Ettore Messina: another angle or different solution?

[RaptorGuy]

risk of failing by hiring a recycled coach like Van Gundy or Avery Johnson is greater than the risk of hiring a rookie coach like Messina

Wait. You'll hire a frickin rookie in place of Avery Johnson and Van Gundy, who took their teams to the NBA Finals? Joke! That's all you need right there. Avery is so young, and he's been already there and has so many wins under his belt. Jeff Van Gundy has also been in the finals, who's also a reputable coach in NBA. Messina will take 10 years (probably never) to accomplish what these two did in their short time.

You want to hire a rookie over these two?

If Van Gundy is so great, why is he still out of job. I haven't heard many teams knocking on his door.

[hsb]

risk of failing by hiring a recycled coach like Van Gundy or Avery Johnson is greater than the risk of hiring a rookie coach like Messina

Wait. You'll hire a frickin rookie in place of Avery Johnson and Van Gundy, who took their teams to the NBA Finals? Joke! That's all you need right there. Avery is so young, and he's been already there and has so many wins under his belt. Jeff Van Gundy has also been in the finals, who's also a reputable coach in NBA. Messina will take 10 years (probably never) to accomplish what these two did in their short time.

You want to hire a rookie over these two?

If Van Gundy is so great, why is he still out of job. I haven't heard many teams knocking on his door.

Van Gundy has a job, with ESPN (on a relatively new contract). He is also an expensive coach, which few teams might not try until the season is over. We don't know if teams haven't contacted him either.

Your point is null considering the only 'serious' NBA suitor for Messina, for all the years he's been coaching, is the Toronto Raptors.

People always talk about the transition for players going to or coming from Europe, is it so hard to believe Messina wont have a serious issue either? I, sadly, partly agree with J Dilla on this one, even though it looks like its set in stone that Messina will take over.

[timdunkit]

Van Gundy has a job, with ESPN (on a relatively new contract). He is also an expensive coach, which few teams might not try until the season is over. We don't know if teams haven't contacted him either.

Your point is null considering the only 'serious' NBA suitor for Messina, for all the years he's been coaching, is the Toronto Raptors.

People always talk about the transition for players going to or coming from Europe, is it so hard to believe Messina wont have a serious issue either? I, sadly, partly agree with J Dilla on this one, even though it looks like its set in stone that Messina will take over.

I have been a supporter of Messina but I understand some of the fears the i guess anti-Messina raptors fans have. Messina will struggle a bit (it is only natural in a course of a journey) but he already has a good feel for the english language, and TO is the best place for him in the NBA to help him with that transition or to have that transition be easy. The reason I am a big fan of Messina is that he is a disciplinarian with extremely high basketball IQ. I want a permanent coach, and would love if the franchise took similar steps as the Jazz did with Sloan. Van Gundy is the type of coach personally is someone you hire when you already have a good team in place and need a coach to get bit more out of them, I don't see Van Gundy as a coach that will build something from the bottom up. Avery isn't an X and O coach but a great motivational coach. He loves to control his PG which might make him the perfect coach for Jose (Jose is a type of PG who needs to be told what to do partially I think because of Smitch and how he brought him up) but you don't hire coaches for single players.

BC has a chances to put his coach, and it will be interesting the choice he makes ...

[hsb]

I want a permanent coach, and would love if the franchise took similar steps as the Jazz did with Sloan.

This is nothing like Sloan though.

Jerry Sloan payed his dues as a player, a scout, an assistant coach and a head coach in the NBA.

Bringing Messina in as a head coach is unprecedented and is something that might define BC's career as a Raptors GM for good or bad.

Hopefully it works out, but I find it hard to believe people have something against rational pessimism.

[timdunkit]

I want a permanent coach, and would love if the franchise took similar steps as the Jazz did with Sloan.

This is nothing like Sloan though.

Jerry Sloan payed his dues both as a player, a scout, an assistant coach and a head coach in the NBA.

Bringing Messina in as a head coach is unprecedented and is something that might define BC's career as a Raptors GM for good or bad.

Hopefully it works out, but I find it hard to believe people have something against rational pessimism.

Sloan has paid his dues ( I believe he was fired after 1 year with the Bulls and he didn't feel he got the support). You can't take anything from Sloan, he will go down as one of the greatest coaches in professionals sport. But Messina is no slouch himself, he has proven himself in the Europeon league and in international competition. His X's and O's will be one of the best as soon as he enters the NBA and I tottally agree it would define BC's career as a Raptors GM good or bad. Lets hope it who ever is picked, is who BC is willing to stick with (no firing coaches every 2-3 seasons please) ...

