Page 3 of 4
Re: ESPN: Should VC, T-Mac, A.I., Hill & Sheed Be In The H.O
Posted: Fri Dec 14, 2012 5:29 am
by simple_jack
T.Mac, A.I., and VC have ruined their legacies so much while Kobe is still in the League playing with the best of them.
Thats how you know who really works hard in the off season.
I would still put VC in the HOF just because you can't ignore that type of talent.
T.Mac and A.I playing in China kind of tarnishes their reputation.
Re: ESPN: Should VC, T-Mac, A.I., Hill & Sheed Be In The H.O
Posted: Fri Dec 14, 2012 5:35 am
by dTox
UN-Owen wrote:I only have one issue with Carter being elected
The laziest defensive player I've ever seen shouldn't be in the Hall of Fame
lol wut? Vince was a pretty damn good defender during his good days, he's a lazy oaf when he knows his teams aren't going anywhere (which is not a defense case for him in anyway) but to call him one of the laziest defenders is not warranted.
Re: ESPN: Should VC, T-Mac, A.I., Hill & Sheed Be In The H.O
Posted: Fri Dec 14, 2012 5:42 am
by taimaishu
simple_jack wrote:T.Mac, A.I., and VC have ruined their legacies so much while Kobe is still in the League playing with the best of them.
Thats how you know who really works hard in the off season.
I would still put VC in the HOF just because you can't ignore that type of talent.
T.Mac and A.I playing in China kind of tarnishes their reputation.
Not to be a cheerleader but VC is older than both Kobe and T-Mac and is still putting up 12.5 points per game in 23 minutes with an above average PER. He is one of the top 5 6th men in the NBA and a darkhorse candidate for 6th man of the year. I don't think he's 'ruined' his legacy at all.....
Re: ESPN: Should VC, T-Mac, A.I., Hill & Sheed Be In The H.O
Posted: Fri Dec 14, 2012 5:44 am
by joseph mamah
Iversons a no brainer imo. I dont think the rest of those guys belong in the NBA Hall of Fame, but unless im mistaken its the Basketball Hall of Fame, in which case Hill and Carter should probably be in. Hill based mostly on his college career and VC because of the whole Vincanity craze, and a long relatively successful NBA career.
TMac was a great player, but I dont think he belongs in the HOF, he has no college to fall back on and he had a short NBA peak without much playoff success.
I love Sheed, and if the guy would have had Kobes mentality hed probably be in the discussion for GOAT PF, but he didnt do enough during his NBA or college careers to really have a case.
Re: ESPN: Should VC, T-Mac, A.I., Hill & Sheed Be In The H.O
Posted: Fri Dec 14, 2012 6:05 am
by Scase
lobosloboslobos wrote:Mattd97 wrote:when looking at their actual achievements its hilarious that more of them think VC makes it than tmac
This and it's not even close.
TMac
7× NBA All-Star (2001–2007)
NBA Most Improved Player (2001)
2× NBA scoring champion (2003–2004)
2× All-NBA First Team (2002–2003)
3× All-NBA Second Team (2001, 2004, 2007)
2× All-NBA Third Team (2005, 2008)USA Today High School Player of the Year (1997)
VC
NBA Rookie of the Year (1999)
8× NBA All-Star (2000–2007)
All-NBA Second Team (2001)
All-NBA Third Team (2000)NBA All-Rookie First Team (1999)
NBA Slam Dunk Contest champion (2000)
Consensus NCAA All-American Second Team (1998)
People seem to be forgetting that this is the
BASKETBALL Hall of Fame not the NBA.
Leaving out Carters Olympic accolades is stupid.
Re: ESPN: Should VC, T-Mac, A.I., Hill & Sheed Be In The H.O
Posted: Fri Dec 14, 2012 6:08 am
by dTox
Scase wrote:lobosloboslobos wrote:Mattd97 wrote:when looking at their actual achievements its hilarious that more of them think VC makes it than tmac
This and it's not even close.
