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OT: Espn - Drummond could rank as 'greatest teen' in NBA his

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Re: Connecticut Post: Andre Drummond seems a steal with 9th  

Post#286 » by Mr.Raptorsingh » Wed Jan 23, 2013 3:52 am

We win a championship at some point with a Valanciunas + Drummond 4/5 pairing imo.
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Re: Connecticut Post: Andre Drummond seems a steal with 9th  

Post#287 » by sauga_raptor » Wed Jan 23, 2013 3:54 am

I swear people post threads about Drummond on this board like he is a Raptor. It's getting kind of annoying.
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Re: Connecticut Post: Andre Drummond seems a steal with 9th  

Post#288 » by BC_IS_A_PLAYA » Wed Jan 23, 2013 3:56 am

Terrence Ross pick just pisses me off now cause DD was resigned. Personally, I don't see neither as a SF.

With that said, DRUMMOND SHOULD HAVE BEEN A RAPTOR INSTEAD!!!


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Re: Connecticut Post: Andre Drummond seems a steal with 9th 

Post#289 » by tecumseh18 » Wed Jan 23, 2013 4:09 am

Jack_Hardstrong wrote:... I lament every night not having Drummond.


TMI

Dr Positivity wrote:Yeah this place really needed another Drummond thread


Maybe not, but you can't have enough "BC is an idiot and should be fired" threads. You really can't.
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Re: Connecticut Post: Andre Drummond seems a steal with 9th 

Post#290 » by Throwback24 » Wed Jan 23, 2013 4:21 am

tecumseh18 wrote:
Jack_Hardstrong wrote:... I lament every night not having Drummond.


TMI

Dr Positivity wrote:Yeah this place really needed another Drummond thread


Maybe not, but you can't have enough "BC is an idiot and should be fired" threads. You really can't.


Agreed.
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Re: Connecticut Post: Andre Drummond seems a steal with 9th  

Post#291 » by Neutral 123 » Wed Jan 23, 2013 4:22 am

"We certainly recognized the extraordinary talent that Andre has," said Raptors G.M. Bryan Colangelo, "but the fit just wasn't right for our team given that we had previously drafted another young project big man in Jonas Valanciunas."


The arrogance and stupidity of this asswhole is mind numbing.
To them, it's like everyone wants the money they are never going to make. amluvinit2 on the tea party..
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Re: OT: Espn - Drummond could rank as 'greatest teen' in NBA 

Post#292 » by JunkYardSubs » Wed Jan 23, 2013 4:31 am

Shame Colangelo had to give this franchise one last kick in the nuts before he left. Oh well

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Re: Connecticut Post: Andre Drummond seems a steal with 9th 

Post#293 » by bballsparkin » Wed Jan 23, 2013 4:39 am

Neutral 123 wrote:
"We certainly recognized the extraordinary talent that Andre has," said Raptors G.M. Bryan Colangelo, "but the fit just wasn't right for our team given that we had previously drafted another young project big man in Jonas Valanciunas."


The arrogance and stupidity of this asswhole is mind numbing.


It is a bad quote. Seems like an oxymoron. Extraordinary talent and bad fit don't mix. I'm not going to sweat it. I've had my teams mess up picks so many times in my life. I don't have the energy to get upset any longer. But I never tire of watching an exec get fired. Especially suits hand picked by Stern.
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Re: OT: Espn - Drummond could rank as 'greatest teen' in NBA 

Post#294 » by david5773 » Wed Jan 23, 2013 4:40 am

Close this thread the drummond talk is getting old, get off his d***
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Re: Connecticut Post: Andre Drummond seems a steal with 9th 

Post#295 » by Neutral 123 » Wed Jan 23, 2013 4:46 am

bballsparkin wrote:
Neutral 123 wrote:
"We certainly recognized the extraordinary talent that Andre has," said Raptors G.M. Bryan Colangelo, "but the fit just wasn't right for our team given that we had previously drafted another young project big man in Jonas Valanciunas."


The arrogance and stupidity of this asswhole is mind numbing.


It is a bad quote. Seems like an oxymoron. Extraordinary talent and bad fit don't mix. I'm not going to sweat it. I've had my teams mess up picks so many times in my life. I don't have the energy to get upset any longer. But I never tire of watching an exec get fired. Especially suits hand picked by Stern.

