Why is Frank Kaminsky being so underrated?

bucephalus · Post #21 » by **bucephalus** » Wed Mar 4, 2015 3:04 am

Johnlac1 wrote:
bucephalus wrote:I think the key word is potential. Outside of his shooting, Kaminsky doesn't have the kind of elite physical tools that scouts are looking for. Could Kaminsky carve out a niche as a hot shooting big? Absolutely. Is it likely that he develops into an All-Star caliber player? I think most scouts and gms would say no. Meanwhile, bigs like Porzingis, WCS, and Turner are young and possess at least a few elite tools. It is likely that Kaminsky ends up with a better career than those three, but that's more about them not living up to their potential than it is his development.

Even if you can't project Frank as being a star (neither do I), if he shows improvement, like virtually all young players, he can very valuable. Olynyk is a decent comparison. Olynyk was also a player who looked like nothing his first two years in college. So the million dollar question is: how much can Frank still improve? That's if he can still improve. Defense is the obvious area where he'll have to improve, but if he still improves on offense, he can be more than just a solid player

I think all players who come into the NBA can improve and have to improve their games, if at least to just adjust to the pace of the NBA game. I think Kaminsky is smart enough that he can at least find a way to not be a minus on the defensive end, kind of like how Marc Gasol leveraged his basketball IQ to make up for his lack of speed.

Bernman · Post #22 » by **Bernman** » Wed Mar 4, 2015 4:14 am

The rebounding projections were dumb when in college they have a 35-second clock and UW is known to be one of the slowest paced offenses. Wisconsin is 14th in the nation in rebound rate with Kaminsky as their anchor. Could a team do the same or near it with Bargnani or that level of a rebounder as their center? I highly doubt that. Kaminsky isn't very strong, long, or much of a leaper, but he has good height, hands, and box out fundamentals. I really doubt rebounding will be a strength at the next level, but he shouldn't be one of the worst rebounders in the league either.

As far as not having the physical tools to be that great, he's got basically the same as Dirk when he won MVP and was a champion. That's not to say I think he'll be Dirk, or anywhere near that, I don't. But the physical tools aren't going to ultimately stop him if certain things like the 3-point and mid-range shot really translate well, and he has the will, and awareness to at least rebound and defend well enough. Like I said I don't think rebounding will ever be a strength, nor do I think defense will either. But that's not why you'd draft him. You'd do so primarily for his offensive tools, i.e.: shooting, dribbling, passing, post moves, touch, etc.

My real concerns about him are the lack of strength and maybe will on the next level. Because even in that Michigan State game when he was virtually dominating, I wanted him to set up on the block almost every time, but he had trouble carving out space. And will he get better relatively in the strength dept at the next level, or will his desire be better when he was quoted as saying before the season "NBA is boring"?

Dan Dakich was talking about Kaminsky today and he compared him to Laettner. That's probably the best one I've heard yet. Gasol is like a realistic best case. Both guys kind of known to be on the soft-side, but smart, honest in effort, and really skilled offensively, Gasol translating to a greater degree because he could get deep enough post position and stayed healthier. Worst case is Kaminsky washes out after a few years because he has below average desire and only the shooting translates as a real strength, but it's not even out to the 3-line in the NBA.

vital_signs · Post #23 » by **vital_signs** » Wed Mar 4, 2015 6:25 am

My guess is Wisconsin's history of producing NBA big men as one reason. Is he athletic enough? How much left to develop with age? He is a bench player at best.

god4gives · Post #24 » by **god4gives** » Wed Mar 4, 2015 10:16 am

Frank Kaminsky's defense >>> Okafor

:lol:

http://collegebasketballtalk.nbcsports.com/2015/03/03/player-of-the-year-power-rankings-its-frank-kaminskys-award-to-win/

2. Jahlil Okafor, Duke: The biggest reason why Jahlil Okafor has been replaced by Frank Kaminsky as the favorite to win the National Player of the Year award is that Okafor really struggles on the defensive end, and it’s those defensive issues that limit Duke’s upside as a national title contender. The issue is two-fold, as I explained here. Okafor is not great at defending screen-and-roll actions, which is something that will come with time, and he’s not a natural rim protector, which may actually be the bigger problem. Duke’s defense is built around extended man-to-man pressure, which encourages offensive players to penetrate. The Blue Devils don’t have great perimeter defenders, which means that they really need a security blanket around the rim if they get beaten. Okafor, as good as he is, is not that:

sweetcity · Post #25 » by **sweetcity** » Wed Mar 4, 2015 1:50 pm

Reminds me of Keith van horn. I think frank will have a long productive nba career

Post #26 » by **Marcus** » Wed Mar 4, 2015 5:16 pm

sweetcity wrote:Reminds me of Keith van horn. I think frank will have a long productive nba career

where do you see Van Horn?

