Burks and Hood

[KqWIN]

Let's get some discussion going on our players this year. Three discussion points.

1. Do you prefer one player over the other? Is it situational?

2. What are your expectations for them this year? Where do they rank versus other wings in the NBA?

3. What are your longterm expectations? How much room do they have to improve?

[Winglish]

1. I prefer Rodney Hood in almost every situation because he's a better team player and a FAR better defensive player and a better shooter and a better passer and has a higher basketball IQ. I like Alec Burks if I need somebody to break down the defense with dribble penetration.

2. I expect Rod Hood to be 15 and 6 and I expect Alec Burks to maintain a good attitude while carrying the second unit. They are middle of the pack wings right now.

3. I expect Rod Hood will eventually be a borderline all-star player and a top 25 NBA scorer. I expect Alec Burks to become Jordan Crawford, the guy who can light it up at anytime off the bench.

[JazzMatt13]

1. Do you prefer one player over the other? Is it situational?

Hood is the type of steal you dream of. He is the perfect project player, I believe he will be capable of being starting wing, easily this season. I wouldn't trade him for no one.

Burks I feel he lacks a desire to be an overall solid player, I am afraid his defense won't be good enough to start.

2. What are your expectations for them this year? Where do they rank versus other wings in the NBA?

Hood coming off Rookie year, I personally don't think he is that much behind a Jabari Parker. If given 25 minutes this season, I bet he comes out as one of the best guys in his 2nd season.

Burks, I use to think he was a top SG, looking at Kobe (premier SG), the only thing Burks has is the penetration, but then Burks lacks all the other stuff. He can't run the ball, can't shoot as good as most SGs, and don't think he can handle the defense, make others better, or really handle offense on his own, at least as a starter. He is gonna be like those vets who come in off bench, and run around weak defenders. Like Corey Brewer, dude made at least 50 bucks last season out smarting weak defenses, mostly on the break. Not great player but he scored you some points.

3. What are your longterm expectations? How much room do they have to improve?

I really think Hood is capable of being just as good Hayward. He is head strong, very humble, and his skill level shows that he is really damn smart. A lot of guys are smart, but can't translate it, Hood can adapt to anything. Looking at Dwight Howard, you can have all the tools, but if you don't apply yourself, your just an over-hyped loser. Hood is opposite, and when we get him hungry, I think he will be scary good, like Gobert.

Burks, I feel like Kanter is a "could of, should of" pick, like I would probably repick if I could. Like, Carter-Williams, they shine in the flashy stuff so people easily think they are good, but really, they lack a ton of things, including fundamentals that all 1's and 2's should know. I just don't know if Burks can improve upon his current state, at least not to a top 5 guard or scorer.

[stitches]

Let's get some discussion going on our players this year. Three discussion points.

1. Do you prefer one player over the other? Is it situational?

For me it's not as easy as it seem to most people(at least from what I've seen). I want to see Hood do what he was doing at the end of the season for a full season. I love what I saw post-all-star break. I think he is precisely what we need - volume 3p shooter, who can also create off the dribble and defend a bit(I still think he needs improvements there). With Burks - I want to see what Snyder can do with him and if he can mold him into the player we need him to be, or if he'd be stubborn and unable/unwilling to change. Alec needs to fall out of love with the super exciting but overall crappy and inefficient drives to the rim(especially the baseline ones when he has a wide open 3p shot). He needs to start taking more of the open 3s instead of putting it on the floor and trying to go to the rim for a contested layup. The open 3 is better shot for him than the contested ones at the rim. He shot 43% and 42% on catch and shoot 3s last couple of seasons(1.25 ppp). and 37% and 47.5% on drives to the rim last two years. Even if you take the higher number you can (~0.95ppp) the difference is staggering. I also think if he starts shooting more 3s and keeps his efficiency it will open up his driving game as well... I'm really high on Burks offensive potential(higher than on Hood's), I'm just not sure he will reach it.

Quite honestly I will be alright if either starts. I will be alright if both start(no real PG system - 3 playmaking and shooting wings + 2 bigs). With the things they've shown so far, I'd lean towards starting Hood, but I think it's close.

2. What are your expectations for them this year? Where do they rank versus other wings in the NBA?

I expect Burks to start the season. If he doesn't change his ways(quite honestly I expect him to NOT change), I expect him to lose his starting spot by the end of the season and . In the off-chance that he shows willingness and ability to adapt his game towards what we need of him, I expect him to emerge as one of the nice starting SGs(maybe even above average) in the league.

