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Kevin Seraphin

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Post#1411 Re: Kevin Seraphin
Tue Nov 6, 2012 1:14 pm by hands11

Chocolate City Jordanaire wrote:SunKing, I wanted a couple other players when Kevin Seraphin was drafted. I didn't know much about Kevin and I thought a buyout from Cholet might be expensive. However, it didn't take me long to change my opinion about Kevin.

From this very first press conference I have liked him a lot. :)




Big dude looked ready to go. He's not soft. He's very enthusiastic. I can tell having watched his game evolve that Kevin Seraphin is a thinker and he is rapidly evolving on the court. I believe he should rebound better, but his offense is much better than what he's shown so far IMO.

The one thing I do like about the Nene trade is that it brought the right veteran to help Kevin. I think Okafor won't be in front of Kevin for long in the rotation, or if he is Seraphin will be the one finishing games.


It doesn't matter to me so much who starts. But I do believe they need to divide them up so they match well in the pairings. I have posted about that before.

While Kevin and Nene may play great together, I would want to maximize and balance the line ups.

Nene/Okafor and Kevin, Ves
Nene/Ves and Kevin/Oakfor

I think Booker needs to play with a taller player or if he is out there with a rebounder like Okafor or Barron, they need their best scoring ball handling guards and SFs with him. Booker fits in better one they have Wall back. Same is true of Beal and probably Webster. I think Web will look a lot better once he can spot up for open shots. Then he can drive off the pump fakes.

I think the front court combinations will be a lot easier when they add Nene back to the line up. Nene is a more experienced Kevin and we saw what adding Kevin back did for them. Plus Nene is a good passer.

Its not a bad roster really. They are just missing two really really important pieces that make the other support pieces better.
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Post#1412 Re: Kevin Seraphin
Tue Nov 6, 2012 1:24 pm by hands11

tontoz wrote:Kevin's offensive efficiency is compromised by the fact that he rarely attacks the basket/gets to the foul line. While he has a very good hook shot with both hands he isn't going to shoot over 60% consistently with them. He needs to get more easy looks to be truly efficient for a big man.

The good news is that he seems to have already mastered the hard part, hitting hooks and midrange jumpers. That is much harder than learning up and under moves or basic drives the basket.


Exactly. One thing at a time.

He needs to just keep taking the shots he is and to focus on rebounding better which he did last game. He did say that one one thing he worked on over the summer.

Once the shots are challenged more and the double teams come, he will need to adjust. Good news is.. Nene can help him with that since he is a good passer. Nene also knows when to drive so he can teach him that as well.

That's when the monster dunks are going to start to happen. I can't wait. :wink:

It was a rough preseason without Wall, Nene and then Kevin. We are getting a late start as far as having the players we needed out there so the fans could be more positive about the team. But Kevin only missed on regular season game and come back a week ahead of schedule. With him back, we have something to rally around which is nice.
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Post#1413 Re: Kevin Seraphin
Tue Nov 6, 2012 1:38 pm by dobrojim

hands11 wrote:
FAH1223 wrote:Kevin has also only been playing basketball for a few years. The fact that he's this good speaks volumes to how much he works.

He really might be the best pick Ernie has made or will make in his tenure here in Washington.

The good sign was that the Spurs wanted to draft him in 2010... and the Spurs needed and still need a defensive bruiser next to Duncan. I'm glad we snatched him where we did. He's going to get better and I think he'll really take off.

The best thing about Wittman is he has given this guy a shot.


From what I remember, they did some nice trade day moves to jump ahead of SA to get him. EG doesn't get enough props for that.