Johnlac1 · Post #27 » by **Johnlac1** » Wed Mar 4, 2015 6:17 pm

I l see Frank as another Olynyk. I guy who can step outside and hit threes but who can also put the ball on the floor and has sneaky moves around the basket. Like Kaminsky, Olynyk was also another ballhandling guard at an early age before a major growth spurt. And like Olynyk, Kaminsky can probably play the four and the five depending on the matchup.

Post #28 » by **Marcus** » Wed Mar 4, 2015 8:04 pm

god4gives wrote:Frank Kaminsky's defense >>> Okafor

http://collegebasketballtalk.nbcsports.com/2015/03/03/player-of-the-year-power-rankings-its-frank-kaminskys-award-to-win/

2. Jahlil Okafor, Duke: The biggest reason why Jahlil Okafor has been replaced by Frank Kaminsky as the favorite to win the National Player of the Year award is that Okafor really struggles on the defensive end, and it’s those defensive issues that limit Duke’s upside as a national title contender. The issue is two-fold, as I explained here. Okafor is not great at defending screen-and-roll actions, which is something that will come with time, and he’s not a natural rim protector, which may actually be the bigger problem. Duke’s defense is built around extended man-to-man pressure, which encourages offensive players to penetrate. The Blue Devils don’t have great perimeter defenders, which means that they really need a security blanket around the rim if they get beaten. Okafor, as good as he is, is not that:

how pissed are you going to be when/if the Knicks get Okafor?

reanimator · Post #29 » by **reanimator** » Wed Mar 4, 2015 8:10 pm

Nice rotation offensive big but I don't see him as a starter. I'm not taking him lottery and have him on the low end of that 15-20 range.

reignfire · Post #30 » by **reignfire** » Wed Mar 4, 2015 11:36 pm

bucephalus wrote:
Johnlac1 wrote:
bucephalus wrote:I think the key word is potential. Outside of his shooting, Kaminsky doesn't have the kind of elite physical tools that scouts are looking for. Could Kaminsky carve out a niche as a hot shooting big? Absolutely. Is it likely that he develops into an All-Star caliber player? I think most scouts and gms would say no. Meanwhile, bigs like Porzingis, WCS, and Turner are young and possess at least a few elite tools. It is likely that Kaminsky ends up with a better career than those three, but that's more about them not living up to their potential than it is his development.

Even if you can't project Frank as being a star (neither do I), if he shows improvement, like virtually all young players, he can very valuable. Olynyk is a decent comparison. Olynyk was also a player who looked like nothing his first two years in college. So the million dollar question is: how much can Frank still improve? That's if he can still improve. Defense is the obvious area where he'll have to improve, but if he still improves on offense, he can be more than just a solid player

I think all players who come into the NBA can improve and have to improve their games, if at least to just adjust to the pace of the NBA game. I think Kaminsky is smart enough that he can at least find a way to not be a minus on the defensive end, kind of like how Marc Gasol leveraged his basketball IQ to make up for his lack of speed.

Marc Gasol isn't slow. He has quick feet, better than a lot of big men in the NBA. Both the Gasol brothers are extremely underrated as athletes. There's no shortcut to being a good NBA players. You gotta have it all.

jpengland · Post #31 » by **jpengland** » Thu Mar 5, 2015 8:47 am

He's going to be a very good player in the right system, and will struggle on other teams.

If a Spurs/Hawks/Mavs can draft him, he could step right in and be productive. He's an intelligent player, very good passer, great form on his shot and can put the ball on the floor. He's certainly not a particulary good defensive player, but he is smart enough that he will never be too detrimental on that end of the floor and I would imagine will become 'average'.

It's all about fit with a player like Kaminsky.

