Non-threadworthy MMA Rumors/Quotes/Tweets/Etc., Vol. 4

Jasen777 · Post #1321 » by **Jasen777** » Wed Jun 7, 2017 5:58 pm

Regardless about the specifics of DJ's case, it's clear fighter discontent is at crazy levels (yet they won't do anything useful like form an actual association). The UFC's old way of handling fighters is breaking down.

Nemesis21 · Post #1322 » by **Nemesis21** » Wed Jun 7, 2017 10:13 pm

I don't understand why he won't take that fight. Leaving how fighters are treated to the side a minute.

He's cleaned out the 125 division, why wait on up and coming challengers to earn a shot? If you want to be remembered as the greatest or one of the greatest, you fight the best. I would like to see MM at 135. I'm confident he could beat Lineker, Assuncao, Moraes, Dillashaw, already beat Dodson, and maybe could beat Cruz(would avenge a loss), Garbrandt.

Susan · Post #1323 » by **Susan** » Wed Jun 7, 2017 11:31 pm

Nemesis21 wrote:I don't understand why he won't take that fight. Leaving how fighters are treated to the side a minute.

He's cleaned out the 125 division, why wait on up and coming challengers to earn a shot? If you want to be remembered as the greatest or one of the greatest, you fight the best. I would like to see MM at 135. I'm confident he could beat Lineker, Assuncao, Moraes, Dillashaw, already beat Dodson, and maybe could beat Cruz(would avenge a loss), Garbrandt.

They can't say him vs Cody isn't a thing for stupid reasons then demand him to fight Borg then try and switch it up to have him fight Cody for pretty much the same reason he was vying for Cody for.

The UFC brass is talking out both sides of their mouth and DJ should be afforded the chance to actually prepare for an opponent and push his own agenda as much as possible. He's gotten nowhere pushing the UFCs agenda despite dominating his division more than pretty much anybody else ever.

Nemesis21 · Post #1324 » by **Nemesis21** » Wed Jun 7, 2017 11:36 pm

Susan wrote:
Nemesis21 wrote:I don't understand why he won't take that fight. Leaving how fighters are treated to the side a minute.

He's cleaned out the 125 division, why wait on up and coming challengers to earn a shot? If you want to be remembered as the greatest or one of the greatest, you fight the best. I would like to see MM at 135. I'm confident he could beat Lineker, Assuncao, Moraes, Dillashaw, already beat Dodson, and maybe could beat Cruz(would avenge a loss), Garbrandt.

They can't say him vs Cody isn't a thing for stupid reasons then demand him to fight Borg then try and switch it up to have him fight Cody for pretty much the same reason he was vying for Cody for.

The UFC brass is talking out both sides of their mouth and DJ should be afforded the chance to actually prepare for an opponent and push his own agenda as much as possible. He's gotten nowhere pushing the UFCs agenda despite dominating his division more than pretty much anybody else ever.

I'm saying thought, putting fighter treatment aside. I don't see a reason for him to stay at 125.

Jasen777 · Post #1325 » by **Jasen777** » Wed Jun 7, 2017 11:46 pm

Nemesis21 wrote: I don't see a reason for him to stay at 125.

Because that's his weight class? No run lasts forever. Anyways, he was looking for a champ vs. champ fight, so he's not necessarily opposed to moving up.

Nemesis21 · Post #1326 » by **Nemesis21** » Thu Jun 8, 2017 12:35 am

Jasen777 wrote:
Nemesis21 wrote: I don't see a reason for him to stay at 125.

Because that's his weight class? No run lasts forever. Anyways, he was looking for a champ vs. champ fight, so he's not necessarily opposed to moving up.

But there are no matchups anymore at 125, tons for him at 135.

High 5 · Post #1327 » by **High 5** » Thu Jun 8, 2017 2:08 pm

He said he wants to break the title defense record at 125 and then move up.

Post #1328 » by **Headliner** » Thu Jun 8, 2017 7:40 pm

Cormier publicly voicing what many of us were suggesting last Bones fight:

“You hear guys like Alexander Gustafsson now saying he believes Jon was enhanced throughout his career,” Cormier said (h/t BloodyElbow.com). “But before, we had no sanctioning body like USADA. USADA, now, is on top of all that.”

