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Could '13 draft re-establish centers as focal points in NBA?

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Post#31 Re: Could '13 draft re-establish centers as f
Sat Nov 10, 2012 4:07 am by RockwellTV

ManualRam wrote:yogi is a bad man. he might be tiny but he's jet quick and built like a fire hydrant. he's really skilled too. he doesn't have the greatest tools for a pg in his class, but he's the best frosh pg imo.


He wasn't like that 2 years ago. He looked like a 10 or 11 year old. Somebody probably told him if he wanted to make a name for himself at the higher levels he would have to get much stronger. He's built like a tiny LeBron now.
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Post#32 Re: Could '13 draft re-establish centers as f
Sat Nov 10, 2012 5:23 am by ManualRam

btw, steven adams STARTED for jamie dixon and looked great. dude is jacked (he already looks a good 250 lbs) with a very solid base and he's not afraid to throw his weight around. he did basically what was expected. controlled the paint on defense, worked the glass. took advantage of the few touches he got. showed some patience when he did get his touches. showed some good mobility on hedges. even flashed some court awareness, diving for an o-board going out of bounds and in one motion dishing it to a guy in the paint for an easy bucket.

this kid's rebounding area is massive and his hands are huge so it looks like he's plucking grapefruits. what i'd like to see him do more often going forward is to just straight go for the rebound. he's block out conscious, almost to a fault, kinda like meyers leonard. sometimes you just have to read the ball off the rim and go and get it, like what rodman and barkley used to do. boxing out is the fundamental thing to do, but if a player's apex is as high and their rebounding area is as wide, then he just needs to read it and go get it off the rim.
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Post#33 Re: Could '13 draft re-establish centers as f
Sat Nov 10, 2012 8:12 am by re49gb_2gho32fp

Dr Positivity wrote:Len also had a huge night. Could be an extremely prominent part of this draft


Watched the whole game for the most part, Len seemed to be playing amongst boys. The immediate comparison i would draw after one game is Jason Smith, playing hard on both ends with a solid little jumper. Didn't see much of a post-up game. Givony went to draw analogies with Valanciunas, something i pointed out a few weeks ago in a thread around here (FIBA u-18 champ., where they had comparable stats )
The Maryland guards were a bit too selfish at times and could've assisted Len for a few extra easy points, as well.
If a single game is any indicator, there is a significant class discrepancy between Len and Noel.
Noel looks to be years away from a contributing role in the NBA.

Also watched Pitsburgh roughly 10mins,
As big and dominant as Len was, Adams appeared even bigger. As ManualR perceptively noted, Adams covers a lot of ground. Didn't look that much slimmer than Drummond is quite frankly.
He ought to be featured a lot more in Pitt offense.

Withey did a nice job defensively, going by the stats.

Never thought college basketball would even remotely interest me to the point of watching, especially being overseas, but this year's center crop is too enticing and elusive.
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Post#34 Re: Could '13 draft re-establish centers as f
Sat Nov 10, 2012 8:41 am by princeofpalace

Andre has about 30lbs on Adams, Id imagine Adams is around 240-245, he's got a much better NBA body than his counterparts in this draft class but he's got nothing on Drummond. As athletic specimens, it really is not close between them at all. Look at Drummond legs and then go look at Adams'. Adams also looks lighter than Meyers Leonard as well.

Again, Adams is easily the best physical specimen out of Noel/Gobert/Zeller/Austin but he's certainly not anything extradinary as far as size is concerned. I think Drummond and even Leonard put the 2013 C's to shame as far as NBA bodies are concerned.
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Post#35 Re: Could '13 draft re-establish centers as f
Sat Nov 10, 2012 12:40 pm by ManualRam

princeofpalace wrote:Andre has about 30lbs on Adams, Id imagine Adams is around 240-245, he's got a much better NBA body than his counterparts in this draft class but he's got nothing on Drummond. As athletic specimens, it really is not close between them at all. Look at Drummond legs and then go look at Adams'. Adams also looks lighter than Meyers Leonard as well.

