ImageImageImageImageImage

Raptor Cap Situation by timdunkit as per shamsports

Moderators: HiJiNX, niQ, Morris_Shatford, DG88, Reeko, lebron stopper, 7 Footer, Duffman100

dagger
RealGM
Posts: 40,573
And1: 13,498
Joined: Aug 19, 2002
         

Re: Current Cap Situation 

Post#281 » by dagger » Wed Jun 17, 2009 5:00 pm

tecumseh18 wrote:
Keep in mind the "pinch" that BC mentioned and Dagger has been saying all along - the Raps would be reluctant to commit to salaries for more than a single season now that may put them in the tax after next season. So Parker or Joey can't return if the full MLE/LLE are used. And we want them used.



And taking that a step further, I don't assume we will do all of the things on your list precisely because the cap and tax numbers will probably fall again in 2010, and we have to make room for Bargnani's next deal. We don't have a lot of expiring contracts this year. So while the MLE is a possibility, I don't take as a given that we will use all of it, or if we do, that we will use the LLE. Remember, we also have to leave room for our 2010 draft pick - because if we miss the playoffs, it will add another $2 million minimum to our 2010-11 obligations.

Nor would it shock me if Delfino is signed for one year - after which he will be a UFA. I'm inclined to believe we will get to about $65 million in salaries with no more than $55 million guaranteed for the following season. Now if Bosh is traded, all bets are off because he can haul away bad deals like Banks or bring back expiring contracts or outright cap relief as part of the package. But right now, all my calculations are based on him staying, and declining his option so that his next deal starts at a little less than $18 million.

Right now, our obligations for 2010-11 stand at about $55 million, including our draft choice this year and next, and a $10 million extension for Bargnani. So logically, we can't add more than $10-12 million in multi-year contracts. If we make the playoffs and forfeit our pick, that would rise to $12-14 million, but we can't bank on that a year in advance.

So, it stands to reason that if we sign Marion to a three year deal, it will probably be front-loaded - so that it adds no more than $7 million to our obligations for the 10-11 season, and a full MLE should do likewise - start at $5.3 million, and decline. That would pretty much remove all of our leverage for 2010-11. You can see that it might be prudent not to use a full MLE unless we get somebody who is obvious good value. And if we do a Marion S&T, it would be prudent to either take back an expiring contract (maybe even a crappy one-year deal plus a pick), or trade him for a contract with less than $7 million in 2010-11 salary.
2019 will never be forgotten because FLAGS FLY FOREVER
magani
Bench Warmer
Posts: 1,348
And1: 70
Joined: Nov 20, 2004

Re: Current Cap Situation 

Post#282 » by magani » Fri Jun 26, 2009 4:15 am

dagger wrote:
tecumseh18 wrote:
Keep in mind the "pinch" that BC mentioned and Dagger has been saying all along - the Raps would be reluctant to commit to salaries for more than a single season now that may put them in the tax after next season. So Parker or Joey can't return if the full MLE/LLE are used. And we want them used.



And taking that a step further, I don't assume we will do all of the things on your list precisely because the cap and tax numbers will probably fall again in 2010, and we have to make room for Bargnani's next deal. We don't have a lot of expiring contracts this year. So while the MLE is a possibility, I don't take as a given that we will use all of it, or if we do, that we will use the LLE. Remember, we also have to leave room for our 2010 draft pick - because if we miss the playoffs, it will add another $2 million minimum to our 2010-11 obligations.

Nor would it shock me if Delfino is signed for one year - after which he will be a UFA. I'm inclined to believe we will get to about $65 million in salaries with no more than $55 million guaranteed for the following season. Now if Bosh is traded, all bets are off because he can haul away bad deals like Banks or bring back expiring contracts or outright cap relief as part of the package. But right now, all my calculations are based on him staying, and declining his option so that his next deal starts at a little less than $18 million.

Right now, our obligations for 2010-11 stand at about $55 million, including our draft choice this year and next, and a $10 million extension for Bargnani. So logically, we can't add more than $10-12 million in multi-year contracts. If we make the playoffs and forfeit our pick, that would rise to $12-14 million, but we can't bank on that a year in advance.