I expect Hood to continue improving his game, I expect him to take over the starting spot at some point this coming season and turn into undoubtedly one of the steals of last year's draft(he already is in my mind, but he will receive national recognition). I think he can be about average starting SG this year.

3. What are your longterm expectations? How much room do they have to improve?

Long term Burks - if Burks can adapt and improve defense(again the scenario I don't expect) - I think he can be a top 5 SG(all-star level) in the league(think DeMar DeRozan WITH A SHOT). In case he doesn't adapt and improve D(the scenario I expect), he will be a good 6th man for his career.

Long term Hood - I can't see him failing. I think he's established an extremely high floor from the very beginning, from his rookie year. I guess if he keeps getting injured, that could derail his career, but if he's well health-wise, I see him as a top 10 SG in the league(borderline all-star, might get a selection in the best of his years).

[KqWIN]

1. Do you prefer one player over the other? Is it situational?

I am torn between the two, but for I will go with Rodney Hood because he has been a significantly better defender thus far. It's difficult to definitely say how good they are right now. We only have a small sample size of Hood playing well, and the last time we saw Alec his play was bogged down by a bad shoulder. Hood is definitely a winning player, Alec is still just a talent at this point. Hood really turned the corner after recovering from injury, I'm willing to give Alec that same opportunity. Both have talked about how much they've learned from the sidelines.

Now that Trey is the starter I think Hood has to start. Trey Burke is not good for Alec's game. Burke is going to dominate the ball and won't leave many opportunities with the ball for other players. Hood is the type of player that can shoot 5+ three's a game. That is what the starting needs more than anything. Unless Burke changes, that 3rd perimeter player is going to get squeezed and not see the ball very much.

With that said, Alec was actually very good as a minimal player. His TS% was 61% in the starting lineup last season. The problem with that is that his usage was only about 15%. That's not using Alec to his full ability. He needs to be at around 25% to really shine.



2. What are your expectations for them this year? Where do they rank versus other wings in the NBA?

By the end of the year, I think people will be talking about the Jazz having one of the better wing rotations in the league. The position is very weak around the league. That may seem crazy at first, but ask yourself how wing rotations you prefer over ours. There's definitely not 10, much closer to 5.

Burks will most likely be the starter entering camp, but I think Hood is more likely to be the starter at the end of the year. Hood will get some hype around the league as one of the best young wings in the league. Beal, Oladipo, and the Greek Freak have been seen as rising stars, but none of them actually strike me as great players yet. It's all relative. If Hood does what he did at the end of last year for all of next season I don't see why he's can't be in that group. If he comes back better...lookout.

Burks has a real chance at a breakout season, but I wouldn't have that as my expectation. I think his season will be somewhat similar to his 13/14 season. This time, he won't have the terrible first month and he'll show some more effort on defense. If he does that, he might be the best bench wing besides Igoudala. I'm confident that the defensive culture will rub off on him. Even Trey played very hard on defense by the end of last season.



3. What are your longterm expectations? How much room do they have to improve?

Between the two of them, I really like our chances of getting a real impact player.

If he can stay healthy, Hood is definitely going to be a good player down the road. The question for me is if he's a guy that can carry an offense for an entire game or if he's just a good compliment to a great player. I've mentioned before that Burks, Hood, and Hayward are actually more similar than different. My high expectation for Hood is what Hayward is doing now. Hood will never match Hayward's physical ability, but his short game is already better than Hayward's has ever been. My low end expectation for him is a Chandler Parsons with more ball handling/playmaking ability.

Burks definitely has more variance. For him it's all about learning how to play smart and how to stay locked in on defense. He has all the talent in the world but no idea how to use it. His ability to attack the rim is special and his shooting ability is better than even he realizes. I really hope Quin and the staff can work their magic on him because he can be a great player.

I don't expect him to be worse than he was in 13/14 so my low end expectation is just a strong 6th man. My high end on him is a high volume, high efficiency scorer who also defends his position well. Maybe Jimmy Butler with a little more usage and a little less defense? It would not surprise me at all if he becomes a 20+ point scorer at some point, even if it happens next year. My guess is that he lands somewhere in between. He'll probably end up in Demar Derozan/Corey Maggette territory. Neither gave you much besides scoring, but that still holds some value. I'm really hoping he comes out next year with a Harden-esque shot distribution.

[babyjax13]

My expectations are probably a bit reversed from everyone else, but I think people have fallen for Hood because he is shiny and new (although his last month was REALLY impressive).

1. Do you prefer one player over the other? Is it situational?

I like them both a lot, but if Alec's 3 point shooting last season stays consistent and he is as aggressive offensively as he was before, I think he will easily be the better of the two, and probably be the highest scorer on the team. The expectations I had for him going into last season - that he would be our top scorer - have not changed much (although Hayward became much more efficient than I thought he would).