TMac
7× NBA All-Star (2001–2007)
NBA Most Improved Player (2001)
2× NBA scoring champion (2003–2004)
2× All-NBA First Team (2002–2003)
3× All-NBA Second Team (2001, 2004, 2007)
2× All-NBA Third Team (2005, 2008)USA Today High School Player of the Year (1997)
VC
NBA Rookie of the Year (1999)
8× NBA All-Star (2000–2007)
All-NBA Second Team (2001)
All-NBA Third Team (2000)NBA All-Rookie First Team (1999)
NBA Slam Dunk Contest champion (2000)
Consensus NCAA All-American Second Team (1998)
People seem to be forgetting that this is the
BASKETBALL Hall of Fame not the NBA.
Leaving out Carters Olympic accolades is stupid.
Also, Carter has single handily taken his team at least to the 2nd round, what the hell has Tmac ever done in the playoffs?
Re: ESPN: Should VC, T-Mac, A.I., Hill & Sheed Be In The H.O
Posted: Fri Dec 14, 2012 6:08 am
by D.Brasco
Hill will get in due to his college years and only AI out of the rest should get in. Come on people wanting VC in "cuz he was teh best dunker"?
Re: ESPN: Should VC, T-Mac, A.I., Hill & Sheed Be In The H.O
Posted: Fri Dec 14, 2012 6:28 am
by Boogie!
"Ethan Sherwood Strauss, HoopSpeak: Yes. He's the greatest dunker ever, and he happened to have a long, successful career doing a lot more than that. What went down in Toronto does not bother me. The guy didn't want to be stuck plying his trade in another country. I get it."
this part annoyed me a little bit. it's like he's saying "of course he should be in the hall of fame. he shouldn't be punished because he had to play his prime years in canada."
Re: ESPN: Should VC, T-Mac, A.I., Hill & Sheed Be In The H.O
Posted: Fri Dec 14, 2012 6:30 am
by Scase
Boogie! wrote:"Ethan Sherwood Strauss, HoopSpeak: Yes. He's the greatest dunker ever, and he happened to have a long, successful career doing a lot more than that. What went down in Toronto does not bother me. The guy didn't want to be stuck plying his trade in another country. I get it."
this part annoyed me a little bit. it's like he's saying "of course he should be in the hall of fame. he shouldn't be punished because he had to play his prime years in canada."
I read it more that he was saying Carter shouldn't have it held against him he was "stuck" in canada. Either way dick comment.
Re: ESPN: Should VC, T-Mac, A.I., Hill & Sheed Be In The H.O
Posted: Fri Dec 14, 2012 6:32 am
by UN-Owen
Joe Dumars is in the Hall with a career PER of 15.3 and a career high of 18
Richmond's career PER is 17.6 with peak seasons of 21.6, 20.4 and 19.2
I hate the idea that what separates a Hall of Famer and a non Hall of Famer is whether or not they were lucky enough to play with some other future Hall of Famers
Everyone mentioned in this thread had a significantly better prime than Dumars
Re: ESPN: Should VC, T-Mac, A.I., Hill & Sheed Be In The H.O
Posted: Fri Dec 14, 2012 6:41 am
by Raps in 4
ballislife wrote:VC for being the greatest dunker ever.
Iverson for being one of the best scorers ever.
TMac, Hill, and Sheed... I'm not so sure.
This.
Re: ESPN: Should VC, T-Mac, A.I., Hill & Sheed Be In The H.O
Posted: Fri Dec 14, 2012 7:17 am
by Troubadour
Allen Iverson should be a first-ballot hall of famer. Hill, no. Vince Carter, T-Mac, maybe. Sheed, eventually.
Re: ESPN: Should VC, T-Mac, A.I., Hill & Sheed Be In The H.O
Posted: Fri Dec 14, 2012 1:56 pm
by raptorscam
A.I. has no business in this discussion. Advanced metrics notwithstanding the guy was one of the top couple of players in the league for a decade. He might've been a me-first player who didn't always help his team but he's one of the best me-first players there has ever been.
Not sure any of the others belong although I've heard in the past that Sheed is a guy who other players in the league consider to be an underrated, incredible player. I kinda like his candidacy for the exact opposite reason from Iverson. Seems like an awesome teammate who was good at so many things that I'd like to see him in even if the numbers don't support it. My instinct is to say "hell no" with Vince but it is easy to forget how many good seasons he had in NJ. He's still a "no" for me but he's closer than I thought he was the first time I heard this suggested...