Again, Adams is easily the best physical specimen out of Noel/Gobert/Zeller/Austin but he's certainly not anything extradinary as far as size is concerned. I think Drummond and even Leonard put the 2013 C's to shame as far as NBA bodies are concerned.


adams doesn't have drummond's overall bulk, but he too has a strong lower body and at the same age has a more defined, stronger upperbody. the natural lower body strength is what both he and drummond have over a kid like leonard. he's working with a stronger base than leonard, who had to hit the weight room hard to get to where he's at physically. it's like adams already had a year of college weight training under his belt, but in reality has only just started lifting for real. adams just looks like a guy with natural body strength, which if you're familiar with his family history isn't a surprise.
his starting point is better than leonard's, but he's not quite drummond as a physical specimen. this is him this summer before he hit a college weight room.

Image
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Post#36 Re: Could '13 draft re-establish centers as f
Sat Nov 10, 2012 12:41 pm by Geaux_Hawks

re49gb_2gho32fp wrote:
Dr Positivity wrote:Len also had a huge night. Could be an extremely prominent part of this draft


Watched the whole game for the most part, Len seemed to be playing amongst boys. The immediate comparison i would draw after one game is Jason Smith, playing hard on both ends with a solid little jumper. Didn't see much of a post-up game. Givony went to draw analogies with Valanciunas, something i pointed out a few weeks ago in a thread around here (FIBA u-18 champ., where they had comparable stats )
The Maryland guards were a bit too selfish at times and could've assisted Len for a few extra easy points, as well.
If a single game is any indicator, there is a significant class discrepancy between Len and Noel.
Noel looks to be years away from a contributing role in the NBA.

Also watched Pitsburgh roughly 10mins,
As big and dominant as Len was, Adams appeared even bigger. As ManualR perceptively noted, Adams covers a lot of ground. Didn't look that much slimmer than Drummond is quite frankly.
He ought to be featured a lot more in Pitt offense.

Withey did a nice job defensively, going by the stats.

Never thought college basketball would even remotely interest me to the point of watching, especially being overseas, but this year's center crop is too enticing and elusive.


Yeah I'm quite excited as well. I really want to see Adams and Austin. I been on their wagons for about 2 years now. Adams is a top 5 pick in my mind.
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Post#37 Re: Could '13 draft re-establish centers as f
Sat Nov 10, 2012 1:15 pm by princeofpalace

That picture of Adams, i s nowhere near the ballpark of Drummond. Its not the Adams is not "quite' Drummond, he's not close. His arms look cut, but I don't see much of a base on him. Andre playing weight at Uconn was 290, no comparison. . Adams looks like a lean 245, which is good but its certainly not even close to freak status and thats all Im saying.

Also, this is a highschool picture of Leonard. Its not great, but one of the only ones that I could find. He was already jacked, true he doesn't have great lower body strength but its clear that he's built like an ox.

Image

In any case, I didn't know anything about Adams family history, but I found this youtube vid that I thought was interesting

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Post#38 Re: Could '13 draft re-establish centers as f
Sat Nov 10, 2012 2:20 pm by ManualRam

princeofpalace wrote:That picture of Adams, i s nowhere near the ballpark of Drummond. Its not the Adams is not "quite' Drummond, he's not close. His arms look cut, but I don't see much of a base on him. Andre playing weight at Uconn was 290, no comparison. . Adams looks like a lean 245, which is good but its certainly not even close to freak status and thats all Im saying.

Also, this is a highschool picture of Leonard. Its not great, but one of the only ones that I could find. He was already jacked, true he doesn't have great lower body strength but its clear that he's built like an ox.