I don't think it is. He's bragged about passing on a top 3 talent because he didn't have the right make up or whatever. BC is really this dumb and arrogant.
To them, it's like everyone wants the money they are never going to make. amluvinit2 on the tea party..
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Re: OT: Espn - Drummond could rank as 'greatest teen' in NBA 

Post#296 » by bballsparkin » Wed Jan 23, 2013 5:04 am

Ya, I'm agreeing with you. But I can see how you read it the other way. I meant it's foolish for BC to have said this. "Extraordinary talent" suggests something the Raptors could most definitely use. So in that sense how could he be a bad fit.

But then again BC thought Bargnani was an "extraordinary talent" and he was a bad fit. And rarely brought the talent on the floor consistently. Anyway, need to sleep so I'm out.
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Re: OT: Espn - Drummond could rank as 'greatest teen' in NBA 

Post#297 » by lucky777s » Wed Jan 23, 2013 5:20 am

I only opened this thread to see all the crybabys whine about another Drummond thread.

But I can't pass up this BC quote:
We certainly recognized the extraordinary talent that Andre has," said Raptors G.M. Bryan Colangelo, "but the fit just wasn't right for our team


Truer words have never been spoken BC, you useless turd of a GM. God forbid we have two potentially dominant bigs on this team. What on earth would we do. The horror.

Maybe this is what BC meant when he said it is not a talent issue - we have none, so its not an issue.

Another 11/11/2 game for Drum tonight.
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Re: OT: Espn - Drummond could rank as 'greatest teen' in NBA 

Post#298 » by Dr Positivity » Wed Jan 23, 2013 5:25 am

"We certainly recognized the extraordinary talent that Andre has," said Raptors G.M. Bryan Colangelo, "but the fit just wasn't right for our team given that we had previously drafted another young project big man in Jonas Valanciunas."


HHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHH AHAHAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHA HAHHAHAHAHAHAHA
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Re: OT: Espn - Drummond could rank as 'greatest teen' in NBA 

Post#299 » by Dr Positivity » Wed Jan 23, 2013 5:33 am

I'm thinking about how we drafted Euro with the 56 specifically because we only wanted 3 rookies on the team, presumably to make Casey's job easier...

Is it possible that's what's happening here? That BC is so incompetent that he'd draft based on something like "Well, we have a project big, and developing TWO would be really hard for our coach..."
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Re: OT: Espn - Drummond could rank as 'greatest teen' in NBA 

Post#300 » by Hero » Wed Jan 23, 2013 6:11 am

Not only does Drummond have amazing potential and has had some monster game this year against quality opponents, he is also very consistent in his play. Every time I look at his performances I can't help but be wowed. At 8th pick we didn't go for the obvious choice and instead reached. Another horrible move for a horrible franchise.
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~~~.▄▄██▌█ Cargo: Ross, JV, Amir, Lou Williams
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Re: OT: Espn - Drummond could rank as 'greatest teen' in NBA 

Post#301 » by Volcano » Wed Jan 23, 2013 6:22 am

lucky777s wrote:I only opened this thread to see all the crybabys whine about another Drummond thread.

But I can't pass up this BC quote:
We certainly recognized the extraordinary talent that Andre has," said Raptors G.M. Bryan Colangelo, "but the fit just wasn't right for our team


Truer words have never been spoken BC, you useless turd of a GM. God forbid we have two potentially dominant bigs on this team. What on earth would we do. The horror.

Maybe this is what BC meant when he said it is not a talent issue - we have none, so its not an issue.

Another 11/11/2 game for Drum tonight.


lol..look what BC has turned our fanbase into

david5773 wrote:Close this thread the drummond talk is getting old, get off his d***


Bargnani iz de best! lulz, drummand cant shot threes
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Re: OT: Espn - Drummond could rank as 'greatest teen' in NBA 

Post#302 » by Phenomenologist » Wed Jan 23, 2013 6:28 am

Hero wrote:Not only does Drummond have amazing potential and has had some monster game this year against quality opponents, he is also very consistent in his play. Every time I look at his performances I can't help but be wowed. At 8th pick we didn't go for the obvious choice and instead reached. Another horrible move for a horrible franchise.


Taking Ross over Drummond was basically Araujo all over again. Except it's even worse this time because I would argue that perennial all-star vs borderline starter is worse than solid starter versus non-NBA player.