Re: ESPN: Should VC, T-Mac, A.I., Hill & Sheed Be In The H.O
Posted: Fri Dec 14, 2012 2:01 pm
by Raptors Aiya
Waylon Mercy wrote:1. Is Vince Carter a Hall of Famer?
Ethan Sherwood Strauss, HoopSpeak: The guy didn't want to be stuck plying his trade in another country. I get it.
AY YO WHO THE **** IS THIS???
VINCE DIDNT LEAVE CUZ HE DIDNT WANT TO PLAY IN ANOTHER COUNTRY. GET YO F**KIN FACTS STRAIGHT YA NARROW MINDED AMERICAN BITCH MADE A**HOLE
Sorry for the cussing, that line just made me mad.
i mean "I GET IT"???
U don't "GET" s**t!!
Re: ESPN: Should VC, T-Mac, A.I., Hill & Sheed Be In The H.O
Posted: Fri Dec 14, 2012 2:02 pm
by SDM
AI is a lock. I'm lukewarm on the others, I can go either way, except Sheed who is in the Hall of Very Good.
Re: ESPN: Should VC, T-Mac, A.I., Hill & Sheed Be In The H.O
Posted: Fri Dec 14, 2012 2:09 pm
by Raptors Aiya
Raptors Aiya wrote:Waylon Mercy wrote:1. Is Vince Carter a Hall of Famer?
Ethan Sherwood Strauss, HoopSpeak: The guy didn't want to be stuck plying his trade in another country. I get it.
Re: ESPN: Should VC, T-Mac, A.I., Hill & Sheed Be In The H.O
Posted: Fri Dec 14, 2012 2:10 pm
by Tommy Gun
dTox wrote:
Also, Carter has single handily taken his team at least to the 2nd round, what the hell has Tmac ever done in the playoffs?
LOL@ Carter single handedly taking his team to the 2nd round. Is that a joke?? Davis averaged 16/12 that series and Boogie was huge too. VC fans always try to re-write the history of that series. VC had a decent series - 23 PPG on 37% shooting with a few big games. But in now way did he single handedly win that series
The same supporting cast next year went on a huge run WITHOUT VC at the end of the year and pushed the Pistons to the last second of the series. VC had a very good supporting cast that was a perfect fit for his skills
Re: ESPN: Should VC, T-Mac, A.I., Hill & Sheed Be In The H.O
Posted: Fri Dec 14, 2012 2:14 pm
by Raptors Aiya
Waylon Mercy wrote:1. Is Vince Carter a Hall of Famer?
Ethan Sherwood Strauss, HoopSpeak: The guy didn't want to be stuck plying his trade in another country. I get it.
Re: ESPN: Should VC, T-Mac, A.I., Hill & Sheed Be In The H.O
Posted: Fri Dec 14, 2012 2:55 pm
by Homer Jay
taimaishu wrote:simple_jack wrote:T.Mac, A.I., and VC have ruined their legacies so much while Kobe is still in the League playing with the best of them.
Thats how you know who really works hard in the off season.
I would still put VC in the HOF just because you can't ignore that type of talent.
T.Mac and A.I playing in China kind of tarnishes their reputation.
Not to be a cheerleader but VC is older than both Kobe and T-Mac and is still putting up 12.5 points per game in 23 minutes with an above average PER. He is one of the top 5 6th men in the NBA and a darkhorse candidate for 6th man of the year. I don't think he's 'ruined' his legacy at all.....
Agreed. VC remade himself as a different player once his athleticism disappeared. That is something not a lot of players do. He's going to be 37 when this season is over, an age when most guys are retired, yet he still looks like he can play another 2-3 years. I never would have pegged him for that type of career. Most guys who rely on athleticism are done before 35.
Re: ESPN: Should VC, T-Mac, A.I., Hill & Sheed Be In The H.O
Posted: Fri Dec 14, 2012 3:30 pm
by bape_lovers
I say sheed...coz he actually helped his team to get the finals and only player there with a ring..