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Re: When will Jonas Valanciunas play in the 4th?
Posted: Sat Feb 23, 2013 5:58 am
by Mister Ze
Inevitable wrote:Val's per36 must be crazy good for a rookie C.
12 points 9 rebounds 2 blocks 5/9 from the field but 5 fouls.
Re: When will Jonas Valanciunas play in the 4th?
Posted: Sat Feb 23, 2013 6:00 am
by DatBoiCapspace
This just in, rookies dont play much. Especially rail think 20 year old bigmen rookies from Europe. This is not unique to Casey. Quit blaming him for not playing rookies. No coach plays rookies if they dont have to, and when they do their teams are usually not winners. As long as were in the playoff hunt were still trying to win so give a rest the kid he will get pt in the summer league and be ready for next year.
Re: When will Jonas Valanciunas play in the 4th?
Posted: Sat Feb 23, 2013 6:58 am
by bigbadstevenson
He's been playing well. That's what his playing time should depend on -- not whether he's a rookie or European or whatever. If Casey has any reason to expect him not to perform well, he probably shouldn't start him.
Re: When will Jonas Valanciunas play in the 4th?
Posted: Sat Feb 23, 2013 7:04 am
by Throwback24
buckzxl wrote:The real question is when will we lobby for a real head coach like SVG?
After we lobby for a real GM
Re: When will Jonas Valanciunas play in the 4th?
Posted: Sat Feb 23, 2013 9:02 am
by arbsn
he's not playing cuz he fouls to much and amir is stronger than him
still think he should have barg's minutes though.
Re: When will Jonas Valanciunas play in the 4th?
Posted: Sat Feb 23, 2013 9:06 am
by DHK
The way Casey's system is structured, he promotes a lot of spacing down the stretch so he always prefers one big on the floor rather than the 2. and if he does have 2, he expects one to create spacing (ie bargs). Right now Amir is the best big and the most suited for the role and until Casey decides to revise his system and go for a more traditional lineup at the closing stretch, it's unlikely JV will get floor time in the 4th for quite some while.
I'm starting to see Casey's approach towards JV so I'm fine with the way he's coached.
I'm more worried about Ross however..
Re: When will Jonas Valanciunas play in the 4th?
Posted: Sat Feb 23, 2013 9:35 am
by Inflymous
In today's NBA, most teams are rolling with one big these days and I would take Amir over Val 9/10 times. Only thing that pisses me off is when Bargs gets minutes over him.
Re: When will Jonas Valanciunas play in the 4th?
Posted: Sat Feb 23, 2013 10:49 am
by Lukeem
Sometime after Casey / new coach realizes giving up offensive rebounds and wide open Layups and dunks is a base thing
Re: When will Jonas Valanciunas play in the 4th?
Posted: Sat Feb 23, 2013 2:31 pm
by Superchunk
bigbadstevenson wrote:You know what's ridiculous? Even knowing that he won't play much in the second half, Casey still takes him out with 3 fouls in the second quarter. It happened against Memphis most recently. It's stupid to expect a guy to pick up fouls at consistent rate in the first place (all coaches seem to do it anyway); to expect him to pick up fouls at a much higher rate in the 6 minutes he plays in the second half is just absurd. You think he's going to pick up 3 fouls in 6 minutes and you are trying to preserve as many fouls as possible because it's so important to have him on the floor for his entire shift? What the hell, Casey? Are you a f ucking moron?
The whole idea of "foul trouble" is insane, anyway. If you can't afford to have a guy foul out, why can you so easily afford him missing several minutes of play earlier in the game as if fouling out with a lower minute total would be a foregone conclusion if he isn't benched? Are you trying to maximize good players' time on the floor or not? If not, keep taking them out when they're in "foul trouble" and have them playing 8 fewer minutes so that they can finish the game with 3 or 4 fouls.
What Casey's been doing with Valanciunas is significantly less sensible than that.
I've always wondered the same thing. I've seen it countless times with different players and coaches. Smitch was hardcore about it. Take a guy out because he got two fouls in the first, and then sit him the rest of the game. Take a guy out because he has 4 fouls in the 3rd, and never reinsert him. If you have a pretty good idea the guy is only going to play 25 minutes or so, why worry so much about him having 3 fouls? The only thing that makes sense to me is concerns over other players getting foul trouble and ending up with no power forwards or something...but that seems like such a remote concern.
Re: When will Jonas Valanciunas play in the 4th?
Posted: Sat Feb 23, 2013 2:44 pm
by Legal Non-Conforming
DHK wrote:The way Casey's system is structured, he promotes a lot of spacing down the stretch so he always prefers one big on the floor rather than the 2. and if he does have 2, he expects one to create spacing (ie bargs). Right now Amir is the best big and the most suited for the role and until Casey decides to revise his system and go for a more traditional lineup at the closing stretch, it's unlikely JV will get floor time in the 4th for quite some while.
I'm starting to see Casey's approach towards JV so I'm fine with the way he's coached.
I'm more worried about Ross however..
Ding, ding, ding....we have a winner. Two pages of comments, one attempt to give a real answer (an answer that doesn't assume Casey is an "idiot"). That's Real GM for you.
Re: When will Jonas Valanciunas play in the 4th?
Posted: Sat Feb 23, 2013 3:15 pm
by atmisback
Legal Non-Conforming wrote:DHK wrote:The way Casey's system is structured, he promotes a lot of spacing down the stretch so he always prefers one big on the floor rather than the 2. and if he does have 2, he expects one to create spacing (ie bargs). Right now Amir is the best big and the most suited for the role and until Casey decides to revise his system and go for a more traditional lineup at the closing stretch, it's unlikely JV will get floor time in the 4th for quite some while.