[J Dilla]

its pretty obvious why the kids on this forum can contribute nothing more than stupid **** like "omgz lolzzzzzzzz he's overrated", "Euros suck, Milt Palacio was MVP"(which is not true). These people are simply ignorant and lazy, they're too lazy to read up and find out about things and resort to making lazy and (Please Use More Appropriate Word) statements. If you don't know about something, you should either try to learn about it properly or keep your dumb ass mouth shut, please stop talking out of your ass, this place is filled with enough ignorance as is.

Take it how you want. All my points were valid. All I'm asking for is an experienced coach. I'm pretty sure there will be big names available in the offseason. And when I say experienced coach, I say NBA experienced. What if Messina is a total bust in the NBA? What if he can't adjust to the style of the NBA? Are we going to go through the same garbage of firing and hiring? I'm not totally against the hiring of Messina, he could become our lead assistant, and stay that way for 2-3 years to work players, get close to them and the game. But giving him the head coaching position out of the blue? No way.

Didn't the Raptors take a chance on Sam Mitchell? A rookie coach. Wow, what a concept.

The biggest mistake Colangelo made is resigning Mitchell to a new contract after winning COY. We should have gone after Mike D'Antoni.

That's why I **** said, the past 6 of our 7 coaches have been rookies. The Raptors need to take a different route this time.

[donald]

As usual for north american people, almost of you are speaking about a matter (Messina) you really doesn't know.
How con you judge a coach without never saw Messina's style of coaching?
How can compare to other coach if you really doesn't know him?

All coach who knows Messina judge him one of the best coach in the world, and that's al you can speaking about.
But you make the mistake thinking that if NBA players are the best in the world = NBA cochs are the best in the world. THAT'S WRONG!
Spoelstra
Tony Di Leo
McHale
Porter
Grizzlie's coach (I don't remember the name)
Wizard's coach
Curry (Detroit)
Atlanta's Coach
Triano
Del Negro
Net's coach
Thunder's coach
King's coach
Indiana's coach

How can you judge all these coaches better than Messina?
Believe in a person who have seen Messina's team many and many times: Messina is Popovich-like coach and will be in few times one of the best in NBA!!!

His style of coaching believing are:
-player's work ethic
-team effort
-great defense (with a amazing team's defnse and rotation)
-on offense EXECUTION, SPACING and ball movement

In few words: if Messina will be a raptor next year (as I hope) you'll never see a player on court who is not at his 100% concentration and defense, you'll never see on offense to play the ball on post for Bosh and all other player to see himm play.

[bargs]

you think there are many people here that actually have followed the guy?

most of the people that want him here just know he has won games in europe, where a teams success is mostly based on which owner is spending the most

he is another mystery euro option and it seems like everyone is on the bandwaggon,

personally id much rather have a great proven nba coach, I dont have any faith in colangelo attracting anyone like that here

if its up to guys like flip saunders, avery johnson or whatnot then whatever messina is in the same boat and might be better

well, mistery euro option doesn't seem too fair to me....he's a legit coach, worldwide recognized.

anyway you could download some euroleague games to watch it better

[Kakapato]

Messina is great, but I like him to be a lead assistant for the firts year.

The only problem, imo, he will find translating from Euroleague to NBA is the fatigue factor. In Europe they don't play 3 time a week.

[aristippus]

Tomorrow huge euroleague game, CSKA Vs Montepaschi Siena at 18,15 CET (12,15 pm in Toronto), between the two best defensive teams of europe. 40 minutes of suffocating defense.

(if your tv not broadcasting: myp2p.eu; or, for PbP, euroleague.net)

[SkywalkerAC]

Messina is great, but I like him to be a lead assistant for the firts year.

The only problem, imo, he will find translating from Euroleague to NBA is the fatigue factor. In Europe they don't play 3 time a week.

the guy's a workaholic from what i've heard. he'll be just fine. fatigue factor - lol

Messina is a head coach. there's no reason for him to start as an assistant in the nba.

[Kakapato]

Messina is great, but I like him to be a lead assistant for the firts year.

The only problem, imo, he will find translating from Euroleague to NBA is the fatigue factor. In Europe they don't play 3 time a week.

the guy's a workaholic from what i've heard. he'll be just fine. fatigue factor - lol

Messina is a head coach. there's no reason for him to start as an assistant in the nba.

Fatigue factor for the players... Messina is used to pretend the 100% of his players every night. My fear is the Raptors could overachieve for the first 41 games and than underachieve half of the season because players gave everything they had yet.

The NBA season is so long.

[SkywalkerAC]

Messina is great, but I like him to be a lead assistant for the firts year.

The only problem, imo, he will find translating from Euroleague to NBA is the fatigue factor. In Europe they don't play 3 time a week.

the guy's a workaholic from what i've heard. he'll be just fine. fatigue factor - lol

Messina is a head coach. there's no reason for him to start as an assistant in the nba.

