't stupid and I'm sure they all circle-jerked about Goran not running the show ... "lowering" his free agent value. Dragic whined because if he's a primary ball handler he knows he's going to be able to command more dollars in free agency. That's why Dragic forced a change. Afterwards he needs to fix his rep as to not be a labeled a whiner/non-team player so he can get that big paid day he was looking for.

TeamTragic · Post #63 » by **TeamTragic** » Mon Aug 17, 2015 10:31 pm

Frank Lee wrote:Dude...you talk in circles... Dragic's play fell off... so he complained... but he wouldn't have complained IF his play remained as productive as the prior yr... yet he played PG the prior yr... then was moved to SG/SF and his production and involvement dropped off.

So he complained.

Dragic's fault ?

Granted, he went public..but he felt forced to...force a change. Chicken and Egg it all you want.... And at the end of the day, the professional basketballer apologized... meanwhile the professional executive(s) threw a fit.

I highlighted the only part that matters in your above response: IF

If Dragic was voted to the All-Star Team then I have no doubt that the SUNS keep him. I guess then that means the fans are really to blame right? Chicken meet egg :lol:

bigfoot wrote:
Frank Lee wrote:Dude...you talk in circles... Dragic's play fell off... so he complained... but he wouldn't have complained if his play remained as productive as the prior yr... yet he played PG the prior yr... then was moved to SG/SF and his production and involvement dropped off.

So he complained.

Dragic's fault ?

Granted, he went public..but he felt forced to...force a change. Chicken and Egg it all you want.... And at the end of the day, the professional basketballer apologized... meanwhile the professional executive(s) threw a fit.

Come on now Frank ... Dragic, his agent, and his little brother aren't stupid and I'm sure they all circle-jerked about Goran not running the show ... "lowering" his free agent value. Dragic whined because if he's a primary ball handler he knows he's going to be able to command more dollars in free agency. That's why Dragic forced a change. Afterwards he needs to fix his rep as to not be a labeled a whiner/non-team player so he can get that big paid day he was looking for.

Ding. Ding. Shocking isn't it? Dragic did this for business reasons? I guess it really is all about the money and the NBA is a business. That is some revelation bigfoot

saintEscaton · Post #64 » by **saintEscaton** » Tue Aug 18, 2015 12:00 am

GoranTragic wrote:
Frank Lee wrote:Dude...you talk in circles... Dragic's play fell off... so he complained... but he wouldn't have complained IF his play remained as productive as the prior yr... yet he played PG the prior yr... then was moved to SG/SF and his production and involvement dropped off.

So he complained.

Dragic's fault ?

Granted, he went public..but he felt forced to...force a change. Chicken and Egg it all you want.... And at the end of the day, the professional basketballer apologized... meanwhile the professional executive(s) threw a fit.

I highlighted the only part that matters in your above response: IF

If Dragic was voted to the All-Star Team then I have no doubt that the SUNS keep him. I guess then that means the fans are really to blame right? Chicken meet egg

bigfoot wrote:
Frank Lee wrote:Dude...you talk in circles... Dragic's play fell off... so he complained... but he wouldn't have complained if his play remained as productive as the prior yr... yet he played PG the prior yr... then was moved to SG/SF and his production and involvement dropped off.

So he complained.

Dragic's fault ?

Granted, he went public..but he felt forced to...force a change. Chicken and Egg it all you want.... And at the end of the day, the professional basketballer apologized... meanwhile the professional executive(s) threw a fit.

Come on now Frank ... Dragic, his agent, and his little brother aren't stupid and I'm sure they all circle-jerked about Goran not running the show ... "lowering" his free agent value. Dragic whined because if he's a primary ball handler he knows he's going to be able to command more dollars in free agency. That's why Dragic forced a change. Afterwards he needs to fix his rep as to not be a labeled a whiner/non-team player so he can get that big paid day he was looking for.

Ding. Ding. Shocking isn't it? Dragic did this for business reasons? I guess it really is all about the money and the NBA is a business. That is some revelation bigfoot

Who cares about All-Star appearances? Its a total sham. A farcical popularity contest where over the hill hasbeen gimps like Kobe get voted in to because of their name brand recognition. Getting selected to an All-NBA team carries more weight given that its determined by a panel of actually knowledgeable broadcasters and sportswriters and not biased fanboys. But yes although Dragic make the Third Team I think that primarily due to his astronomical usage rate when he given the free reigns to play with reckless abandon without having to accomodate for Bledsoe or anyone else for that matter. He did admirably put the team on his back but he was in that position because we had no other alternative. Given by his prior track record it was probably fools gold and a irreplicable outlier in an otherwise unremarkable career.

TeamTragic · Post #65 » by **TeamTragic** » Tue Aug 18, 2015 12:12 am

saintEscaton wrote:
GoranTragic wrote:
Frank Lee wrote:Dude...you talk in circles... Dragic's play fell off... so he complained... but he wouldn't have complained IF his play remained as productive as the prior yr... yet he played PG the prior yr... then was moved to SG/SF and his production and involvement dropped off.