I'm starting to see Casey's approach towards JV so I'm fine with the way he's coached.
I'm more worried about Ross however..
Ding, ding, ding....we have a winner. Two pages of comments, one attempt to give a real answer (an answer that doesn't assume Casey is an "idiot"). That's Real GM for you.
The problem with this is that it implies that casey is unable to adapt and just plays out his stubborn systems. Just because a coach has a specific system or structure doesn't mean it's right for the team, and that's what seperates the great coaches from the not so great. Last night, Jonas was plus 11 and giving us great rebounding and energy, while anderson was minus 14 and giving us nothing, yet one played zero minutes in the fourth and the other played the majority of the quarter, that to me is not great coaching. The fact that Jonas is a rookie should be irrelevant, you should close the game with the players that give you the best chance to win, simple.
Re: When will Jonas Valanciunas play in the 4th?
Posted: Sat Feb 23, 2013 3:22 pm
by Legal Non-Conforming
atmisback wrote:Legal Non-Conforming wrote:DHK wrote:The way Casey's system is structured, he promotes a lot of spacing down the stretch so he always prefers one big on the floor rather than the 2. and if he does have 2, he expects one to create spacing (ie bargs). Right now Amir is the best big and the most suited for the role and until Casey decides to revise his system and go for a more traditional lineup at the closing stretch, it's unlikely JV will get floor time in the 4th for quite some while.
I'm starting to see Casey's approach towards JV so I'm fine with the way he's coached.
I'm more worried about Ross however..
Ding, ding, ding....we have a winner. Two pages of comments, one attempt to give a real answer (an answer that doesn't assume Casey is an "idiot"). That's Real GM for you.
The problem with this is that it implies that casey is unable to adapt and just plays out his stubborn systems. Just because a coach has a specific system or structure doesn't mean it's right for the team, and that's what seperates the great coaches from the not so great. Last night, Jonas was plus 11 and giving us great rebounding and energy, while anderson was minus 14 and giving us nothing, yet one played zero minutes in the fourth and the other played the majority of the quarter, that to me is not great coaching. The fact that Jonas is a rookie should be irrelevant, you should close the game with the players that give you the best chance to win, simple.
You don't see the irony in your response?
Re: When will Jonas Valanciunas play in the 4th?
Posted: Sat Feb 23, 2013 3:42 pm
by atmisback
Legal Non-Conforming wrote:You don't see the irony in your response?
That they won even tho Anderson played such heavy minutes in the fourth?
if that was it, I would attribute last night's victory to Rudy having a big fourth quarter rather than a great coaching night. Look I don't think Casey is the worst thing to hit coaching like some people claim but he does have a lot to learn and for fans to question some of his rotations and decisions is fully warranted, atleast in my opinion.
Re: When will Jonas Valanciunas play in the 4th?
Posted: Sat Feb 23, 2013 4:33 pm
by no dice
raptorfan416 wrote:brags played in the 4th and not val
oh casey.
casey prolly feels like he needs to develop ab's confident back since we are stuck w him this season. From no.1 option to bench warmer is hard for anyone to take. Dunno wtf is with AA though. He was stinking up the joint this game.
Re: When will Jonas Valanciunas play in the 4th?
Posted: Sat Feb 23, 2013 5:54 pm
by Yoga
Jonas V's defense and rebounding could come in handy, when the game is on the line in the 4th
Re: When will Jonas Valanciunas play in the 4th?
Posted: Sat Feb 23, 2013 7:40 pm
by Mototaupa
atmisback wrote:Legal Non-Conforming wrote:You don't see the irony in your response?
That they won even tho Anderson played such heavy minutes in the fourth?
if that was it, I would attribute last night's victory to Rudy having a big fourth quarter rather than a great coaching night. Look I don't think Casey is the worst thing to hit coaching like some people claim but he does have a lot to learn and for fans to question some of his rotations and decisions is fully warranted, atleast in my opinion.
Toronto lost 4th quarter 28-21 (by 25%) dont think having JV would make it much worse, because he was +11 that game
Re: When will Jonas Valanciunas play in the 4th?
Posted: Sat Feb 23, 2013 7:53 pm
by Alfred
One of the reasons you don't want to have a big on the floor in the fourth quarter is free throw shooting. However, Valanciunas shoots almost 75% from the line, so it's not like you're killing yourself on that front.
It's pretty obvious that when we go with these tiny lineups in the fourth quarter, we get absolutely smoked on the boards and inside defensively.
Re: When will Jonas Valanciunas play in the 4th?
Posted: Sat Feb 23, 2013 8:07 pm
by Inevitable
Amir is our best all-round big man right now, in a close game down the stretch it is clear he doesn't want Val to blow crucial assignments or turn the ball over from just inexperience being a rookie big man. I guarantee possibly by the end of the year or starting next year Val will be closing games.
Re: When will Jonas Valanciunas play in the 4th?
Posted: Sat Feb 23, 2013 8:09 pm
by LRJ
buckzxl wrote:The real question is when will we lobby for a real head coach like SVG?
Re: When will Jonas Valanciunas play in the 4th?
Posted: Sat Feb 23, 2013 8:10 pm
by xprt
Jonas should get opportunity to prove himself in 4th quarter imo. Remember the game against spurs how fantastic he played in 4th? I am tired of Casey making adjustments to other coaches. Good coaches dont adjust they lead.