“I do believe that we will see a different fighter in Anaheim, because I do believe he has to be clean this time. Otherwise, he’ll be caught. And that’s why he got caught last time. I think he fought Ovince Saint Preux clean, and didn’t like the way he felt, and tried to do something again dirty, and got caught at UFC 200.”

GetBuLLish · Post #1329 » by **GetBuLLish** » Sat Jun 10, 2017 4:28 pm

I know I'm in the minority of people who don't reflexively side against the UFC on every issue, but I always cackle at the idea that the UFC isn't promoting certain fighters enough. As if they know that a fighter could become a huge star but they intentionally choose not to market him and therefore deprive themselves of more money. As if the UFC can just create stars out of nowhere through promotion.

DJ is a great example. They have tried to promote him. He just doesn't sell. He's too small, too uninteresting, and has not had rivals to lift his reputation.

But sure, let's blame the evil UFC.

Jasen777 · Post #1330 » by **Jasen777** » Sat Jun 10, 2017 5:50 pm

GetBuLLish wrote:I know I'm in the minority of people who don't reflexively side against the UFC on every issue, but I always cackle at the idea that the UFC isn't promoting certain fighters enough. As if they know that a fighter could become a huge star but they intentionally choose not to market him and therefore deprive themselves of more money. As if the UFC can just create stars out of nowhere through promotion.

DJ is a great example. They have tried to promote him. He just doesn't sell. He's too small, too uninteresting, and has not had rivals to lift his reputation.

But sure, let's blame the evil UFC.

I don't see that as the issue here. The issue is a lack of respect in their strong arming of their own fighters. For instance, smearing DJ for not fighting who they want him to (which as an independent contractor is totally his right) when they already had an agreement to fight someone else.

Maybe they can't make DJ a star (thought the Reebok deal ruining his X-Box sponsorship didn't help). It doesn't help that they've ignored the whole division, burying title eliminators and fights between top 10 guys on the prelims of fight night cards.

What I don't get is the reflexive comment by so many that the fighters should promote themselves. UFC is literally the promoter, promotion is the UFC's job. If they can't promote the best fighter in the sport, that doesn't speak well for them.

High 5 · Post #1331 » by **High 5** » Sun Jun 11, 2017 12:25 am

The UFC could absolutely do a better job promoting DJ, but 125 needs an injection of promotable talent other than DJ for it to amount to anything. Even then it might be too late to salvage the division.

REDDzone · Post #1332 » by **REDDzone** » Mon Jun 12, 2017 1:23 pm

GetBuLLish wrote:I know I'm in the minority of people who don't reflexively side against the UFC on every issue, but I always cackle at the idea that the UFC isn't promoting certain fighters enough. As if they know that a fighter could become a huge star but they intentionally choose not to market him and therefore deprive themselves of more money. As if the UFC can just create stars out of nowhere through promotion.

DJ is a great example. They have tried to promote him. He just doesn't sell. He's too small, too uninteresting, and has not had rivals to lift his reputation.

But sure, let's blame the evil UFC.

Okay fine. I don't agree with this but I see where you are coming from. But where do you come out on all the other stuff:

Do you think its reasonable for them to change his fight on him without telling him? Or should they at least let him know so he doesn't find out after everyone else?

Do you think its reasonable for the UFC to try to strong arm him by threatening to shut down his division if he doesn't fight TJ?

Do you think its reasonable that the reasoning they allegedly gave him for putting him vs TJ together is because it would be best for TJ's career?

Do you think its reasonable that they told him that they would put Borg on the same card so that if TJ didn't make weight, he would switch opponents on 24 hour notice?

REDDzone · Post #1333 » by **REDDzone** » Mon Jun 12, 2017 1:25 pm

Also, unless I'm misremembering, DJ's complaint was that the UFC doesn't market the division itself and that seems obvious to me.

Post #1334 » by **Headliner** » Mon Jun 12, 2017 4:35 pm

I wonder if they will seriously consider dropping the 125 division?
With all these interm titles, it would be a good time to reshape the divisions.

REDDzone · Post #1335 » by **REDDzone** » Mon Jun 12, 2017 4:50 pm

Headliner wrote:I wonder if they will seriously consider dropping the 125 division?
With all these interm titles, it would be a good time to reshape the divisions.

Dana said they have been considering it for three years.

