The KD/Lebron era and why what we're doing is smart

[tracey_nice]

1) I think the team made a mistake, but I hope I'm proven wrong
2) I think the team made a mistake, and I hope I'm proven right

Where you stand most often?

3) I think the team made a mistake and I REFUSE TO BE LIMITED BY YER BINARY DEFINITION OF WHAT A "FAN" IS.

[Double Helix]

Right, because being bothered about the fact that a fan site that was specifically created to be one of the few places online where Raptors fans can discuss their favorite team without being trolled is McCarthyism.

By the way, insult me again by calling me a moron or worse and you'll find out exactly what it's like to lose your freedom of speech. Terms of service, friendo. This place does still have some rules.

I didn't call you a moron; I implied that you were one.

I understand the difference. Just as I understand that most of the people I've met in life over the age of 25 who've chosen a children's RPG character as their avatar seem to get most of their satisfaction pretending to be something they're not online because their real lives are sad. I usually don't waste my time with such people.

[SDM]

... says the guy with the avatar of two cats making out.

[brownbobcat]

Maybe our goal during this era is to get to the second round again? Maybe it's to get past the second round for the first time in franchise history. Is any long-time Raptors fan really going to say that the memories of this team battling the Knicks and the 76ers in those playoffs series aren't some of their favorite basketball memories associated with this team?

What's wrong with wanting to return to that for a short period of time and then rebuilding again? What's wrong with treating an Eastern Conference Championship appearance as a mini-championship? What's wrong with a second round appearance as a franchise accomplishment?

There's nothing with that when you're playing in the prime era of LeBron. What many of us pro-tankers object to is BC demolishing the dreams of even those lowered expectations with his shortsightedness. There are no prospects coming down the pipe. The team is capped out, its best player (a non All-Star) is already in his prime. They're most likely going to miss the playoffs again. Unless Valanciunas morphs into the 2012 rich man's version of Joakim Noah in the next 2 years, the core still lacks talent.

All because of a ridiculous decision to accelerate the rebuild based on delusions of grandeur.

[Double Helix]

... says the guy with the avatar of two cats making out.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tim_and_Er ... _Great_Job!

[genius-]

Right, because being bothered about the fact that a fan site that was specifically created to be one of the few places online where Raptors fans can discuss their favorite team without being trolled is McCarthyism.

By the way, insult me again by calling me a moron or worse and you'll find out exactly what it's like to lose your freedom of speech. Terms of service, friendo. This place does still have some rules.

I didn't call you a moron; I implied that you were one.

I understand the difference. Just as I understand that most of the people I've met in life over the age of 25 who've chosen a children's RPG character as their avatar seem to get most of their satisfaction pretending to be something they're not online because their real lives are sad. I usually don't waste my time with such people.

[carl_english]

The team could've been handled better obviously. However, there are some things going on behind the scenes we are not seeing such as board demands.

[vc_rulez]

LOL Great post. I can't wrap my head around why some of the members on this board are still Raptor fans when they seem to hate almost everything theyve done the past decade lol.
.

Yeah. Almost sounds like an abusive relationship. Don't know why they bother staying in it if it's killing them so much.

This is the truth. Unfortunately, like an abusive relationship, the victim has trouble leaving it.

I am in my mid-thirties and been a fan of the team since day one. I believe that this has been, and continues to be, one of the worst-run pro sports franchises in north america, and that Colangelo is totally incompetent. If there were a button that I could press, or a therapist that I could see, that would stop me from caring about this team, I would do it in a second. I really sort of hate myself for following this team. I don't even live in Canada anymore and am going out of my way to get league pass BB and post on message boards. It is pathetic and I am too old for this. I should be thinking about my kids, etc., rather than this stuff.

[Indeed]

Every fan believe they are better than the GM, including regulations, licensing and financial aspects.

[Double Helix]

Right, because being bothered about the fact that a fan site that was specifically created to be one of the few places online where Raptors fans can discuss their favorite team without being trolled is McCarthyism.

By the way, insult me again by calling me a moron or worse and you'll find out exactly what it's like to lose your freedom of speech. Terms of service, friendo. This place does still have some rules.

I didn't call you a moron; I implied that you were one.

And, look, as a guy that was a former mod on a message board, I know a thing or two about wasting one's time. However, I just can't imagine any bigger waste of time than signing up for a fan site, and posting nothing but reasons why I dislike a certain band, vehicle, TV show, or movie franchise associated with that site.

This isn't politics. Your city, province, and country aren't at stake here. If you don't like what's being offered up there are other service offerings available to you throughout the association. Again, I ask... if you hate everything that's happening with this team RIGHT NOW -- not before, RIGHT NOW -- then why are you still "supporting" this team? What kind of backwards loyalty is that? I hate the Corvettes that Chevrolet has been making... HATE THEM! But I am a fan of Corvette because I liked the model that came out in the late 90s and early 00s. So, I go to the Corvette car shows and boo the new corvettes that are unveiled. I ask people why they're enjoying their new corvettes. I list all the reasons why I don't like the new corvettes because I want everybody to see why I don't like them. I point out all the reasons why I think Lamborghini is better than the new Corvettes. This seems like something a logical-thinking person would do? This is what trolls do.

[AbC?]

Terrible points.

"We aren't going to win the championship anyway so might as well blindly support this idiotic franchise in it's desperate attempts to aim for 9th, makes bad decision after bad decision and ultimately fails at achieving short term or long term success"

BC's moves can't be justified as him choosing the short term over long term. Their just bad moves period. Landry Fields was a bad signing, no matter the team's goals. So was choosing Ross over Drummond. If this team really is trying to prioritize short term goals then they are doing a spectacularly poor job even accomplishing that, all the while ensuring a very poor future outlook.

