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Toronto Raptors* Might Sign Vassilis Spanoulis

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Re: Toronto Raptors* Might Sign Vassilis Spanoulis 

Post#41 » by DatBoiCapspace » Thu Jul 4, 2013 11:25 pm

Morris_Shatford wrote:I always liked the idea of filling out our bench with cheaper vets who played solid ball in Europe (Parker & Garbo) and I think Spanoulis certainly fills that role.

Pablo Prigioni was a cheap effective bench option for the Knicks and if we can get aboard that train again I wouldn't be opposed.


Crazy that Prigioni got a 3 year deal. There are a lot of pg's in Europe who could play his role in the NBA.

I think this is a route Ujiri could go with a pg still entering his prime, both him and Weltman in Milwaukee were interested in Gal Mekel before the Mavs signed him. Anyone know of any other Gal Mekel's that could make the transition to the NBA this year?
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Re: Toronto Raptors* Might Sign Vassilis Spanoulis 

Post#42 » by tsherkin » Thu Jul 4, 2013 11:30 pm

DatBoiCapspace wrote:I don't think the Raptors will sign Spanoulis mostly due to his age and pricetag, but this has to be a front runner for ignorant post of the year.


I'm well aware that he wasn't given a lot of playing time in Houston, but you should probably revisit how you interact with other posters, especially on a topic such as this.

Spanoulis in the NBA, when he was given minutes, did nothing. He had an extremely small sample, less than half a season at under 10 minutes per game, but he was abominably bad at basically everything but hitting free throws and he didn't look like he had the potential to be more, which is why so few people sympathized with him and few missed him when he cry-babied back to Europe after the Rockets traded him.

Meantime, he was a turnover and foul factory who couldn't hit the broad side of a barn with another barn in the NBA. He didn't shoot much, so the specific percentages aren't that interesting, but for a guy Dawson lauded for his creative ball-handling and ability to get to the rim, he did neither with any serious efficacy. He was about as bad as a player could possibly be while he was here; it was no surprise Van Gundy didn't play him, even if there were issues with JVG not liking to be told to play rookies by management.
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Re: Toronto Raptors* Might Sign Vassilis Spanoulis 

Post#43 » by xprt » Thu Jul 4, 2013 11:52 pm

tsherkin wrote:
DatBoiCapspace wrote:I don't think the Raptors will sign Spanoulis mostly due to his age and pricetag, but this has to be a front runner for ignorant post of the year.


I'm well aware that he wasn't given a lot of playing time in Houston, but you should probably revisit how you interact with other posters, especially on a topic such as this.

Spanoulis in the NBA, when he was given minutes, did nothing. He had an extremely small sample, less than half a season at under 10 minutes per game, but he was abominably bad at basically everything but hitting free throws and he didn't look like he had the potential to be more, which is why so few people sympathized with him and few missed him when he cry-babied back to Europe after the Rockets traded him.

Meantime, he was a turnover and foul factory who couldn't hit the broad side of a barn with another barn in the NBA. He didn't shoot much, so the specific percentages aren't that interesting, but for a guy Dawson lauded for his creative ball-handling and ability to get to the rim, he did neither with any serious efficacy. He was about as bad as a player could possibly be while he was here; it was no surprise Van Gundy didn't play him, even if there were issues with JVG not liking to be told to play rookies by management.

I am not fan of Spanoulis but 270 minutes of basketball is clearly to little of a game time to adjust and say he cant play in NBA especially for PG who need teammates to trust him. For example Ty Lawson during lockout came to Europe play basketball and he was looking pretty bad was been outplayed by his teammate pg, opponent pg's but guy clearly needed time to make adjustment to European basketball. Same could have been with Spanoulis though as I said I am not fan of his and wouldnt like Raptors to sign him.
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Re: Toronto Raptors* Might Sign Vassilis Spanoulis 

Post#44 » by tsherkin » Fri Jul 5, 2013 12:50 am

xprt wrote:I am not fan of Spanoulis but 270 minutes of basketball is clearly to little of a game time to adjust and say he cant play in NBA especially for PG who need teammates to trust him. For example Ty Lawson during lockout came to Europe play basketball and he was looking pretty bad was been outplayed by his teammate pg, opponent pg's but guy clearly needed time to make adjustment to European basketball. Same could have been with Spanoulis though as I said I am not fan of his and wouldnt like Raptors to sign him.