Post #32 » by **Diop** » Thu Mar 5, 2015 11:13 am

god4gives wrote:Frank Kaminsky's defense >>> Okafor

http://collegebasketballtalk.nbcsports.com/2015/03/03/player-of-the-year-power-rankings-its-frank-kaminskys-award-to-win/

2. Jahlil Okafor, Duke: The biggest reason why Jahlil Okafor has been replaced by Frank Kaminsky as the favorite to win the National Player of the Year award is that Okafor really struggles on the defensive end, and it’s those defensive issues that limit Duke’s upside as a national title contender. The issue is two-fold, as I explained here. Okafor is not great at defending screen-and-roll actions, which is something that will come with time, and he’s not a natural rim protector, which may actually be the bigger problem. Duke’s defense is built around extended man-to-man pressure, which encourages offensive players to penetrate. The Blue Devils don’t have great perimeter defenders, which means that they really need a security blanket around the rim if they get beaten. Okafor, as good as he is, is not that:

christ he reminds me so much of Al Jefferson its scary. knowing our luck this will be the year the hornets win the lottery :roll:

NBA Moses · Post #33 » by **NBA Moses** » Thu Mar 5, 2015 6:32 pm

Frank The Tank Kaminsky dominated last years NCAA Tournament, outclassing #4 pick Aaron Gordon in the elite 8 and Randall in the Final 4 despite losing to Kentucky(Harrison Twins) .

Hes most likely going to win College Player of Year 2015 and he should go #6 after Towns,Okafor,Herzonja,Russell,Mudiay.

10 years from now nba fans may be looking at Frank The Tank in the way todays fan look at Dirk Nowitzki. A franchise player and future hall of famer. Hes no Kelly Olyniak.

Johnlac1 · Post #34 » by **Johnlac1** » Thu Mar 5, 2015 6:48 pm

NBA Moses wrote:Frank The Tank Kaminsky dominated last years NCAA Tournament, outclassing #4 pick Aaron Gordon in the elite 8 and Randall in the Final 4 despite losing to Kentucky(Harrison Twins) .

Hes most likely going to win College Player of Year 2015 and he should go #6 after Towns,Okafor,Herzonja,Russell,Mudiay.

10 years from now nba fans may be looking at Frank The Tank in the way todays fan look at Dirk Nowitzki. A franchise player and future hall of famer. Hes no Kelly Olyniak.

Well, as a huge Badger fan I'd like to see that happen. But although I think Frank can have nice pro career, I don't see him as the next Dirk. However, as I've mentioned previously, if you told Badger fans two years ago that as a senior Frank would be vying for POY, we'd all have fallen down laughing at the prospect.

Justwar · Post #35 » by **Justwar** » Fri Mar 6, 2015 12:04 am

He wasn't good vs kentucky

Post #36 » by **Marcus** » Fri Mar 6, 2015 12:05 am

Justwar wrote:He wasn't good vs kentucky

they played UK this year?

Justwar · Post #37 » by **Justwar** » Fri Mar 6, 2015 12:32 am

Nba moses posted about last tournament

Bernman · Post #38 » by **Bernman** » Fri Mar 6, 2015 12:52 am

Justwar wrote:He wasn't good vs kentucky

The world doesn't revolve around you. It was one game, and anyway they double-teamed him. That's why the Badgers still scored 73, largely playing 4 on 3.

Move on. He's not defined by that performance. He played well against Okafor. Well against Isaiah Austin. He owned Tarczewski. In spite of a concussion, he was solid vs. Hammons. He was great against Payne. They'll be in the NBA too, you know. It's not all Kentucky Wildcats.

MotownMadness · Post #39 » by **MotownMadness** » Fri Mar 6, 2015 4:43 am

25pts, 6rebs, 7ast, 2stls, 1blk shooting 2-4 from 3 and 10-15 overrall. I'm telling you guys, this guy is just a flat out ball player and so dynamic of a big. Teams are going to be reaching for players that have high potential but far less stats as always in the top 10 and Frank the Tank is going to come into the league contributing very well for some team picking in the late lottery. He's putting up huge games like this damn near everytime I check the box scores and he's got Wisconsin as a serious contender.

Justwar · Post #40 » by **Justwar** » Fri Mar 6, 2015 6:15 am

Bernman wrote:
Justwar wrote:He wasn't good vs kentucky

The world doesn't revolve around you. It was one game, and anyway they double-teamed him. That's why the Badgers still scored 73, largely playing 4 on 3.

Move on. He's not defined by that performance. He played well against Okafor. Well against Isaiah Austin. He owned Tarczewski. In spite of a concussion, he was solid vs. Hammons. He was great against Payne. They'll be in the NBA too, you know. It's not all Kentucky Wildcats.

relax I was commenting on his statement on frank vs UK last year