Trey Lyles Thread

[BringtheD]

Not that it matters much, but I don't see how he fits a need. He's not a backup 5 or stretch 4(not yet), and he's not a 3 in the NBA. Right now he's a backup 4 which is already filled by Trevor Booker. I see him as an upside pick to develop for the future, but I'm not seeing the fills a need part.

by half way through the year it doesn't look like lyles is taking minutes from booker, start working on the punt kick of yours because our gm is going to need one of those. if this pick doesn't work out as he's selling it, he's gone.

Lyle's is 19 years old. It will be several years before we can make judgement on this pick. Also, who is gone? Hope you're not talking about DL, cuz he ain't going nowhere. Utah has put together one of the best young teams in the league, and nobody gets every pick right. As much as I disliked this pick, the reality is there really weren't any obviously better options where we pickd. DL's job is safe regardless of how this pick turns out.

i disagree, he's a lotto pwfwd/stretch 4 picked to replace booker, if it doesn't look like he can do that, lindsey doesn't deserve to have a job. i'm not giving him credit for being lucky on gobert, and i think anyone with a mind would've picked hood that late, so what would he have really done besides get lucky...i don't want a lucky gm, i want a good one.

[Cappy_Smurf]

by half way through the year it doesn't look like lyles is taking minutes from booker, start working on the punt kick of yours because our gm is going to need one of those. if this pick doesn't work out as he's selling it, he's gone.

Lyle's is 19 years old. It will be several years before we can make judgement on this pick. Also, who is gone? Hope you're not talking about DL, cuz he ain't going nowhere. Utah has put together one of the best young teams in the league, and nobody gets every pick right. As much as I disliked this pick, the reality is there really weren't any obviously better options where we pickd. DL's job is safe regardless of how this pick turns out.

i disagree, he's a lotto pwfwd/stretch 4 picked to replace booker, if it doesn't look like he can do that, lindsey doesn't deserve to have a job. i'm not giving him credit for being lucky on gobert, and i think anyone with a mind would've picked hood that late, so what would he have really done besides get lucky...i don't want a lucky gm, i want a good one.

Yeah, you're nuts. Rookies almost never have a significant impact in their first year. Talking about firing DL over what happens with a 19 year old rookie is so ridiculous, you kinda lose all credibility. You should open your mind and consider rethinking some of your opinions.

[BringtheD]

ok dude. tried to be cool, you think a guy that has just wasted our last 3 lotto picks is worth keeping. that's ridiculous imo. and i'm saying, what it looks like the situation is, and not what it actually is. idk, it could be in between, if we end up with something like boozer, and he's telling us we're getting odom, he might be able to keep his job. if plays lyles out of position and lyles goes bust, i fire him, and i don't even think about it twice. anyway, glad you think i had credibility, i don't think most people here do, because most people here think they are smarter than everyone else, otherwise they wouldn't do this ****.

[sipclip]

ok dude. tried to be cool, you think a guy that has just wasted our last 3 lotto picks is worth keeping. that's ridiculous imo. and i'm saying, what it looks like the situation is, and not what it actually is. idk, it could be in between, if we end up with something like boozer, and he's telling us we're getting odom, he might be able to keep his job. if plays lyles out of position and lyles goes bust, i fire him, and i don't even think about it twice. anyway, glad you think i had credibility, i don't think most people here do, because most people here think they are smarter than everyone else, otherwise they wouldn't do this ****.

So you are declaring Exum a bust already and if Lyles isn't a major contributor by half way through midseason he is already a bust. Good to know that young players never get better.

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[BringtheD]