Oh, and that quote by BC is obvious spin; there is no way even BC is that dumb. I hate the guy, but if he knew the results, he would have trammed Drummond in a heartbeat, fit/developing two bigs/etc. be damned.

And where is that moron kurtz? Yah, he's already got a man's body, so despite the fact that he's only 19, he won't be improving his body at all going forward. Sigh, why can't people understand gradations?
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Re: OT: Espn - Drummond could rank as 'greatest teen' in NBA 

Post#303 » by DHK » Wed Jan 23, 2013 6:46 am

Phenomenologist wrote:
Hero wrote:Not only does Drummond have amazing potential and has had some monster game this year against quality opponents, he is also very consistent in his play. Every time I look at his performances I can't help but be wowed. At 8th pick we didn't go for the obvious choice and instead reached. Another horrible move for a horrible franchise.


Taking Ross over Drummond was basically Araujo all over again. Except it's even worse this time because I would argue that perennial all-star vs borderline starter is worse than solid starter versus non-NBA player.

Oh, and that quote by BC is obvious spin; there is no way even BC is that dumb. I hate the guy, but if he knew the results, he would have trammed Drummond in a heartbeat, fit/developing two bigs/etc. be damned.

And where is that moron kurtz? Yah, he's already got a man's body, so despite the fact that he's only 19, he won't be improving his body at all going forward. Sigh, why can't people understand gradations?

No..Araujo is a special case..
You're blowing it out of porportion.
Nobody expected Araujo to be picked that high, he was projected in the late 20's or even in the 2nd round in the mock drafts. The pick came out of nowhere. He was stiff, unproven, had no skills outside of a big frame a soft jumper. Ross was actually projected to be picked by the low-mid teens. So it wasnt a far of a reach.

Given the circumstances right now, sure, I'd pick Drummond over Ross 10/10 times however, knowing you had 3 young bigs, Bargnani was a player the Raptors were still high on, of those bigs, two are invested in Amir/Val, one of which have already proven to be solid and another expected to be top tier of C with seasoning; it doesnt make sense to pick him at that time. It doesnt make sense unless youre trying to package a young player + assets for a stud. And there was no one actively trading around a sure thing/stud player ( Harden was not made available since he wasnt even in negotiations for a new contract at that point).

Let's say we did pick Drummond, where does it guarantee success that the growth he's having in Detroit would equate to the growth he would have here? Drummond is progressing nicely since as stubborn as Lawrence Frank is, he gets spot up minutes since after Monroe and Maxiell, there isnt much (CV has been a surprise this season but a complete afterthought going into it), and he's used to minutes to his fullest.
Going into the season, you're look at Drummond behind 4 big men. Where is the minutes allocated to Drummond in that case? Garbage minutes? It's comparable to the Miinny situation where they were picking PGs although their PG line was full or even the Philly situation with Vucevic (somewhat comparable). There is no guarantee he would have sprouted the same way as he is in Detroit. Granted he is still a special talent but the situation he is in is all too perfect for him.

This is all hindsight and absolutely ridiculous. It's perfectly reasonable to be a fan of Drummond. It's also perfectly reasonable to hate BC (I hate him too). It is not perfectly reasonable to go look "Why the hell didnt we pick Drummond look at him flourish and killing everyone, and coming to his own form OMG" and making OT threads about how much of a mistake and how pitiful this franchise is for passing up on him. If you want to follow that trend, might as welll make continuous threads about why we passed on Rondo, Ginobili, Parker, Millsap, Granger, Iggy etc. You can look at a player going into a draft and speculate "oh that kid's got talent, he's going to be something special in the league" however that doesnt equate to the player guaranteed 100% to being someone special and panning out exactly as his potential dictates (ie see Gerald Green for example)

Seriously, why cant Raptor fans (and by quoting you I'm not directly pointing at you) just cheer for the damn players on the team like fans are supposed to instead of making continual complaints about what we could of had, or what we dont have better.
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Re: OT: Espn - Drummond could rank as 'greatest teen' in NBA 

Post#304 » by Phenomenologist » Wed Jan 23, 2013 7:08 am

DHK wrote:
Phenomenologist wrote:
Hero wrote:Not only does Drummond have amazing potential and has had some monster game this year against quality opponents, he is also very consistent in his play. Every time I look at his performances I can't help but be wowed. At 8th pick we didn't go for the obvious choice and instead reached. Another horrible move for a horrible franchise.


