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Toronto Raptors Depth Chart

  PG SG SF PF C
S Kyle Lowry DeMar DeRozan Terrence Ross Amir Johnson J. Valanciunas
R G. Vasquez Nando De Colo John Salmons P. Patterson Chuck Hayes
R Dwight Buycks     T. Hansbrough  
L Julyan Stone   Landry Fields Steve Novak  

See all Toronto Raptors historical depth charts

One Question: Kyle Lowry vs Mike James

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Post#1 One Question: Kyle Lowry vs Mike James
Wed Jan 8, 2014 2:36 pm by Blazer_2458

The Context
As the Raptors continue to string along wins, its becoming more apparent that Lowry and James have a ton in common. Both play every game like its their last, play intense defence, are not afraid to take big shots, have decent percentages, are strong leaders, and are basically "bulldogs" on the court.

The Stats:
Year G Min M A Pct M A Pct M A Pct Off Def Tot Ast TO Stl Blk PF PPG
2005-06 79 37:00 7.3 15.5 46.9 2.1 4.8 44.2 3.6 4.3 83.7 0.6 2.7 3.3 5.8 2.6 0.9 0.0 2.7 20.3
2013-14 33 36:23 5.2 12.0 42.8 2.2 5.9 37.9 3.2 4.0 79.4 0.8 3.2 4.0 7.4 2.2 1.8 0.2 3.2 15.7


THE Question
Knowing that we had Bosh (a star) but Babcock still had the foresight not to re-sign James, why would Masai resign Lowry and keep chugging along the path of mediocrity?

References:
http://ca.sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/4152/career
http://ca.sports.yahoo.com/nba/players/ ... gcvXY.dpuf
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Post#2 Re: One Question: Lowry vs James
Wed Jan 8, 2014 2:39 pm by RedX

James....?

Edit: I looked up your links. Still would put his full name in at least once because for 80% of your post I thought you mean Lebron which I was in disbelief of.

I think Lowry can run a team a lot better, play better defence, and doesn't look for his shot before everyone else.
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Post#3 Re: One Question: Lowry vs James
Wed Jan 8, 2014 2:39 pm by bape_lovers

reading the title, I thought you were talking about LeBron
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Credit to @ated
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Post#4 Re: One Question: Lowry vs James
Wed Jan 8, 2014 2:42 pm by CreaM

You're being ridiculous and intentionally obtuse.
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Post#5 Re: One Question: Lowry vs James
Wed Jan 8, 2014 2:43 pm by Blazer_2458

CreaM wrote:You're being ridiculous and intentionally obtuse.


love you're sig and banner. btw, notice how James had better stats that Lowry?
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Post#6 Re: One Question: Lowry vs James
Wed Jan 8, 2014 2:43 pm by pbj

Blazer_2458 wrote:
CreaM wrote:You're being ridiculous and intentionally obtuse.


love you're sig and banner. btw, notice how James had better stats that Lowry?


Did you watch the Raptors that season, in 05-06?
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Post#7 Re: One Question: Lowry vs James
Wed Jan 8, 2014 2:44 pm by roundhead0

If Lowry goes into Hero Mode and racks up stats while also racking up losses, then you can start the comparison.

For now he's playing a pretty good team game, so the comparison really doesn't hold. Not to mention that the one Mike James season was off the charts for him, whereas Lowry has performed at reasonable levels before.
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Post#8 Re: One Question: Lowry vs James
Wed Jan 8, 2014 2:46 pm by bushybrah_

I thought this was about LeBron.
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Post#9 Re: One Question: Lowry vs James
Wed Jan 8, 2014 2:46 pm by Blazer_2458

pbj wrote:
Blazer_2458 wrote:
CreaM wrote:You're being ridiculous and intentionally obtuse.


love you're sig and banner. btw, notice how James had better stats that Lowry?


Did you watch the Raptors that season, in 05-06?


Yeah, not sure why the James Bosh show got worse ratings than the Lowry/Derozan show... Or right, probably because 75% of the league wasn't taking the year off :lol:
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Post#10 Re: One Question: Lowry vs James
Wed Jan 8, 2014 2:46 pm by Lateral Quicks

Mike James was a one-dimensional chucker on a terrible team. By contrast, Lowry looks to distribute first, and plays very well on the other end of the floor. Lowry isn't a lights out shooter, something that will limit his payday, but this cherry-picked comparison is ridiculous.
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Post#11 Re: One Question: Lowry vs James
Wed Jan 8, 2014 2:48 pm by Blazer_2458

Lateral Quicks wrote:Mike James was a one-dimensional chucker on a terrible team. By contrast, Lowry looks to distribute first, and plays very well on the other end of the floor. Lowry isn't a lights out shooter, something that will limit his payday, but this cherry-picked comparison is ridiculous.


the stats speak for themselves.... wins and losses are more a reflection of a team than one individual player (see Raptors)
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Post#12 Re: One Question: Lowry vs James
Wed Jan 8, 2014 2:48 pm by gerrit4

A few things:

• While Babcock traded for James, it was BC who decided not to re-sign him.
• James older (I think 32 at the time).
• Lowry has been putting up good stats for years, this was James' first (and only) really good year.
• Lowry is putting up stats on a pretty good team, James put up stats on a terrible team. I think Lowry has nearly as many wins as James did in that season. Ability to contribute stats to a winning team is much more valuable than putting up big stats on a losing team.

