TrueHoop: actual "synergy" metric, anyone know how made?

Post #1 » by **Doctor MJ** » Fri Apr 18, 2014 1:24 am

TrueHoop has an article talking about Durant & Westbrook's problematic synergy by actually referring to a synergy stat. And to be clear were not talking about the Synergy website, we're talking about a specific stat on this:

http://espn.go.com/blog/truehoop/post/_ ... ck-synergy

In my head I've been thinking of making such a stat based on pair RAPM relative to individual performance, so I'm kinda hoping it's that, but it's weird to me to see it presented for the first time by ESPN and done without any explanation like people ought to simply trust it.

Anyone know?

Nivek · Post #2 » by **Nivek** » Tue May 6, 2014 1:25 pm

This is very weird. There oughta be some explanation, even if they're not going to give away full details on how it's calculated.

SideshowBob · Post #3 » by **SideshowBob** » Wed May 7, 2014 3:08 pm

I thought it might just be some variation on J.E.'s player pair data.

The OKC numbers seems to match up with what Abbott was referring to. Too bad he's not on here.

Amen316 · Post #4 » by **Amen316** » Mon May 26, 2014 7:23 am

I do not think this article is spurned from Abbott it actually sounds like the way a very popular person named Dean Oliver whom works as an Analytics guy at ESPN speaks when he is describing the two. I could be wrong but I doubt this word came from Abbott

Post #5 » by **Doctor MJ** » Sun Jun 1, 2014 11:10 pm

Amen316 wrote:I do not think this article is spurned from Abbott it actually sounds like the way a very popular person named Dean Oliver whom works as an Analytics guy at ESPN speaks when he is describing the two. I could be wrong but I doubt this word came from Abbott

Well no stats come from Abbott. I have no doubt this stat originates with a real stats guy, but there's no source given.

Post #6 » by **Doctor MJ** » Sun Jun 1, 2014 11:29 pm

SideshowBob wrote:I thought it might just be some variation on J.E.'s player pair data.

The OKC numbers seems to match up with what Abbott was referring to. Too bad he's not on here.

I have similar thoughts. Basically take the two individual RAPM numbers and subtract from the pair number and you'll get something meaningful about synergy.

blabla · Post #7 » by **blabla** » Mon Jun 2, 2014 8:27 am

Doctor MJ wrote:
SideshowBob wrote:I thought it might just be some variation on J.E.'s player pair data.

The OKC numbers seems to match up with what Abbott was referring to. Too bad he's not on here.

I have similar thoughts. Basically take the two individual RAPM numbers and subtract from the pair number and you'll get something meaningful about synergy.

The problem is that all research that so far went into player pairs in lineup (+/-) data showed that all 'synergy' effects we see are nothing but noise. Seems counterintuitive, but it is what it is

Post #8 » by **Doctor MJ** » Mon Jun 2, 2014 2:12 pm

blabla wrote:
Doctor MJ wrote:
SideshowBob wrote:I thought it might just be some variation on J.E.'s player pair data.

The OKC numbers seems to match up with what Abbott was referring to. Too bad he's not on here.

I have similar thoughts. Basically take the two individual RAPM numbers and subtract from the pair number and you'll get something meaningful about synergy.

The problem is that all research that so far went into player pairs in lineup (+/-) data showed that all 'synergy' effects we see are nothing but noise. Seems counterintuitive, but it is what it is

That's a shame.

To be clear, I see nothing counterintuitive about it. It just means the sample size is lacking, else there'd be good data there. It's understandable though why there might not be enough sample size.