Taking Ross over Drummond was basically Araujo all over again. Except it's even worse this time because I would argue that perennial all-star vs borderline starter is worse than solid starter versus non-NBA player.

Oh, and that quote by BC is obvious spin; there is no way even BC is that dumb. I hate the guy, but if he knew the results, he would have trammed Drummond in a heartbeat, fit/developing two bigs/etc. be damned.

And where is that moron kurtz? Yah, he's already got a man's body, so despite the fact that he's only 19, he won't be improving his body at all going forward. Sigh, why can't people understand gradations?

No..Araujo is a special case..
You're blowing it out of porportion.
Nobody expected Araujo to be picked that high, he was projected in the late 20's or even in the 2nd round in the mock drafts. The pick came out of nowhere. He was stiff, unproven, had no skills outside of a big frame a soft jumper. Ross was actually projected to be picked by the low-mid teens. So it wasnt a far of a reach.

Given the circumstances right now, sure, I'd pick Drummond over Ross 10/10 times however, knowing you had 3 young bigs, Bargnani was a player the Raptors were still high on, of those bigs, two are invested in Amir/Val, one of which have already proven to be solid and another expected to be top tier of C with seasoning; it doesnt make sense to pick him at that time. It doesnt make sense unless youre trying to package a young player + assets for a stud. And there was no one actively trading around a sure thing/stud player ( Harden was not made available since he wasnt even in negotiations for a new contract at that point).

Let's say we did pick Drummond, where does it guarantee success that the growth he's having in Detroit would equate to the growth he would have here? Drummond is progressing nicely since as stubborn as Lawrence Frank is, he gets spot up minutes since after Monroe and Maxiell, there isnt much (CV has been a surprise this season but a complete afterthought going into it), and he's used to minutes to his fullest.
Going into the season, you're look at Drummond behind 4 big men. Where is the minutes allocated to Drummond in that case? Garbage minutes? It's comparable to the Miinny situation where they were picking PGs although their PG line was full or even the Philly situation with Vucevic (somewhat comparable). There is no guarantee he would have sprouted the same way as he is in Detroit. Granted he is still a special talent but the situation he is in is all too perfect for him.

This is all hindsight and absolutely ridiculous. It's perfectly reasonable to be a fan of Drummond. It's also perfectly reasonable to hate BC (I hate him too). It is not perfectly reasonable to go look "Why the hell didnt we pick Drummond look at him flourish and killing everyone, and coming to his own form OMG" and making OT threads about how much of a mistake and how pitiful this franchise is for passing up on him. If you want to follow that trend, might as welll make continuous threads about why we passed on Rondo, Ginobili, Parker, Millsap, Granger, Iggy etc. You can look at a player going into a draft and speculate "oh that kid's got talent, he's going to be something special in the league" however that doesnt equate to the player guaranteed 100% to being someone special and panning out exactly as his potential dictates (ie see Gerald Green for example)

Seriously, why cant Raptor fans (and by quoting you I'm not directly pointing at you) just cheer for the damn players on the team like fans are supposed to instead of making continual complaints about what we could of had, or what we dont have better.


I disagree with most of this. For one, the Ross pick definitely came out of left field. ESPN had him early to mid teens (they had Araujo 21st for comparison), but Hollinger had him 29th and a number of other outlets had him lower. I mean, just look at media reactions to the pick. Most were surprised; most thought it was a reach. Again, it's about gradations.

The vast majority of mocks had Drummond no worse than the top-8. My feeling (based on an aggregate of scouting reports and mocks) before the draft went down was that there were EIGHT elite prospects (with gradations between them owing to mental makeup questions and, of course, the Davis factor); thus, once the top seven picks were made, I assumed (or prayed, really) that we would take the final one left, i.e. Drummond. When we not only passed on Drummond, but also other players that were generally ranked higher (Lamb, for instance), I was shocked and horrified. I almost broke my TV, it was a really depressing night.

The media and the rest of us had similar reactions too. In other words, it was pretty clear at the time it was made that the Ross pick was an indefensible one. That it's turned out about as poorly as it could have only intensifies the overall horribleness of it.