Image

In any case, I didn't know anything about Adams family history, but I found this youtube vid that I thought was interesting



i'll just chalk the "not close" comment to homerism. he isn't "not close". adams is a very good physical specimen who will soon be getting credit for being the freak that he is. he comes from a huge family (18 kids) and all of them are big. his sister is a gold medal winning shot putter (and looks like this http://s1.reutersmedia.net/resources/r/ ... E8741AS400 ). none of his brothers were under 6'10 and none of his sisters were under 6'5. he's solid as a rock, has natural body strength and more importantly actually knows how to use it. it's not just about big a player is, but how big they play. adams plays big, setting huge, wide screens and moving bodies on the interior with purpose.

and i have to question that 290 for drummond, unless he wasn't in peak condition at uconn. he was listed at 265-270 in prep school, months before he reclassified and left for uconn. he has even lost weight to get in better condition in preparation for the NBA.

trust me. im an illini fan, so im familiar with meyers. he's always been a musclehead, but coming to illinois he had definition but not bulk. when he first stepped on campus he was around 220 as opposed to the 245-250 where adams is at right now. adams has a greater starting point, especially in the lower body. i can easily see him playing at ~265 at his peak without losing much mobility, especially since it looks like he just naturally packs on muscle.
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Post#39 Re: Could '13 draft re-establish centers as f
Sat Nov 10, 2012 2:29 pm by princeofpalace

It sounds like you arent familiar with Drummond at all.

This a tweet from Ford at the end of May
Chad Ford
Drummond has lost 22 pounds since ending the season. He's at 268 now. He's very quick laterally for a big guy. VERY QUICK


https://twitter.com/chadfordinsider/sta ... 0273861632[

He measured at 279 at the combine and that is after he reportedly lost weight.

http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Andre-Drummond-5772/

I agree that Adams can get to 260 but that is still 20lbs lighter than a rookie Andre Drummond, which I don't think you understand. Its not close unless you think being 20lbs lighter and considerably less athletic is the definition of "close" And thats only if Drummond doesn't get bigger, which is unlikely.

Steven Adams is no Andre Drummond and he's no freak. He's got very good size to be a C but lets not go overboard. If anyone is going to be charged with homerism, its you. Freshman Andre was significantly bigger than freshman Adams, while being significantly more athletic.
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Post#40 Re: Could '13 draft re-establish centers as f
Sat Nov 10, 2012 2:42 pm by EddieJonesFan

Adams looks to have a strong lower base, that gives him a huge advantage in the NBA at his height.
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Post#41 Re: Could '13 draft re-establish centers as f
Sat Nov 10, 2012 3:21 pm by ManualRam

princeofpalace wrote:It sounds like you arent familiar with Drummond at all.

This a tweet from Ford at the end of May
Chad Ford
Drummond has lost 22 pounds since ending the season. He's at 268 now. He's very quick laterally for a big guy. VERY QUICK


https://twitter.com/chadfordinsider/sta ... 0273861632[

He measured at 279 at the combine and that is after he reportedly lost weight.

http://www.draftexpress.com/profile/Andre-Drummond-5772/

I agree that Adams can get to 260 but that is still 20lbs lighter than a rookie Andre Drummond, which I don't think you understand. Its not close unless you think being 20lbs lighter and considerably less athletic is the definition of "close" And thats only if Drummond doesn't get bigger, which is unlikely.

Steven Adams is no Andre Drummond and he's no freak. He's got very good size to be a C but lets not go overboard. If anyone is going to be charged with homerism, its you. Freshman Andre was significantly bigger than freshman Adams, while being significantly more athletic.


i'm familiar. so drummond had to LOSE weight to get in better condition? what do you think drummond's peak weight is gonna be? over 300 lbs? and how does he use that weight? does he play physically by nature? does he set crushing screens? does he box out yet? does he even use his massive frame to establish and hold position? physical tools are as useful as they are if the player is naturally inclined to use them. this is a guy who had a 50+ lb weight advantage at times against other kids in college and still allowed himself to get pushed off the block and out of position.

i'd consider adams a better athlete than meyers leonard because of his better agility, lateral quicks, ability to change directions, quicker 2nd and 3rd jumps and lower body strength... and i consider meyers a freak as well. not only does adams have great physical tools for a center but he's also naturally inclined to use them.

i'll put it like this. put freshman adams on the floor with freshman drummond, ball comes off the rim in the paint and they're fighting for position for the board, i know who i'll put my money on to get the rebound.
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Post#42 Re: Could '13 draft re-establish centers as f
Mon Nov 12, 2012 6:50 pm by EddieJonesFan

Adams looks like he's going to be the best true center prospect in a while.
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