i wasn't talking about exum, i was talking about burke, who is out of position at least for what i wanted. if burke pans out, fine, but why waste 2 lotto picks on a backup pg, with better options on the table. obvious better options imo. and i'm not saying lyles has to be a major contributor, i'm saying what the situation looks like. If it looks like he can't take minutes from booker, than i think that is something you can judge halfway through their first year, kinda like what i think is going on witjh staukas, not saying he's a bust either, just saying.. i doubt lyles goes bust that quick, like that, but if he's out of position and it is terrible, that's going to be a strong indication that lindsey really don't know what he's doing, imo, it's good enough to say he don't know what he's doing. we're not there yet, i'm saying watch out.
btw, i like lyles, i never thought of him in the way that lindsey is selling him, so we'll see, as someone said, there are alot of if's on this pick.
anyway, i think of trey as two lotto picks even though it was really one, also, i think i would've made the same picks twolves made, pretty sure about that, and they are happy with their guys, and we're not...i haven't watched them much at all, but from what i hear, they are happy with the deal, and from the little i've seen, they are nba players, because i wouldn't pick us someone out of position or who didn't belong in the nba. lindsey may be getting too smart for himself. thats what i know i could do as a gm, because i do it from my couch, alone, without the resources of lindsey, so i expect better than what I think I could do myself. i don't think that's unreasonable.
i wasn't trying to ruffle anyones feathers by making it sound like i thought lindsey wasted apcik on dante, i would've picked him from what i know, and from what i've seen, ya, he's a bigger project than we all thought, but he has tremendous upside that i believe in. so i apologize, i didn't realize i said three lotto picks and people would think i was talking about dante, dont know why i said that, or why anyone would think dante is a wasted pick...thats not someplace i've ever gone and don't want to visit it, honestly, don't think i ever will either.
so so sorry fellow board memebers for sounding like a jerk when i said three lotto picks, and now i've spilled the beans, but this is my hot take of the pick and lindseys situation...
as for lyeles, we have the potential to have the best fc in the league, maybe one that rivals some of the greatest, and i'm sticking with that until i see something that makes me change my mind.

[Dry Fly]

Lyles fits a need really good.

Not that it matters much, but I don't see how he fits a need. He's not a backup 5 or stretch 4(not yet), and he's not a 3 in the NBA. Right now he's a backup 4 which is already filled by Trevor Booker. I see him as an upside pick to develop for the future, but I'm not seeing the fills a need part.

He will be a stretch 4, perimeter defender. Rudy and Favs struggle defending the perimeter and Booker wasn't much better.

Granted he isn't there yet.

[Cappy_Smurf]

Lyles fits a need really good.

Not that it matters much, but I don't see how he fits a need. He's not a backup 5 or stretch 4(not yet), and he's not a 3 in the NBA. Right now he's a backup 4 which is already filled by Trevor Booker. I see him as an upside pick to develop for the future, but I'm not seeing the fills a need part.

He will be a stretch 4, perimeter defender. Rudy and Favs struggle defending the perimeter and Booker wasn't much better.

Granted he isn't there yet.

Potential =/= filling a need.

[BringtheD]

theres alot of smart people on this board...i appreciate everything and especially the things i've learned from my fellow board members.

[zimpy27]

Lyles does fill a need though.

He is filling Kanters role, which was subsequently taken up by 10-15 mins of Jeremy Evans/Cooley. Gobert and Favors will drop 5 minutes of playing time each to give them 29 each and Booker and Lyles 19 each.

[Dry Fly]

Not that it matters much, but I don't see how he fits a need. He's not a backup 5 or stretch 4(not yet), and he's not a 3 in the NBA. Right now he's a backup 4 which is already filled by Trevor Booker. I see him as an upside pick to develop for the future, but I'm not seeing the fills a need part.

He will be a stretch 4, perimeter defender. Rudy and Favs struggle defending the perimeter and Booker wasn't much better.

Granted he isn't there yet.

Potential =/= filling a need.

Sure it does... potentially.

[BringtheD]

Lyles fits a need really good.

Not that it matters much, but I don't see how he fits a need. He's not a backup 5 or stretch 4(not yet), and he's not a 3 in the NBA. Right now he's a backup 4 which is already filled by Trevor Booker. I see him as an upside pick to develop for the future, but I'm not seeing the fills a need part.

My biggest concern with the pick is that I haven't heard anyone say that Lyles has a lot of upside, and I agree with Cappy that Lyles doesn't fill a need (PG, outside shooter, backup center).

If Lyles' comp is in fact Jason Thompson, and we passed up Booker who met a need an could end up being a mishmash of Korver and Klay Thomspon, I might go into a turrets fit of profanity at some point.