So he complained.

Dragic's fault ?

Granted, he went public..but he felt forced to...force a change. Chicken and Egg it all you want.... And at the end of the day, the professional basketballer apologized... meanwhile the professional executive(s) threw a fit.

I highlighted the only part that matters in your above response: IF

If Dragic was voted to the All-Star Team then I have no doubt that the SUNS keep him. I guess then that means the fans are really to blame right? Chicken meet egg

bigfoot wrote:
Come on now Frank ... Dragic, his agent, and his little brother aren't stupid and I'm sure they all circle-jerked about Goran not running the show ... "lowering" his free agent value. Dragic whined because if he's a primary ball handler he knows he's going to be able to command more dollars in free agency. That's why Dragic forced a change. Afterwards he needs to fix his rep as to not be a labeled a whiner/non-team player so he can get that big paid day he was looking for.

Ding. Ding. Shocking isn't it? Dragic did this for business reasons? I guess it really is all about the money and the NBA is a business. That is some revelation bigfoot

Who cares about All-Star appearances? Its a total sham. A farcical popularity contest where over the hill hasbeen gimps like Kobe get voted in to because of their name brand recognition. Getting selected to an All-NBA team carries more vote given that its determined by a panel of actually knowledgeable broadcasters and sportswriters and not biased fanboys. But yes although Dragic make the Third Team I think that primarily due to his astronomical usage rate when he given the free reigns to play with reckless abandon without having to accomodate for Bledsoe or anyone else for that matter. He did admirbly put the team on his back but he was in that position because we had no other alternative. Given by his prior track record it was probably fools gold and a irreplicable outlier in an otherwise unremarkable career.

I definitely agree but the NBA is about $$$$$. Dragic wanted to make the All-Star Game so that he could go to the front office and say "hey I'm an All-Star - pay me my money". Thankfully the SUNS said no way and he went to a desperate team that couldn't sign anyone else (see Lakers/Knicks) thus severely overpaying for him.

Maybe I'm wrong and he becomes an MVP candidate next season. Miami didn't really have a choice. Who else did they sign in the off-season? Amare/Green? :lol:

Frank Lee · Post #66 » by **Frank Lee** » Tue Aug 18, 2015 3:20 am

Thanks for filling us in on his true intentions.... I was wondering when that story was going to break. :noway:

Accountability is coming, credit or blame.

enigmatics · Post #67 » by **enigmatics** » Tue Aug 18, 2015 3:21 am

Shaming Dragic for having an off-season when he was forced to play out of position most of the time ...... SRSLY? :lol:

The internet's stupidity has not chill.

Frank Lee · Post #68 » by **Frank Lee** » Tue Aug 18, 2015 3:49 am

GoranTragic wrote:I highlighted the only part that matters in your above response: IF

You did read NavLo's post no ? I was paraphrasing him.

Nice shot... care to ask questions later?

AtheJ415 · Post #69 » by **AtheJ415** » Tue Aug 18, 2015 6:05 am

We haven't fired this thread yet?

thamadkant · Post #70 » by **thamadkant** » Tue Aug 18, 2015 9:35 am

I believe Sarver is influencing McD's vision and direction.

What we see is a compromised situation.

I believe Sarver wants to CONTEND for the playoffs ASAP. McD wants to stock pile assets and build a long term solution instead of a short term one.

But Sarver wants to sneak in to the playoffs with a young team... Without a true superstar to build around. In which case McD has an uphill battle this time with skates on.

Suns are CON-BUILDING. They are trying to make the playoffs (develop or sign a player on the brink of becomming a star, sign/trade (picks) for a star) but at the same time fill the team with high upside 23 and under players on rookie or cheap contracts.... And trade for other assets.

Much more difficult than the tanking teams and teams pushing for a ring at all cost.

Post #71 » by **batsmasher** » Tue Aug 18, 2015 9:49 am

AtheJ415 wrote:We haven't fired this thread yet?

You're fired for suggesting something so outrageous.

MrMiyagi · Post #72 » by **MrMiyagi** » Tue Aug 18, 2015 11:27 am

AtheJ415 wrote:We haven't fired this thread yet?

Let's just sell the team to a Seattle ownership group, then we'd have no problems to worry about. :-?

NavLDO · Post #73 » by **NavLDO** » Tue Aug 18, 2015 1:17 pm

Frank Lee wrote:
GoranTragic wrote:I highlighted the only part that matters in your above response: IF

You did read NavLo's post no ? I was paraphrasing him.

Nice shot... care to ask questions later?

Why do you keep calling me "NavLo"? It's NavLDO. Or is that some sort of insult like your "McDuh"?

[quote="Frank Lee"]Dude...you talk in circles... Dragic's play fell off... so he complained... but he wouldn't have complained if his play remained as productive as the prior yr... yet he played PG the prior yr... then was moved to SG/SF and his production and involvement dropped off.

So he complained.

Dragic's fault ?

