The Oklahoma City Model

[Raps in 4]

Yeah let's just tank for three seasons.

Fans will appreciate it and stick around.

Then those aren't true fans.

[inonba]

If winning a championship is 100% based on luck of the lottery wouldn't it make sense to rebuild using the draft, unless you didn't want to win a championship?

Great point, except you didn't read the part about the consolation prize. Also, elite championship worthy talent isn't available in every single draft. So how many years should you wait to draft that kind of talent?

[Raps in 4]

OH man ... if u like the "OKC" model, then route for OKC. You don't gotta route for the raptors. With Bosh being the franchise player, BC has decided to surround him with both young and soild experienced players. IF BC had decided to build through the draft when he got in then we'd literally have to go through 3-4 losing seasons. You think Bosh would wanna stick around for that? Think MLSE will be happy with that (whole other issue there)?There's a time to build through the draft and there's a time where u just gotta go for it. BC is not doing anything wrong. And yes, OKC has a lot of talented young players, but they're still about 1-2 seasons away from really becoming a consistent playoff basketball team. and believe me, by that time, they won't have all those nice young pieces. eventually they'll have to make deals to get experienced playoff vets to help guide Durant. And that one dude is right, good luck re-signing all of them.


Building through the draft has its nice benefits, but also has its downfalls.
Just as with building through free-agency and trades.

Here's how I see it:

OKC has a ton of young talent now. The purpose behind this is that the players gel together as they develop. If the combination, doesn't work, like you said, you then trade some of that youth for a veteran presence.

Whereas with us, we're stuck in a treadmill. We're not good enough to compete, but not weak enough to be able to add talent through the draft. We have to rely on trades and FA, which so far have done nothing for us.

I agree that both methods have their pros and cons though. I just feel that the right method for this team is the draft, but that's just my opinion.

[Hendrix]

I like the OKC model personally.

To be a contender you need talent. To get talent you can get it through the draft, free agency, and trades. The draft is by far the easiest way to improve talent out of the 3 especially if you spend a few years at the top of it. And when you start off with a good foundation through the draft then you set yourself up with a better opportunity to aquire more talent through free agency since you have the money to spend, and should have a promising roster where someone would want to come to.


The Bulls are an example of a team that failed by building through the draft. But they didn't fail because they built through the draft. They failed because the messed up the free agency about as bad as you can by signing Ben Wallace when they were already the best defensive team, didn't need him, and needed someone to score down low.

Trades are probably easier to aquire talent too when you're coming from a position of strenght. Opposed to us where we've thrown a ton of assets away.

[AllKnowingNBAer]

Presti stepped into probably the best situation possible.

somebody sig this, plz.

Why? He's absolutely right.

Presti walked into a team with low expectations and a no.2 pick in one of the best drafts in recent years. Then, after one season, the team moves to OKC where the fans are just happy to have a team. The team has been a bottom-five team for three years in a row, and the fans aren't even calling for the playoffs yet... they would be just as satisfied with an improvement.

Do you think this could happen in a place like NY? or even a team like Houston, or Dallas?

[Raps in 4]

Presti stepped into probably the best situation possible.

somebody sig this, plz.

Why? He's absolutely right.

Presti walked into a team with low expectations and a no.2 pick in one of the best drafts in recent years. Then, after one season, the team moves to OKC where the fans are just happy to have a team. The team has been a bottom-five team for three years in a row, and the fans aren't even calling for the playoffs yet... they would be just as satisfied with an improvement.

Do you think this could happen in a place like NY? or even a team like Houston, or Dallas?

Yes. It could happen anywhere. What's Houston doing right now?

[inonba]

OH man ... if u like the "OKC" model, then route for OKC. You don't gotta route for the raptors. With Bosh being the franchise player, BC has decided to surround him with both young and soild experienced players. IF BC had decided to build through the draft when he got in then we'd literally have to go through 3-4 losing seasons. You think Bosh would wanna stick around for that? Think MLSE will be happy with that (whole other issue there)?There's a time to build through the draft and there's a time where u just gotta go for it. BC is not doing anything wrong. And yes, OKC has a lot of talented young players, but they're still about 1-2 seasons away from really becoming a consistent playoff basketball team. and believe me, by that time, they won't have all those nice young pieces. eventually they'll have to make deals to get experienced playoff vets to help guide Durant. And that one dude is right, good luck re-signing all of them.


Building through the draft has its nice benefits, but also has its downfalls.
Just as with building through free-agency and trades.

Here's how I see it:

OKC has a ton of young talent now. The purpose behind this is that the players gel together as they develop. If the combination, doesn't work, like you said, you then trade some of that youth for a veteran presence.

Whereas with us, we're stuck in a treadmill. We're not good enough to compete, but not weak enough to be able to add talent through the draft. We have to rely on trades and FA, which so far have done nothing for us.