And as to all of your reasoning about where Drummond would have gotten his minutes ... I don't buy any of it. We were supposedly a rebuilding team -- you take the best asset and worry about development later. There is nothing else to be said about it. If Drummond had shown the kind of ability he is showing now, then he would have earned his minutes. In others words, it would have been one hell of a "problem" to have.
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Re: OT: Espn - Drummond could rank as 'greatest teen' in NBA 

Post#305 » by Aventador » Wed Jan 23, 2013 7:11 am

DHK wrote:
Phenomenologist wrote:
Hero wrote:Not only does Drummond have amazing potential and has had some monster game this year against quality opponents, he is also very consistent in his play. Every time I look at his performances I can't help but be wowed. At 8th pick we didn't go for the obvious choice and instead reached. Another horrible move for a horrible franchise.


Taking Ross over Drummond was basically Araujo all over again. Except it's even worse this time because I would argue that perennial all-star vs borderline starter is worse than solid starter versus non-NBA player.

Oh, and that quote by BC is obvious spin; there is no way even BC is that dumb. I hate the guy, but if he knew the results, he would have trammed Drummond in a heartbeat, fit/developing two bigs/etc. be damned.

And where is that moron kurtz? Yah, he's already got a man's body, so despite the fact that he's only 19, he won't be improving his body at all going forward. Sigh, why can't people understand gradations?

No..Araujo is a special case..
You're blowing it out of porportion.
Nobody expected Araujo to be picked that high, he was projected in the late 20's or even in the 2nd round in the mock drafts. The pick came out of nowhere. He was stiff, unproven, had no skills outside of a big frame a soft jumper. Ross was actually projected to be picked by the low-mid teens. So it wasnt a far of a reach.

Given the circumstances right now, sure, I'd pick Drummond over Ross 10/10 times however, knowing you had 3 young bigs, Bargnani was a player the Raptors were still high on, of those bigs, two are invested in Amir/Val, one of which have already proven to be solid and another expected to be top tier of C with seasoning; it doesnt make sense to pick him at that time. It doesnt make sense unless youre trying to package a young player + assets for a stud. And there was no one actively trading around a sure thing/stud player ( Harden was not made available since he wasnt even in negotiations for a new contract at that point).

Let's say we did pick Drummond, where does it guarantee success that the growth he's having in Detroit would equate to the growth he would have here? Drummond is progressing nicely since as stubborn as Lawrence Frank is, he gets spot up minutes since after Monroe and Maxiell, there isnt much (CV has been a surprise this season but a complete afterthought going into it), and he's used to minutes to his fullest.
Going into the season, you're look at Drummond behind 4 big men. Where is the minutes allocated to Drummond in that case? Garbage minutes? It's comparable to the Miinny situation where they were picking PGs although their PG line was full or even the Philly situation with Vucevic (somewhat comparable). There is no guarantee he would have sprouted the same way as he is in Detroit. Granted he is still a special talent but the situation he is in is all too perfect for him.

This is all hindsight and absolutely ridiculous. It's perfectly reasonable to be a fan of Drummond. It's also perfectly reasonable to hate BC (I hate him too). It is not perfectly reasonable to go look "Why the hell didnt we pick Drummond look at him flourish and killing everyone, and coming to his own form OMG" and making OT threads about how much of a mistake and how pitiful this franchise is for passing up on him. If you want to follow that trend, might as welll make continuous threads about why we passed on Rondo, Ginobili, Parker, Millsap, Granger, Iggy etc. You can look at a player going into a draft and speculate "oh that kid's got talent, he's going to be something special in the league" however that doesnt equate to the player guaranteed 100% to being someone special and panning out exactly as his potential dictates (ie see Gerald Green for example)

Seriously, why cant Raptor fans (and by quoting you I'm not directly pointing at you) just cheer for the damn players on the team like fans are supposed to instead of making continual complaints about what we could of had, or what we dont have better.


the difference is that not as many people really forsaw the greatness of Rondo, Manu or Parker, etc.

The Granger and Iggy picks had just as much controversy given who we drafted (Graham and Araujo).

Again, it's simple; Players like Ross are a dime a dozen, whereas Drummond's unique make up comes along much more rare. At our draft spot, that's the type of player to gamble on. We didn't because we fail.

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