So, it stands to reason that if we sign Marion to a three year deal, it will probably be front-loaded - so that it adds no more than $7 million to our obligations for the 10-11 season, and a full MLE should do likewise - start at $5.3 million, and decline. That would pretty much remove all of our leverage for 2010-11. You can see that it might be prudent not to use a full MLE unless we get somebody who is obvious good value. And if we do a Marion S&T, it would be prudent to either take back an expiring contract (maybe even a crappy one-year deal plus a pick), or trade him for a contract with less than $7 million in 2010-11 salary.


So if Bosh leaves as a free agent and we get nothing, then how much would we be under the cap then? We could barely sign any players that are UFAs unless we sign another MLE player, right? It's a gamble because we want to maximize our roster this year with Marion and an MLE, maybe an LLE, etc., to win now and entice Bosh to sign. However, we may be surrounding him with mediocre parts, he decides to leave, and we can't do much to quickly rebuild. Tough position we're in. That Banks contract is a killer.
2018-19 NBA Champions. Can never take that away.
appel
Banned User
Posts: 2,153
And1: 0
Joined: Nov 28, 2008

Re: Current Cap Situation 

Post#283 » by appel » Fri Jun 26, 2009 8:04 am

tecumseh18 wrote:Kris Humphries - $2,900,000
Nathan Jawai - $736,420
Marcus Banks - $4,553,793
Patrick O'Bryant - 855,189


9 millions for 4 scrubs..
Not bad
DreamTeam09
RealGM
Posts: 14,751
And1: 8,561
Joined: Jan 06, 2009
Location: Scarborough
 

Re: Raptor Cap Situation by timdunkit as per shamsports 

Post#284 » by DreamTeam09 » Sat Jun 27, 2009 5:45 pm

Just a quick question that has probably.been answered somewhere in this thread but I can't go looking for.

If we renounce everyone and spend that money on one player won't that put us over the cap and enable us to use the MLE & LLE to fill out the rest of the roster with??
Image

In Raptor Ball I Trust
Three34
Retired Mod
Retired Mod
Posts: 36,406
And1: 123
Joined: Sep 18, 2002

Re: Raptor Cap Situation by timdunkit as per shamsports 

Post#285 » by Three34 » Sat Jun 27, 2009 6:46 pm

You can't have both cap space and an MLE. If you want cap space, you'll have to renounce your exceptions too.
Alex5050
Ballboy
Posts: 16
And1: 0
Joined: Jan 23, 2009

Re: Raptor Cap Situation by timdunkit as per shamsports 

Post#286 » by Alex5050 » Sat Jun 27, 2009 8:50 pm

Quick question!

In the NHL, you see teams trading the Negotiation Rights of players.
IE. Today bowmeister (sp) had his rights traded to Calgary for the rights of a couple players.

Can you do that in the NBA?
I'm not the biggest fan, but for some... Trading the rights of Marion to Orlando for Turkyglue.. And if Orlando does not want to go higher over the tax, they can just let Marion walk.

Possible?
Three34
Retired Mod
Retired Mod
Posts: 36,406
And1: 123
Joined: Sep 18, 2002

Re: Raptor Cap Situation by timdunkit as per shamsports 

Post#287 » by Three34 » Sat Jun 27, 2009 9:47 pm

No. Draft rights for unsigned picks can be traded, but that's the only kind of rights trading that can be done.
User avatar
SkywalkerAC
RealGM
Posts: 12,927
And1: 4,665
Joined: Oct 31, 2008

Re: Raptor Cap Situation by timdunkit as per shamsports 

Post#288 » by SkywalkerAC » Sun Jun 28, 2009 9:26 am

you can't sign and trade for another player that is signed and traded, can you? (Marion and Turk)
dagger
RealGM
Posts: 40,573
And1: 13,498
Joined: Aug 19, 2002
         

Re: Raptor Cap Situation by timdunkit as per shamsports 

Post#289 » by dagger » Sun Jun 28, 2009 1:24 pm

SkywalkerAC wrote:you can't sign and trade for another player that is signed and traded, can you? (Marion and Turk)


Yes you can, but base year compensation rules kick in if either player gets more than a 20% raise. Now, Marion isn't a candidate for any raise. He'll be taking a big paycut. But if Turk gets more than 20%, he'd be base year restricted and then it becomes tougher to consumate a deal.
2019 will never be forgotten because FLAGS FLY FOREVER
User avatar
SkywalkerAC
RealGM
Posts: 12,927
And1: 4,665
Joined: Oct 31, 2008

Re: Raptor Cap Situation by timdunkit as per shamsports 

Post#290 » by SkywalkerAC » Sun Jun 28, 2009 1:40 pm

dagger wrote:
SkywalkerAC wrote:you can't sign and trade for another player that is signed and traded, can you? (Marion and Turk)