Granted, he went public..but he felt forced to...force a change. Chicken and Egg it all you want.... And at the end of the day, the professional basketballer apologized... meanwhile the professional executive(s) threw a fit.[quote="Frank Lee"]

I understand that he was asked to play more of a SG position than PG position, but again, complain privately. Request a meeting with the FO and plead your case there, not to a reporter. It's not hard. And apologizing after the fact? Well, I do give him credit for that, but the damage was done, and that apology came WAY after the event, so I do question his agenda, there.

If I have a beef with my supervisor, I'm going to discuss privately. If he makes promises, and doesn't keep them, then meet again and ask why, then respectfully a trade. But even then, had he waited until AFTER the trade deadline, and AFTER IT was traded, he'd likely still be here. If not, then he'll have FA to fall back on, and be viewed as a professional, and would still get his pay day--it's not like NBA GMs are stupid. He could easily point to his decreased output as being a reflection of being asked to play out of position.

m1chal · Post #74 » by **m1chal** » Tue Aug 18, 2015 1:21 pm

If someone feels a need to create a thread like this why not include a poll? It would give a clear view about what posters think.
And no, McD's made some mistakes, but between his relative inexperience and Sarver's demands he has done a pretty good job. If it all does pan out, that is. And it's a huge IF.
Ask again in a season or two.

Frank Lee · Post #75 » by **Frank Lee** » Tue Aug 18, 2015 2:13 pm

Perhaps the thread should be retitled so it doesn't irk the believers.

Like ...... 'Is the McDon close to being McDone' or 'Ryan may be cryin after these moves?'

History says Sarver is not reluctant to make changes. And I agree that Bobby's desire for playoffs may be restricting the over all rebuild plan. The dealing for Knight/departure of Dragic, Thomas, and LA pick are the kind of moves, if they blow up, that get GMs in trouble. For McDuh's (and our's) sake, a good season is needed to avoid doubt in his ability/plan. He has had to hit some curveballs lately. Hope he has more than warning track power.

Sorry Nav... no insult intended. Surely you know I could come up with something better if so. 8-)

rottenbanana36 · Post #76 » by **rottenbanana36** » Wed Aug 19, 2015 5:53 pm

McD should not be fired. This team was in shambles when he took it over and it's at the very minimum showing progress. I do think he mishandles the player relationship aspect of his job. Trust me, I can't stand Markieff and think he's a petulant child but at the end of the day him on the team and happy makes us a better team than not. A phone call from your GM apprising Kieff of the situation with Marcus would have been appropriate given that you were fully aware of how important playing with his brother was. Now I don't believe that a phone call would have just magically made the situation all gravy for Kieff but at least it's a step in the right direction. McD seems to do a really great job with the initial pitch and then fails to continue to do the back-end work that's required to keep players happy. Case and point IT. Great pitch about feeling wanted and then it falls apart. The rhetoric has been consistent when players first join, they make me feel wanted but it seems to fall apart somewhere in the middle leading to chaos.

3rdside · Post #77 » by **3rdside** » Wed Aug 19, 2015 6:30 pm

letsgosuns wrote:
Right now, on paper, the Suns have the best center combination in franchise history, not even close. Never have they had a premier 7'1" defensive center in franchise history like Chandler, or an up and coming 7'1" center with legitimate offensive skills like Len. So right there McDonough has taken care of a major hole that has been on the Suns for almost 50 years. The funny thing is that the Suns organization is known for great power forwards and terrible centers. .

Oh the irony that last year was the first year real small ball actually won something.

You do realise dragic garnered 3 outright first place MvP votes right? And that with Frye as a starter we had our best season by a mile in years?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

3rdside · Post #78 » by **3rdside** » Wed Aug 19, 2015 6:34 pm

*not saying letting frye go for 8m was a bad move but...Anthony freaking Tolliver?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Damkac · Post #79 » by **Damkac** » Wed Aug 19, 2015 8:05 pm

jcsunsfan wrote:
Damkac wrote:McD has done many great moves and 2 main mistakes:
- signing Thomas
-resigning Marcus (and Markieff?)

Hindsight. Both of them universally praised moves at the time. Not just praised, praised highly by suns fans and press alike. IT was called by many the steal of the free agency period. But having 3 starter pg's was going to be a problem. I do think they thought that Bledsoe was a goner.

In fact, getting the Morrii locked up like he did is STILL a good move. Markieff has more value now than if he was a rfa this summer. We would have let Marcus walk, instead we got a future second for him.

The only bad move was probably trading for Marcus (from Houston). But who could have known these two would act this way?

Mayby it's not McD who we should blame for last season but Rich Paul (if Bledsoe would sign immediately then we wouldn't have 3 starting caliber point guards) and Morris twins (if they wouldn't be thugs and idiots then we wouldn't have to trade them).

Post #80 » by **bwgood77** » Mon Dec 28, 2015 7:51 am

Made seemingly great draft picks but total makeup of roster has been deficient, despite some nice signings on value guys. Made a great effort at Aldridge but missed.

I'd keep him, and felt if he could just dump Kieff for a productive asset, we would stick in there, but he sticks around. I can understand holding out, but with Sarver's demands, it has only hurt the effort in getting to the playoffs.