GetBuLLish · Post #1336 » by **GetBuLLish** » Mon Jun 12, 2017 10:07 pm

REDDzone wrote:Okay fine. I don't agree with this but I see where you are coming from. But where do you come out on all the other stuff:

Before getting into your list of questions, let me make the general point that the UFC does screw up at times. The worst case by far being the monumentally disastrous Reebok deal. Also, the UFC creates a lot of problems due to their terrible communication methods, or lack thereof.

Do you think its reasonable for them to change his fight on him without telling him? Or should they at least let him know so he doesn't find out after everyone else?

I'm not exactly sure what you're referring to, but no that would not be reasonable. And like I said above, if this happened, it's due to the UFC's poor communication skills.

Do you think its reasonable for the UFC to try to strong arm him by threatening to shut down his division if he doesn't fight TJ?

I personally find it distasteful, if it did happen. But it goes to show how terrible the division is that the UFC would put this on the table, even if they were bluffing.

Do you think its reasonable that the reasoning they allegedly gave him for putting him vs TJ together is because it would be best for TJ's career?

I highly, highly doubt they told him this. I'd guess that they said it would be a good fight for both of their careers.

Do you think its reasonable that they told him that they would put Borg on the same card so that if TJ didn't make weight, he would switch opponents on 24 hour notice?

I think this is reasonable if it's something that DJ could reject. But, again, DJ has limited bargaining power in this situation, so he might have to accept some stuff that he doesn't necessarily like. Anyways, this one doesn't seem all that egregious to me.

GetBuLLish · Post #1337 » by **GetBuLLish** » Mon Jun 12, 2017 10:10 pm

Jasen777 wrote:I don't see that as the issue here. The issue is a lack of respect in their strong arming of their own fighters. For instance, smearing DJ for not fighting who they want him to (which as an independent contractor is totally his right) when they already had an agreement to fight someone else.

That wasn't the point of my post.

Maybe they can't make DJ a star (thought the Reebok deal ruining his X-Box sponsorship didn't help). It doesn't help that they've ignored the whole division, burying title eliminators and fights between top 10 guys on the prelims of fight night cards.

What I don't get is the reflexive comment by so many that the fighters should promote themselves. UFC is literally the promoter, promotion is the UFC's job. If they can't promote the best fighter in the sport, that doesn't speak well for them.

This was more the point of my post. That it's the UFC's fault that DJ is not a star. It's not. DJ's not a star because no one gives a crap about him or his division. The UFC is a promoter, not a magician.

Cammo101 · Post #1338 » by **Cammo101** » Mon Jun 12, 2017 10:30 pm

The UFC has promoted DJ fine, they just haven't promoted anyone else in his division, so they can't sell any of his fights as interesting.

Post #1339 » by **Headliner** » Tue Jun 13, 2017 12:20 pm

The problem isn't even that they haven't promoted other fighters, it's that DJ has owned the belt since inception, and when you have a world beater at the top before the division is established, it's hard to create stars as he destroyed the other competition. The up and coming fighters can't even make names off beating past champions, as they don't exist like they do in the heavier divisions that have more turn around, or have been around longer.

Look at 135. That division was dominated by Cruz, and the only other value names are the ones created in his absence. TJ and Barao (though now his name is mud), and now Cody G because he's champ. The rest no one could care less about.

Same thing with 145. Aldo destroyed the division for years. Look at the draws in that division now, Edgar (former 155 champ), Pettis (former 155 champ), Halloway (Current champ). The rest no one really cares about.

If DJ wants money, he needs to take a year or two off so that the belt can circulate and create intrigue and a few new names, or he needs to accept former champions from heavier divisions that have established names and fight them.

REDDzone · Post #1340 » by **REDDzone** » Tue Jun 13, 2017 1:18 pm

Do you think its reasonable that they told him that they would put Borg on the same card so that if TJ didn't make weight, he would switch opponents on 24 hour notice?

I think this is reasonable if it's something that DJ could reject. But, again, DJ has limited bargaining power in this situation, so he might have to accept some stuff that he doesn't necessarily like. Anyways, this one doesn't seem all that egregious to me.

I mean of course he would have the ability to reject it, but could you even imagine the mud they would sling at DJ if he were to actually do so? Also no, its not reasonable to ask the best fighter in the world to switch his opponent the day before his fight imo. That wouldn't be reasonable for King of the Cage at this juncture. This isn't the wild west anymore.