I'm on the fence about re-signing l=Lowry. If we can get a good price (4 years 28 million), I'm happy. But paying him 10 million a year when there are no other teams that will be willing to pay that seems ridiculous to me...
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Post#13 Re: One Question: Lowry vs James
Wed Jan 8, 2014 2:51 pm by Basketball_Jones

Lowry is 28, rather then 32. So, you definitely don't give out a contract to a 32 year old having the season of his life. However, it's not an easy decision to hand out a pay day to a 28 year old having the season of his life either. But key difference is James was a scorer, while Lowry is a much better distributor. He can make his teammates better, something that was questionable before this season but it's clear that if you give him the keys he'll deliver. Rudy was jamming up his production and impact on the team.
T-Ross the Boss wrote:Still scratching my head @ Aaron Gray 20 minutes

When he got the ball he was horrified, like someone shot his family.
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Post#14 Re: One Question: Lowry vs James
Wed Jan 8, 2014 2:52 pm by Choker

Someone correct me if I'm wrong but James also clashed with the coaching staff that caused him to miss the last couple of games of the season. That was another thing to take into consideration on why we didn't re-sign him.
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Post#15 Re: One Question: Lowry vs James
Wed Jan 8, 2014 2:57 pm by El Bow

Choker wrote:Someone correct me if I'm wrong but James also clashed with the coaching staff that caused him to miss the last couple of games of the season. That was another thing to take into consideration on why we didn't re-sign him.

On top of that, the trade for James was mostly done to get rid of Rafer Alston's 6-year deal, who at the time also had issues with the coaching staff
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Post#16 Re: One Question: Lowry vs James
Wed Jan 8, 2014 2:58 pm by Dennis 37

CreaM wrote:You're being ridiculous and intentionally obtuse.


"intentionally obtuse" is a phrase that needs to get more usage as it is highly efficient.
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Post#17 Re: One Question: Kyle Lowry vs Mike James
Wed Jan 8, 2014 3:25 pm by agentzero2010

one player was playing well (stat wise) and the team was losing. the other player is playing well and the team is winning
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Post#18 Re: One Question: Kyle Lowry vs Mike James
Wed Jan 8, 2014 3:39 pm by Blazer_2458

agentzero2010 wrote:one player was playing well (stat wise) and the team was losing. the other player is playing well and the team is winning


Is it not possible that the current raps are playing well because there's a lack of competition this year?

EDIT: Our .485 win % would put us between 8th and 10th from 2005 to last year...

http://espn.go.com/nba/standings/_/year/2006
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Post#19 Re: One Question: Kyle Lowry vs Mike James
Wed Jan 8, 2014 3:41 pm by Patman

Blazer_2458 wrote:
agentzero2010 wrote:one player was playing well (stat wise) and the team was losing. the other player is playing well and the team is winning


Is it not possible that the current raps are playing well because there's a lack of competition this year?

http://espn.go.com/nba/standings/_/year/2006


Possible, but pretty sure we've played more Western Conference teams than any other East team has so far.
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Post#20 Re: One Question: Kyle Lowry vs Mike James
Wed Jan 8, 2014 3:59 pm by lucky777s

That 05/06 team was very young and just unloaded VC for picks and future cap space. Jalen was only there half a year.

MJames and Bosh played incredible together. It would have been fine to pay MJ 3/15 or 2/20 during the rebuild period. Jose was a rookie that first year and broke out the very next year.

That would have let us either keep CharlieV or trade him for a better long term piece than TJ Ford. Remember that Ford was not even our trade target with IND, it was them that threw out his name on draft night to move him. CharileV had a great rookie year and was at the peak of his value as it turned out. Finished the year with a 48 point game or something while Bosh was out.

It was BC that let MJames go, traded Charlie for damaged goods in TJ.

If we had kept Charlie, even temporarily, we may not have taken Bargs and gone for something like Roy or Gay on the wing.

We rushed that rebuild, traded the Rondo pick just to get rid of Jalen a year earlier, and totally mucked things up with Bosh. Keeping James for a year or two may have put the club on a totally different path, although BC was just a trainwreck of a GM.
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