For those who think that Lyles is a better version of Horford or Odom, stop ingesting whatever it is you've been taking, its time to sober up.

i wouldn't worry about lyles upside, i thought he'd be good as soon as i saw him put the ball on the floor at the top of the key and go by about 3 people on his way to scoring. i stopped wondering if he had alot of upside after one play. hope that makes you feel better, but can't tell you much more about him, I kinda stopped watching him after that, i already knew enough, if that is what you mean by upside. my thinking was as simple as does what i just saw work in the nba, and i was not worried that it wouldn't, i actually thought he would be a good fit and we';d be lucky to get him...that was that, he was good enough for the nba and would fit next to favors and gobert. it had to be the easiest and quickest decisions i made on any of the prospects we were looking at, or on any prospect i've ever considered for the jazz, for that matter. so i didn't study up on him and can't tell you more. i am glad i didn't have to watch alot of him and spend time wondering how good he'd be, because it was obvious talent. at least i know lindsey and i are looking at the same thing. i'm just worried that lindsey reasoning is as simple as mine, but it doesn't sound like it is, and he is taking this pick down the right road because thats what i saw and liked, and thats what lindsey is selling..thanks for reminding me of how i came to my decision on lyles, it was awhile ago. prbly would've studied moreof him but kentucky forwards, meh, obviously not smart of me, but i hve an on off relationship w kentucky, it was off, now its on again.

[JazzMatt13]

Realistic Options:

Lyles Kentucky
Booker Kentucky
Payne Murrya State
Oubre Kansas
Rozier Louisville
Dekker Wisconsin
Grant ND

It was obviously a toss up between Booker and Lyles. Why get a 6'6 Shooting Guard at 205 pounds, when we got Alec Burks, with Millsap and Ingles ready in standby.

We look at our "bigs situation", we all know we are missing 1 big. It takes 4 guys, we have Favors, Gobert and Booker. Lyles fills out nicely in that 4 man rotation.

I go back to Corbin's rotation: Al and Paul starters, Favors first rotation and Kanter mostly when Al and Paul rest at same time, overall gets like 15 minutes per game with a few minutes with Millsap or Al. That is were Lyles goes, he will bench as 2nd sub in. However, I expected a big Center, but he will work out better as a Center in small ball, rather than another 7 footer. Now we have variety.


Starters:

Exum - Burks - Hayward - Favors - Gobert

When bench all rotated in:

Burke - Ingles - Hood - Booker - Lyles


This is perfect cause Favors and Gobert can play Twin Towers, and individual Centers with Booker and Lyles.

Devin Booker, he would just replace Ingles position, and I think there is plenty of guys out there who can play the 2 for us.

[JazzMatt13]

Lyles will replace Evans who I don't think will remain on this team next season. A smaller guy who can play big ball. I am hoping he can be like a bigger version of Draymond Green. Just a do it all guy who can play 3-5, and learns to play small ball, but is full blown defense guy.

I know its nice drafting someone who can easily replace current starter, but I like filling out the bench. I think he is a freaking steal, an all-american mcdonald from Kentucky. Played the 3, 48% FG, 9 points 5 rebounds a game with 23 mpg over 36 games. That is a great sample size.

We will probably keep Cotton, Millsap and Ingles, so no need for Devin Booker. However, Booker was an interesting prospect. He played 21.5 mpg, had 10 points a game, with 41% 3 point shooting. He could have been turned into a shooter for us. I just think Jazz feel like Millsap has the potential to do just as good, or finding someone who can.

[Cappy_Smurf]

He will be a stretch 4, perimeter defender. Rudy and Favs struggle defending the perimeter and Booker wasn't much better.

Granted he isn't there yet.

Potential =/= filling a need.

Sure it does... potentially.

Maybe someday =/= does

[Dry Fly]

Potential =/= filling a need.

Sure it does... potentially.

Maybe someday =/= does

Maybe. I guess the point I was trying to make is that he obviously doesn't fill a need like a FA vet but he is targeted to fill that stretch 4 perimeter defending big long term. After all isn't any 19 year old pick pretty much a work in progress? How many rookies step in and fill a role on a established team? It's rare, and to surmise that was my premise is a little whack.

[idajazz]

I just love how everyone already knows how Lyles will turn out.
hasn't even had a practice......