2. What are your expectations for them this year? Where do they rank versus other wings in the NBA?

I will echo what has already been said, our trioka at the wings plus Millsap and Jingles place us as a top 10 team on the wings by year's end.

3. Long term:
I think Alec has the higher ceiling, but man both of these guys can really score. I like that we have 3 wing players capable of averaging 16+ ppg. I think our offense will look much better with these guys all healthy.

My expectations for Hood is that he becomes that super sixth man that lights it up from the bench, probably a 6MOTY candidate every season. Alec I think will be a top 5-8 shooting guard in the league [that is the weakest position in the league now, so that isn't a huge compliment, but still nice to have]. I think that this happens sooner rather than later.

[Stern Fixer]

Tough question as I like both players a whole lot. Probably like Hood just a little more as a starter because he seems a little more team oriented to me. Also, like the idea of Burks coming off the bench as an energy guy/scorer, for those times when our offense is stagnating.

[KqWIN]

Alec needs to fall out of love with the super exciting but overall crappy and inefficient drives to the rim(especially the baseline ones when he has a wide open 3p shot). He needs to start taking more of the open 3s instead of putting it on the floor and trying to go to the rim for a contested layup. The open 3 is better shot for him than the contested ones at the rim. He shot 43% and 42% on catch and shoot 3s last couple of seasons(1.25 ppp). and 37% and 47.5% on drives to the rim last two years. Even if you take the higher number you can (~0.95ppp) the difference is staggering. I also think if he starts shooting more 3s and keeps his efficiency it will open up his driving game as well... I'm really high on Burks offensive potential(higher than on Hood's), I'm just not sure he will reach it.

Sometimes he reminds me of Trent Richardson into the teeth of the defense over and over...Just run through the hole instead! He needs to learn how to pick and choose his battles, but in order to do that, he needs to understand what a weapon his three point shot is. I would like to see him double his three point attempts, but they should come at the expense of his mid range shots and wild floaters. The team PPP on his drives (1.15) was still decent in the down year, in large part because they lead to open 3's.

The three point shot opens up the drive and the drive opens up the three point shot. It doesn't have to be so hard. By simplifying his game he can become a great player. I just can't wait to see the offense when we have 2 or 3 guys who can do both and make the pass on the floor at the same time.

[AingesBurner]

Burks is gonna swag it up and be more efficient as well, I expect him to be competing for lead scorer on our team, this team has never had a player like Burks, we have complained weve never had a player like Burks and now that we do, we complain that hes too inefficient, stop being so finicky Jazz fans. Im excited to see Burks and Hayward play off each other.

[AingesBurner]

Also has anyone thought how exciting this line up would be:
Burks-Hood-Hayward-Favors/Lyles-Gobert?

[Daddy 801]

I was higher on Burks at the beginning of last season more than anyone. Then Quin came along and changed everything because it wasn't just leave guys on the floor and let them see what happens like Corbin. If Burks can learn to play within the system like Hood was doing he could become really good in my opinion. But it seems the major fear is he won't and he will drive to the rim on every possession. I believe he will learn and see how valuable it is to be more efficient(take more 3's). I honestly have no idea if Burks or Hood would be a more efficient second unit sixth man. I'm just excited to have Burks back and see what Quin can do.


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[Luigi]

Burks is gonna swag it up and be more efficient as well, I expect him to be competing for lead scorer on our team, this team has never had a player like Burks, we have complained weve never had a player like Burks and now that we do, we complain that hes too inefficient, stop being so finicky Jazz fans. Im excited to see Burks and Hayward play off each other.

I agree.

I like Hood, but I don't think he has as many NBA skills as are making him out to have. I don't think he's going to be great at putting the ball on the floor, or great at defending on the perimeter. His shot is good, but it needs to get into elite range for him to be an above average starter in the NBA.

Burks isn't the shooter that Hood is, but he's obviously better at putting the ball on the floor. His finishing numbers aren't as good as they could be, but his dribble penetration disrupts the defense more than Hoods long range threat does. Team offense begins as soon as someone beats their man (on or off the ball). Burks gives us more there than Hood does. He has better vision and defense as well. And he's proved more to me than Hood. I think we're addicted to youthful hope as a fan base right now.

I still take dribble penetration over long balls, I don't think the three pointer is so efficient on its own, especially without elite accuracy. Even with elite accuracy, you gotta have the handle to back it up.