Surely, specific stats are too much to look at and many players start from a lower level of performance and take an adjustment upwards. The conversation we're having was spawned when I said he was effectively useless and someone called that the most ignorant post of the year, remember. ;)

Spanoulis might have, in time, turned into a more effective guard, but I doubt that. Remember, he had a reputation as a dribble penetrator who generated shots at the rim and finished well once he got there, but he didn't have the prerequisite athleticism to ever do that at an elite level in the NBA. Hell, even some of our elite PG athletes can't do that. He wasn't an elite 3pt shooter in the Euroleague, or in the Greek League. Hell, this year, he shot under 40% in both the Euroleague AND the Greek League, that's across 64 combined games, and wholly unimpressive from downtown, as has been the historical trend.

There's very little to suggest his shooting would have gotten a lot better and there's a lot to suggest that he benefited heavily from the significant differences between the two leagues, especially given the athleticism he didn't possess BEFORE he turned 30.

Spanoulis was never going to be an elite player, but he moped like a prima donna after a performance that was probably a lot closer to the level at which he'd eventually normalize than any kind of seriously valuable production.
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Re: Toronto Raptors* Might Sign Vassilis Spanoulis 

Post#45 » by The Warrior » Fri Jul 5, 2013 2:26 am

As long as it doesn't kill the tank I'm fine with this signing.
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Re: Toronto Raptors* Might Sign Vassilis Spanoulis 

Post#46 » by DatBoiCapspace » Fri Jul 5, 2013 5:55 am

tsherkin wrote:
DatBoiCapspace wrote:I don't think the Raptors will sign Spanoulis mostly due to his age and pricetag, but this has to be a front runner for ignorant post of the year.


I'm well aware that he wasn't given a lot of playing time in Houston, but you should probably revisit how you interact with other posters, especially on a topic such as this.

Spanoulis in the NBA, when he was given minutes, did nothing. He had an extremely small sample, less than half a season at under 10 minutes per game, but he was abominably bad at basically everything but hitting free throws and he didn't look like he had the potential to be more, which is why so few people sympathized with him and few missed him when he cry-babied back to Europe after the Rockets traded him.

Meantime, he was a turnover and foul factory who couldn't hit the broad side of a barn with another barn in the NBA. He didn't shoot much, so the specific percentages aren't that interesting, but for a guy Dawson lauded for his creative ball-handling and ability to get to the rim, he did neither with any serious efficacy. He was about as bad as a player could possibly be while he was here; it was no surprise Van Gundy didn't play him, even if there were issues with JVG not liking to be told to play rookies by management.


The same could be said for Jeremy Lin before he actually got a shot to play his game with D'Antoni. Spanoulis is actually a pretty similar player to Lin. Theyre both clutch guards who are quick with the ball and are great at driving to the basket. Spanoulis is the better shooter and has become a good playmaker as well. Lin is more explosive and gets more steals. Spanoulis wouldnt be an all-star in the NBA but he would have been a starting caliber pg or 6th man combo guard had he stayed here in his prime. He's proved as much that he could more then keep up with NBA pg's in international play. Theres more to athleticism then a 40 inch vertical, Spanoulis was very quick and agile in his prime and hes built like a fullback which helps him finish in traffic. The main reason he signed in the NBA was because of his World Championship performance where he broke down Kirk Hinrich, Chris Paul and Dwayne Wade. The challenge in the NBA is not so much his athleticism, its the athleticism of the defense and the pressure they give on the perimeter which causes turnovers, but a lot of NBA pgs have that problem they just make enough good plays to more then make up for it.

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cHNtJnCrwRM[/youtube]

The reason Spanoulils didnt work out in his one year is totally because of JVG. He's an old school coach. You guys think Casey is bad with rookies and neuters pgs? Casey is Don Nelson compared to JVG. Van Gundy gave Spanoulils the rookie treatment and lost confidence in him after a few preseason games where he turned the ball over. I shutter to think how great players like Steve Nash or Russell Westbrook would have turned out had they had Van Gundy as a coach in their early years.

To give you an example of how silly your statement is, before Spanoulis went back to Europe the new Rockets GM Darryl Morey tried to convince Spanoulis to stay with Houston, when he refused they traded his rights to San Antonio where Greg Popovich tried to convince Spanoulis to play for the Spurs before he ultimately decided to take a lucrative offer to return to Europe. Somehow I doubt Darryl Morey and Greg Popovich, two of the greatest basketball minds in the league, would have put the same effort in convincing John Lucas to stay in the NBA lol
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