[BringtheD]

i think we got a 7ft sullinger, that's pretty exciting to think about, can't believe i didn't think about it earlier...looks like the celtics are screwed with what they got. don't know why lindsey would take ainge outback to the tool shed for no reason, but that's what a good gm would do i guess first impressions do matter. i always knew lindsey was lucky, now i'm beginning to think he is good again...genuis...if my analysis is even close to being accurate, lyeles can eat all the big macs he wants and we still got a whopper if 7ft sullinger is his floor, what is his ceiling if he just lays off the big macs, passes, and rebounds, better d--idk, pretty damn good player that is bpa by far. he'll have to work on his ball handling on the perimeter, no problem there for someone who can do what he does. his shooting needs to get better, but it is comparable to sullinger as well, they are the same kind of athlete, lyles should be comfortable scoring from anywhere inside 18ft if and his shot is good from there as i've seen and his ball handling and vision in the lane is superior for his size as is being sold which i know is the truth. he can work on being a stretch 4, out to 3pt line, ya..he might have a hard time keeping up with the draymonds but i don't think it kills us either. i guess that's the stretch 4 lindsey got us, i knew lyeles had to have talent to see him so far back in the draft, because his ball handling and vision in the lane is really going to work out well at the nba level, and those kind of athletes are good scoreres and not easy to come by, esp when they are nearly 7ft tall. right now his face up skills aren't going to beat many people off his dribble i don't think he's ever going to be a player like that, however once he becomes a better shooter he will be able to easily pull off what sullinger does, spin around his defender and once he does that his skills that made us draft him will take over...he'll be very effective off the elbow or anywhere inside of 18ft on the court.

[Catchall]

My issue with Devin Booker is that he hasn't shown he can rebound. If you remember back to the Randy Foye days, the fact that Foye didn't rebound really hurt the Jazz, even though Foye broke 3-pt shooting records. Every abysmal Jazz line-up in terms of +/- had Randy Foye in it. It wasn't just Jamaal Tinsley or Earl Watson. This is one of the reasons that I don't think Booker would have beaten Hood in the rotation. Hood rebounds, pushes the ball and creates for others.

Also, Booker is a good shooter with his feet set and his shoulders squared, but he isn't a good shooter on the move or off balance in any way. He isn't good off the bounce and hasn't shown to be great at creating his own shot. Quite a few pundits really preferred Hunter to Booker for this reason. Then there's passing and getting in the lane, which Booker didn't do either, and all of a sudden Booker looks like a risky pick.

The versatile PF meme is really the right direction for the Jazz to go. It surprises me a bit that Kevon Looney somehow broke in half during the pre-draft process, but Lyles is right there in terms of talent. The other thing with Lyles, is that I don't think he's ever really worked on his body. He was known as being a bit overweight in the past. If the Jazz can get him worked out, he can definitely improve his athleticism.

With Oubre, the feedback seems to be that he has all the physical potential in the world, but he's never really been taught how to play the game. So it's a question if he can develop an IQ and fit in on a team. Then he shows up wearing Gucci and talking smack, and it raises more questions.

I understand the Lyles pick for sure.

[Cappy_Smurf]

Potential =/= filling a need.

Sure it does... potentially.

Maybe someday =/= does

Maybe. I guess the point I was trying to make is that he obviously doesn't fill a need like a FA vet but he is targeted to fill that stretch 4 perimeter defending big long term. After all isn't any 19 year old pick pretty much a work in progress? How many rookies step in and fill a role on a established team? It's rare, and to surmise that was my premise is a little whack.

Whack is calling 3rd string PF a need. Olivier also fills a need at 4th string PG. The stampede probably need players, so I guess if we draft a guy to play the whole year in the d-league, he's filling a need. I get the whole trying to be positive thing, but by your definition, Utah could draft a water boy, and he would fill a need cuz everybody needs water.

[Cappy_Smurf]

Lyles does fill a need though.

He is filling Kanters role, which was subsequently taken up by 10-15 mins of Jeremy Evans/Cooley. Gobert and Favors will drop 5 minutes of playing time each to give them 29 each and Booker and Lyles 19 each.

He's our 3rd string PF. Lots of fans are going to be really disappointed if they expect this kid to fill Kanter's role.