[AingesBurner]

Burks is gonna swag it up and be more efficient as well, I expect him to be competing for lead scorer on our team, this team has never had a player like Burks, we have complained weve never had a player like Burks and now that we do, we complain that hes too inefficient, stop being so finicky Jazz fans. Im excited to see Burks and Hayward play off each other.

I agree.

I like Hood, but I don't think he has as many NBA skills as are making him out to have. I don't think he's going to be great at putting the ball on the floor, or great at defending on the perimeter. His shot is good, but it needs to get into elite range for him to be an above average starter in the NBA.

Burks isn't the shooter that Hood is, but he's obviously better at putting the ball on the floor. His finishing numbers aren't as good as they could be, but his dribble penetration disrupts the defense more than Hoods long range threat does. Team offense begins as soon as someone beats their man (on or off the ball). Burks gives us more there than Hood does. He has better vision and defense as well. And he's proved more to me than Hood. I think we're addicted to youthful hope as a fan base right now.

I still take dribble penetration over long balls, I don't think the three pointer is so efficient on its own, especially without elite accuracy. Even with elite accuracy, you gotta have the handle to back it up.

I agree with what you have stated, people forget Burks sat next to the coaches almost every game, I think his cerebral play aka his IQ has probably gotten better by just sitting and listening to what the coaches have to say.

[Cappy_Smurf]

Also has anyone thought how exciting this line up would be:
Burks-Hood-Hayward-Favors/Lyles-Gobert?

Let's not jump the gun with Lyles. Your implication here is an insult to Favors.

[AingesBurner]

Also has anyone thought how exciting this line up would be:
Burks-Hood-Hayward-Favors/Lyles-Gobert?

Let's not jump the gun with Lyles. Your implication here is an insult to Favors.

Im not saying I think Lyles is better or will be, Im just saying that either one if that line up makes me moist

[SoCalJazzFan]

Burks isn't the shooter that Hood is, but he's obviously better at putting the ball on the floor. His finishing numbers aren't as good as they could be, but his dribble penetration disrupts the defense more than Hoods long range threat does. Team offense begins as soon as someone beats their man (on or off the ball). Burks gives us more there than Hood does. He has better vision and defense as well. And he's proved more to me than Hood. I think we're addicted to youthful hope as a fan base right now.

I still take dribble penetration over long balls, I don't think the three pointer is so efficient on its own, especially without elite accuracy. Even with elite accuracy, you gotta have the handle to back it up.

This is where statistical analysis based on the true shooting percentage and points per shot breaks down on 3pt shots vs drives. If you have a player that can effectively take it to the rim, it creates all of kinds of problems for the opponent in fearing for a particular player fouling out, switching defensive assignments or even adjusting their overall defensive approach.

[Luigi]

This is where statistical analysis based on the true shooting percentage and points per shot breaks down on 3pt shots vs drives. If you have a player that can effectively take it to the rim, it creates all of kinds of problems for the opponent in fearing for a particular player fouling out, switching defensive assignments or even adjusting their overall defensive approach.

Yes. The Spurs made the three look great (especially from the corner) by having elite ball penetration from lightning fast Tony Parker, who has no range to speak of, and Manu Ginobili. Not to mention a very nice post threat in Duncan, often with another big without range on the floor. The Warriors shooters also have very threatening dribble drives on top of fantastic accuracy. Adding in more 3 point attempts without getting the right things to open them up correctly is very inefficient (I think about the Pierce Walker Celtics being the best version of that). "Stretch the floor" is overused now.

[KqWIN]

I wouldn't say that Burks has better vision or is a better defender. Hood isn't as talented as Burks, but he's probably the more productive player. Making the simple play goes along way. Hood is already one of the best pick and roll ball handlers in the league. He plays with incredible patience and makes good decisions. Hood is underrated with the ball just as Burks is underrated as a shooter. Like I said before, they're much more similar than different. The difference for me is defense. Burks hasn't shown the focus or determination to be an average defender yet. Hopefully the defensive culture rubs off on him as it's had with Hood.

[Cappy_Smurf]

Also has anyone thought how exciting this line up would be:
Burks-Hood-Hayward-Favors/Lyles-Gobert?

Let's not jump the gun with Lyles. Your implication here is an insult to Favors.

Im not saying I think Lyles is better or will be, Im just saying that either one if that line up makes me moist

Faves is a borderline all star. You're either underrating him severely here, or overrating Lyles, or both.

[AingesBurner]

Let's not jump the gun with Lyles. Your implication here is an insult to Favors.

Im not saying I think Lyles is better or will be, Im just saying that either one if that line up makes me moist

Faves is a borderline all star. You're either underrating him severely here, or overrating Lyles, or both.

I dont think you get what Im sayin bro.