If you're going to treadmill over the coming years, at least do it f**king right.

[G R E Y]

One of the problems with using the recent short winning streak as a basis for a new outlook is that the philosophy by which the team was assembled is still in place, a philosophy that has been largely unsuccessful throughout BC's tenure. If you don't like the negativity direct it to those built the team. Knee jerk reactions on a game by game basis are one thing, but the extent of the negativity I think reflects the mounting frustration this fan base is having over the lack of tangible results over a prolonged period of time. Forgive us if a few games don't yet sway.

[brownbobcat]

However, I just can't imagine any bigger waste of time than signing up for a fan site, and posting nothing but reasons why I dislike a certain band, vehicle, TV show, or movie franchise associated with that site.

This seems like something a logical-thinking person would do? This is what trolls do.

Fans (fanatics) aren't logical-thinking people. If we were, why would any of us spend time and money on a bad product such as the Raptors?

[Double Helix]

However, I just can't imagine any bigger waste of time than signing up for a fan site, and posting nothing but reasons why I dislike a certain band, vehicle, TV show, or movie franchise associated with that site.

This seems like something a logical-thinking person would do? This is what trolls do.

Fans (fanatics) aren't logical-thinking people. If we were, why would any of us spend time and money on a bad product such as the Raptors?

Might be the most logical point in this entire thread.

[RapsFanInVA]

Didn't read through this whole thread but the bottom line is, winning some freaking games for once will improve morale on this board. At least give the illusion that we were only a few unlucky breaks away from making it to the ECF or something.

When you cheer for a team that has won 38% of their games over the past 5 seasons, you have every right to be PO'd that your team sucks.

Why bother watching sports if your line of thinking is "oh, well we have no chance of ever beating the Heat or Thunder, so I'm okay spending my time watching us suck year after year. At least our guys are trying hard!"

Are we a better team with Gay? Yes. Will we win a playoff series in the next few year? That would be a nice change of pace. But I understand the disdain of many fans who have experienced nothing but misery during BC's reign of terror. That's why I wouldn't mind a fresh start with a new GM. We've been sold hope every year, and the Raptors have never delivered. At this point the burden is on the Raptors to prove to me that I should care and be entertained. Win some games, then maybe fans will change their tune.

[Double Helix]

For the record, I'm fine with a new GM, just as I was fine with us trading Bargnani. I just don't see the need to return to both points in every thread that anyone ever proposes about what they do like about the team.

You can like aspects of this team without supporting BC. If he's fired it doesn't seem likely that a new GM would instantly look to remove Rudy, Kyle, Jonas, Amir, etc just because he was new.

[BlackBerry]

LOL Great post. I can't wrap my head around why some of the members on this board are still Raptor fans when they seem to hate almost everything theyve done the past decade lol.

What I also don't get is didnt most people on here like the Lowry trade? Yet most now hate the Gay trade because it appaerently makes us a "treadmill team". This to me is really funny because I think the opposite is true. The Lowry trade made us a treadmill team, not good enough to make the playoffs, yet severly impacted our ability to build through the draft. Now with the Gay trade were a young playoff team with young assets and a higher ceilling. Make up your mind! Lol did you want to tank in the draft or did you want to improve through trades/signings? The Lowry deal put the writing on the wall for trade time, the Gay trade is just the follow up. How you could like the Lowry trade and then hate the Gay trade just simply makes no sense.

Cause no matter what that is our home team/country team. I am a Heat fan, but I still support the raptors no matter what. Vince Carter, Chris Bosh will always be a raptor in my eyes.

[Suga2Panda]

If the goal is to be a high end treadmill team, we are doing a spectacularly bad job at it.

overpaid players
redundant players
poor asset management

If you want to treadmill you still need a competent GM.

[Rebel INS]

I used to wonder why so many people here waste so much of their lives following a bad basketball team they so apparently dislike. I've spent a little time thinking about it and I think the only rational reason why a huge segment of the realgm fanbase keeps religiously posting is that they enjoy the losing. They enjoy it because watching basketball games is not the primary motivation in being a raptors fan

They like the firebc fan petitions and being able to log on here and critique bad trades and signings. They like revisiting past mistakes and of imagining alternate fantasy scenerios of how this team could've ended up if a better GM was in charge...that better gm invariably being themselves. I think more than anything, they like the role playing aspect of being a "real gm". I think the general structure of this forum, the hyperattention to cap details and hypothetical trades supports that idea (as an aside, is there anything more ridiculous than coming up with fake "trades"? Why guys? What is the endgame here? LOL)

The more I think about it, the more I'm starting to think that the devoted "real gm's" here are engaging in something distinctly different from following a sports team. Maybe something more akin to a sports themed role playing game. Like dungeons and dragons with advanced statistics.

[Chaos Engine]

LOL Great post. I can't wrap my head around why some of the members on this board are still Raptor fans when they seem to hate almost everything theyve done the past decade lol.

What I also don't get is didnt most people on here like the Lowry trade? Yet most now hate the Gay trade because it appaerently makes us a "treadmill team". This to me is really funny because I think the opposite is true. The Lowry trade made us a treadmill team, not good enough to make the playoffs, yet severly impacted our ability to build through the draft. Now with the Gay trade were a young playoff team with young assets and a higher ceilling. Make up your mind! Lol did you want to tank in the draft or did you want to improve through trades/signings? The Lowry deal put the writing on the wall for trade time, the Gay trade is just the follow up. How you could like the Lowry trade and then hate the Gay trade just simply makes no sense.

Cause no matter what that is our home team/country team. I am a Heat fan, but I still support the raptors no matter what. Vince Carter, Chris Bosh will always be a raptor in my eyes.

You also have a Lakers sig. So you're a Lakers/Heat fan that supports the Raptors. Huh?