I agree that both methods have their pros and cons though. I just feel that the right method for this team is the draft, but that's just my opinion.

Neither method is a way to build a championship team because they both don't work. You can't "build" a championship team because like I've stated before, too much of it is relied on luck (or lottery fixing where there's no luck involved if you like the conspiracy). No once in a generation talent = no championship. You can build a "contender", someone who would come close, but never good enough to win it all.

For those of you who insist on "building through the draft", then I asked you one question. The year you tanked, and didn't get a Lebron, Duncan and have to settle for a McGrady and Bosh, what do you do? Keep on tanking until you luck out? Or build around what you have and become a "treadmill team"? How many years are you willing to lose? BTW, I heard the LA Clippers are still looking for that player after 30 years. How many years did teams like San Antonio, Chicago, Boston, LA, Miami, Detroit have to tanked to win those championships?

[airellis_23]

If winning a championship is 100% based on luck of the lottery wouldn't it make sense to rebuild using the draft, unless you didn't want to win a championship?[/quote]

Every teams goal is to win the championchip but certain teams have restrictions...
MLSE HAS to make a profit for its shareholders. What you propose is tanking until we get that one special player. Wich means sacrificing revenues for years and risk running a loss.

So the goal of the actual "owners" of the team is to
#1 make a profit
how do they do this? By entertaining the fans by putting a competative product on the floor. By doing this year after year they ensure a safe stream of revenue.

[Jack wore plaid]

If you look at the majority of champions their teams were built by utilizing both the draft and free agency.

However, most teams win by striking it rich in the draft.

Kareem, Magic, Worthy
Bird, Parrish
Jordan, Pippen
Isiah, Dumars
Hakeem
Kobe
Robinson, Duncan, Ginobili, Parker

There are only a handful of teams that have won utilizin free agency. The Lakers added Shaq, but is that it?

Some teams do it through trading like Boston and Detroit a few years ago as well.

I think what teams like Portland, for example, is doing is building through the draft and then adding a piece via free agency or trade. They struck gold with Roy, Aldridge and most likely Oden.

[inonba]

If winning a championship is 100% based on luck of the lottery wouldn't it make sense to rebuild using the draft, unless you didn't want to win a championship?

Every teams goal is to win the championchip but certain teams have restrictions...
MLSE HAS to make a profit for its shareholders. What you propose is tanking until we get that one special player. Wich means sacrificing revenues for years and risk running a loss.

So the goal of the actual "owners" of the team is to
#1 make a profit
how do they do this? By entertaining the fans by putting a competative product on the floor. By doing this year after year they ensure a safe stream of revenue.[/quote]

Exactly. Which is why teams sell tickets claiming false hope. "Yes, in 5 years time, we will be a contender, while other teams will be on the decline". Except in reality, teams like LA have been pretty much up there for the last 25 years. Do you think their winning tradition has anything to do with it? What about owners with deep pockets?

I recalled a past thread claiming Sam Presti, Kevin Pritchard, Mitch Kupchak, Daryl Morey to be the top GMs of the NBA. I was speechless then, I'm still speechless now, especially given the conditions of their respective teams.

[b0na f1de]

Is it just me or does this thread have nothing to do with the article,

it's about not spending just to spend, not purposely holding back to tank

[realball]

Presti's done a good job, but it's not out of this world. He's had four top 5 picks in the three consecutive drafts. What's he's done exceptionally well is clearing cap space and making Steve Kerr his bitch.

I think what impresses people most is that Presti seems completely committed to rebuilding. He is collecting young talent, rather than clearing cap space to chase after big name FAs or trading away youth for superstars. Which is great, but it takes half a decade of losing to do it. He's not clever, he's patient.

[airellis_23]

If winning a championship is 100% based on luck of the lottery wouldn't it make sense to rebuild using the draft, unless you didn't want to win a championship?

Every teams goal is to win the championchip but certain teams have restrictions...
MLSE HAS to make a profit for its shareholders. What you propose is tanking until we get that one special player. Wich means sacrificing revenues for years and risk running a loss.

So the goal of the actual "owners" of the team is to
#1 make a profit
how do they do this? By entertaining the fans by putting a competative product on the floor. By doing this year after year they ensure a safe stream of revenue.

Exactly. Which is why teams sell tickets claiming false hope. "Yes, in 5 years time, we will be a contender, while other teams will be on the decline". Except in reality, teams like LA have been pretty much up there for the last 25 years. Do you think their winning tradition has anything to do with it? What about owners with deep pockets?

This is what some of the fan base has to get through their heads. The owner(s) did not buy the team as a "hobby" like Marc Cuban. It was purchased purely for financial reasons...this is why building through the draft is not even an option for BC. Yes he can add maybe a nice peice or two but nothing that is a complete game changer.