Fatigue factor for the players... Messina is used to pretend the 100% of his players every night. My fear is the Raptors could overachieve for the first 41 games and than underachieve half of the season because players gave everything they had yet.

The NBA season is so long.

i think you mean he's used to demanding 100% of his players every night. hopefully he'll have some good depth to work with and players that will buy in 100%. injuries and fatigue are an issue for every team but having a coach that demands complete focus and effort is definitely a step in the right direction.

[Ted Lasso]

Messina is great, but I like him to be a lead assistant for the firts year.

The only problem, imo, he will find translating from Euroleague to NBA is the fatigue factor. In Europe they don't play 3 time a week.

I don't think it would be too difficult for him to overcome those sorts of transitional issues. He can discuss those things to death with Bryan and Maurizio.

His real test will be proving how good a coach he really is and how much he knows the game. And then mastering the different NBA strategies on the court. We've seen a number of college coaches who were regarded as quasi-geniouses fail in the NBA.

To be honest, i am very open to the idea of bringing Messina over. I am looking forward to it.

[Uncle Hare]

Messina is great, but I like him to be a lead assistant for the firts year.

The only problem, imo, he will find translating from Euroleague to NBA is the fatigue factor. In Europe they don't play 3 time a week.

I'm not sure this will be a problem, a Euroleague team plays between 70 and 80 games per year. There's not so much difference with nba.
Bargnani in his last year in Italy played something like 76-77 games.
The major issue will be the training during the season; in europe you don't spend a week on the road, you always get back to your gym.

[BigShotBob13]

Ive been reading A LOT of moronic and stupid posts on this thread, ranging from downright hating and blatant racism to pointing out that he's a rookie coach who doesn't know anything about NBA basketball let alone basketball in general. Im glad I have a lot if not all of these people on ignore.

I don't know much about Messina, I've followed most of the links and read and seen what he could bring to the table. It looks interesting. My point to the discussion? How much would he be offered salary wise? We're still on the books for the rest of SMitch's contract and I think that could play a huge factor to which coach we sign. I don't think MLSE will want to dip into the their wallets to pay another big time NBA coach "with experience" to coach us. Messina could be a low risk, high reward option for the team and not dent the bottom MLSE line.

[ansoncarter]

sharing the ball can cost a good player millions and millions of dollars

even on a balanced roster there's going to be one or two guys who stand above, and all that lost money would wear on them as the season went along imo

and thats not even mentioning bit players like moon or humphries who also like to play the chucking for dollars game

the messina talk sound a lot like the bigname college coach talk. Bigname college guy comes in to solve everything, like rick pitino or someone, realizes nba players are nothing like college ones and won't do everything he says and everyone ends up turning on each other

[donald]

sharing the ball can cost a good player millions and millions of dollars

even on a balanced roster there's going to be one or two guys who stand above, and all that lost money would wear on them as the season went along imo

and thats not even mentioning bit players like moon or humphries who also like to play the chucking for dollars game

the messina talk sound a lot like the bigname college coach talk. Bigname college guy comes in to solve everything, like rick pitino or someone, realizes nba players are nothing like college ones and won't do everything he says and everyone ends up turning on each other

No guy, you're wrong! No matter with college coaches!
If you don't know Messina, you can imagine him like a Euro-Popovich.
Like Popovich he likes:
DEFENSE
-Defense
-Team defense (it's very difficult to see against Spurs dribble to the basket without help and defense rotation... with Messina too)
-Defense transiction
OFFENSE
-Spacing on offense
-Execution
-Simple but very efficient schemes on offense
-Every player knows what to do and what his teammates are doing on offense

[Hendrix]

sharing the ball can cost a good player millions and millions of dollars

even on a balanced roster there's going to be one or two guys who stand above, and all that lost money would wear on them as the season went along imo

and thats not even mentioning bit players like moon or humphries who also like to play the chucking for dollars game

the messina talk sound a lot like the bigname college coach talk. Bigname college guy comes in to solve everything, like rick pitino or someone, realizes nba players are nothing like college ones and won't do everything he says and everyone ends up turning on each other

The offence he put in place in Cleveland doesn;t seem to be hurting LBJ's #'s too much, and the motion offnce Slaon runs in Utah seems to work out fine for playrs getting their stats.

[don't panac]

sharing the ball can cost a good player millions and millions of dollars

?
what does that even mean?
a more efficently run offense generates better numbers for everyone.

and in any case, you should give professionals a bit of credit.

unlike realGMers, real GMs actually evaluate players on how they play and what they bring to the team, not on the stats alone.
i can guarantee you that a team player that contributes to wins is worth more than a loser ball hog with an extra PPG in his stat sheet.