Yes you can, but base year compensation rules kick in if either player gets more than a 20% raise. Now, Marion isn't a candidate for any raise. He'll be taking a big paycut. But if Turk gets more than 20%, he'd be base year restricted and then it becomes tougher to consumate a deal.


tougher, or virtually impossible? i always was a little foggy on BYC calculations. anyhoo, thanks, very interesting possibility there.
dagger
RealGM
Posts: 40,573
And1: 13,498
Joined: Aug 19, 2002
         

Re: Raptor Cap Situation by timdunkit as per shamsports 

Post#291 » by dagger » Sun Jun 28, 2009 5:42 pm

Tougher, but not impossible.
2019 will never be forgotten because FLAGS FLY FOREVER
Three34
Retired Mod
Retired Mod
Posts: 36,406
And1: 123
Joined: Sep 18, 2002

Re: Raptor Cap Situation by timdunkit as per shamsports 

Post#292 » by Three34 » Sun Jun 28, 2009 8:22 pm

Grant Hill and Ben Wallace were once signed and traded for each other, along with Chucky Atkins. Like dagger says, it's rare and difficult, but it's doable.
appel
Banned User
Posts: 2,153
And1: 0
Joined: Nov 28, 2008

Re: Raptor Cap Situation by timdunkit as per shamsports 

Post#293 » by appel » Tue Jun 30, 2009 1:54 pm

Sham wrote:No. Draft rights for unsigned picks can be traded, but that's the only kind of rights trading that can be done.


What about the rights over Hairston ? (Drafted from Spurs in 2008)
He play NBDL and a lot of games (10) with San Antonio

We can sign him? Or we must acquire the rights?
Three34
Retired Mod
Retired Mod
Posts: 36,406
And1: 123
Joined: Sep 18, 2002

Re: Raptor Cap Situation by timdunkit as per shamsports 

Post#294 » by Three34 » Tue Jun 30, 2009 3:01 pm

San Antonio don't have any rights to him. They've signed and waived him in the past, which means they lose all attatchment to him. He got assigned to their D-League affiliate, which the Spurs outright own, but that doesn't really mean anything. He is available to whoever wants him, and to whoever he wants,
appel
Banned User
Posts: 2,153
And1: 0
Joined: Nov 28, 2008

Re: Raptor Cap Situation by timdunkit as per shamsports 

Post#295 » by appel » Tue Jun 30, 2009 3:56 pm

Sham wrote:San Antonio don't have any rights to him. They've signed and waived him in the past, which means they lose all attatchment to him. He got assigned to their D-League affiliate, which the Spurs outright own, but that doesn't really mean anything. He is available to whoever wants him, and to whoever he wants,



BC !!!

Invite him to SL !!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cAm6XWEyH4I
(yes he can dunk)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kE2jBb5dBRI
(Yes he can shot and have ice in the veins, look how he wait the jumpers)

22PPG in NBDl, 53% FG, 44% 3p, 5.5 RPG, 1.1 BPG, 3.7 APG
http://www.basketball-reference.com/nbd ... ma01d.html

BC, TRY IT !!!
Three34
Retired Mod
Retired Mod
Posts: 36,406
And1: 123
Joined: Sep 18, 2002

Re: Raptor Cap Situation by timdunkit as per shamsports 

Post#296 » by Three34 » Tue Jun 30, 2009 4:03 pm

No, you've got the wrong person. I'm Sham. I can't help you with that.
appel
Banned User
Posts: 2,153
And1: 0
Joined: Nov 28, 2008

Re: Raptor Cap Situation by timdunkit as per shamsports 

Post#297 » by appel » Tue Jun 30, 2009 4:23 pm

Sham wrote:No, you've got the wrong person. I'm Sham. I can't help you with that.


Call BC then :lol:
I bet you have his number

P.s. Maybe i can see Andrea in next weeks (he will play with NT near me)
I must tell him
no_hops_23
Junior
Posts: 294
And1: 2
Joined: Feb 09, 2006

Re: Raptor Cap Situation by timdunkit as per shamsports 

Post#298 » by no_hops_23 » Sun Jul 19, 2009 2:44 am

Is there an updated salary site including DD's salary, Turk and Jack's estimated contracts?
Colangelo turning water into wine

Return to Toronto Raptors