[Kreamy]

We don't need to draft a once in a lifetime prospect to contend for a championship. If we had one or two more players on Bosh's level to go with Calderon and a decent defensive cast, we'd be contenders in the east.

[Mirage]

If winning a championship is the main goal of every team, then every team that currently doesn't have a Kobe Bryant level player should be tanking every season until they draft one (or stockpile enough young assets to trade for one). Clearing cap space for certain key offseasons is also an important thing to be doing (especially for teams that are regarded as "the best" cities to play in).

Of course, the main goal of every team isn't to win a championship, nor should it be. The main goal of every team is to make a profit. The best way to make a profit, for most teams, is to try to win as many games as you can every year. Most teams aspire to make the playoffs, and if possible, maybe even win a playoff round.

As a Raptors fan, I'm happy to watch a team that is trying hard to make the playoffs, and that just might win a playoff round if things go right. That's more fun for me than watching a team intentionally win 20 games or so every year, in the hope of one day lucking into a generational talent (which history has shown you almost always need to win a title in the NBA).

[airellis_23]

Yeah let's just tank for three seasons.

Fans will appreciate it and stick around.

Then those aren't true fans.

So you expect fans to fork over their hard earned money to go watch a crap team. No thanks!
I would wait until the tanking is over then go watch the team play...does that not make me a true fan??

I love the raptors i watch everygame i can
I love the sport....but i would not go purchase tickets or merchandise of the team until they are good, why? because this puts presure on management to put a good product on the floor.

Your logic is flawed...If the ACC remained sold out for 10 years and the team never made the playoffs do to "rebuilding through the draft" what insentive does management have to spend money to keep the good players on the team? There is non because they will not want to fork over millions of dollars for big time players

[Kreamy]

Yeah let's just tank for three seasons.

Fans will appreciate it and stick around.

Then those aren't true fans.

So you expect fans to fork over their hard earned money to go watch a crap team. No thanks!
I would wait until the tanking is over then go watch the team play...does that not make me a true fan??

I love the raptors i watch everygame i can
I love the sport....but i would not go purchase tickets or merchandise of the team until they are good, why? because this puts presure on management to put a good product on the floor.

Your logic is flawed...If the ACC remained sold out for 10 years and the team never made the playoffs do to "rebuilding through the draft" what insentive does management have to spend money to keep the good players on the team? There is non because they will not want to fork over millions of dollars for big time players

Some fans actually enjoy watching young players grow and develop into superstars. I know that if we had the Thunder's roster here, I'd be pretty excited about our growth and the addition of Harden next year. Can anyone here guarantee we make the playoffs next year with the roster we have? What's the difference between winning 33 and 23 games? You're still not making the playoffs.

[inonba]

Today, I just learned the definition of a true fan. It's a person that will buy tickets regardless if the basketball they are watching is any good or not. It's a fan that will willingly fork over money to watch their team get embarrassed night in and night out.

By extension, this is probably the same person that will eat at a restaurant that sells crap in hopes that one day, they can actually make good food. It's a person that will buy an American car, because made in the USA got to mean something.

I've got another term for people like that and it's not a "true fan".

[Raps in 4]

Today, I just learned the definition of a true fan. It's a person that will buy tickets regardless if the basketball they are watching is any good or not. It's a fan that will willingly fork over money to watch their team get embarrassed night in and night out.

By extension, this is probably the same person that will eat at a restaurant that sells crap in hopes that one day, they can actually make good food. It's a person that will buy an American car, because made in the USA got to mean something.

I've got another term for people like that and it's not a "true fan".

My definition of a good team is one that can contend, or shows signs that it will be able to in the future. I find it more painful to watch a treadmill team knowing that it isn't going anywhere than watching a young core develop.

[airellis_23]

Some fans actually enjoy watching young players grow and develop into superstars. I know that if we had the Thunder's roster here, I'd be pretty excited about our growth and the addition of Harden next year. Can anyone here guarantee we make the playoffs next year with the roster we have? What's the difference between winning 33 and 23 games? You're still not making the playoffs.[/quote]

Yes watching young players grow into superstars is awsome if in fact they do live up to their potential. You would be excited right now...but after 4 years of constant loosing the novalty of watching young players grow wears out. To add not every one of those players drafted by the Thunder will be a superstar.

No I cant guerentee that we will make the playoffs this year but not many teams can. If Lebron gets injured for a large part of the season clevland wont make the playoffs. The stars aligned themselves in this fation for san antonio...when the admiral got injured their season went to shreds and they drafted Tim D. There is however no reason to beleive that the roster we have will not make the playoffs.

I ask you this, which scenario is more likely to fill the stands this year and maximize merchandise purchases: #1 portraying that the team has imporved and will/should/might make the playoffs. #2 we trade away CB4 and tank this year so that we can next year draft a player you would enjoy to watch grow.