I don't recall any extra moves being necessary. It's perfectly fair to criticize EG for the
need to blow up the team, but the Hinrich trade was a thing of beauty for us.
Got 2/3rds season of KH for 8-9 million (yearly rate) for the rights to Vladimir Veremenko (sp?).
Also got CHI's first rnd pick which was KS. Then when we traded KH, we got ATL's first rnd pick
(Chris Singleton) and Crawford, Mo Evans, Bibby and some forgettable big(iirc). All for the rights to VV.
And the willingness to pay KH for season -> trading deadline.
A lot of what we call 'thought' is just mental activity
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Post#1414 Re: Kevin Seraphin
Tue Nov 6, 2012 2:48 pm by montestewart

There was also buying out Bibby (was that $4 million or less, I forget). It looked good on paper, but took KS a while to develop, and by the time he started to look like something last year, the play of Crawford and Singleton indicated that they might not be important pieces in the future. I'll be surprised if Crawford ever works out, but Singleton may eventually be an OK player. Regardless, Seraphin looks good, and he looks like he might one day turn out to be something special. Even if he doesn't, that was still the kind of bold move I wish was the rule rather than the exception here. It was definitely a good trade. Was it Leonsis' call or EG's?

(PS: When the team bought out Bibby, how did that "something for nothing" get by Leonsis?)
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Post#1415 Re: Kevin Seraphin
Tue Nov 6, 2012 7:36 pm by closg00

Kevin made Hollinger's All Breakout Team, so Hollinger doesn't hate the Wizards, just the management.


Kevin Seraphin, Washington Wizards
Seraphin could potentially find himself boxed in by the more veteran combination of Emeka Okafor and Nene, but I suspect he'll still average about 30 minutes a game once one considers that (A) Seraphin is probably better than Okafor at this point, and (B) Nene likely will beg out of 15-20 games with assorted hangnails and ear-lobe contusions.

When Seraphin plays, he has shown he can play well. Last April, he emerged as a starter and averaged 15.5 points and 7.0 boards, flashing a vastly improved midrange jumper and a nice jump hook from the block. He turns 23 in December and took up the game at a late age, so there's still a lot of potential improvement on the way. He missed Washington's season opener, unfortunately, but look for him to establish himself as a solid frontcourt starter this season.

http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/story/_/ ... am-2012-13
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Post#1416 Re: Kevin Seraphin
Wed Nov 7, 2012 3:20 am by veji1

Not taking big risks here Hollinger... It is for me quite clear at this point that Seraphin is, at the minimum, a 14/7 player already. The question is can he be more than that ? Can he be a better rebounder, can he get opposing bigs in foul trouble, can he become the focus of an inside-out offense with efficient ball movement, etc...

But he is already a 14/7 player with established moves and zones where he is confortable strutting his stuff...
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Post#1417 Re: Kevin Seraphin
Wed Nov 7, 2012 3:25 am by hands11

montestewart wrote:There was also buying out Bibby (was that $4 million or less, I forget). It looked good on paper, but took KS a while to develop, and by the time he started to look like something last year, the play of Crawford and Singleton indicated that they might not be important pieces in the future. I'll be surprised if Crawford ever works out, but Singleton may eventually be an OK player. Regardless, Seraphin looks good, and he looks like he might one day turn out to be something special. Even if he doesn't, that was still the kind of bold move I wish was the rule rather than the exception here. It was definitely a good trade. Was it Leonsis' call or EG's?

(PS: When the team bought out Bibby, how did that "something for nothing" get by Leonsis?)


I'm sure finding talent is more EG and his team. Trading picks and taking on contracts that get bought out would involve Ted more. Deciding to swop out, buy out, etc contracts like Lewis would involve a lot of Ted.
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Post#1418 Re: Kevin Seraphin
Wed Nov 7, 2012 3:27 am by hands11

closg00 wrote:Kevin made Hollinger's All Breakout Team, so Hollinger doesn't hate the Wizards, just the management.


Kevin Seraphin, Washington Wizards
Seraphin could potentially find himself boxed in by the more veteran combination of Emeka Okafor and Nene, but I suspect he'll still average about 30 minutes a game once one considers that (A) Seraphin is probably better than Okafor at this point, and (B) Nene likely will beg out of 15-20 games with assorted hangnails and ear-lobe contusions.

When Seraphin plays, he has shown he can play well. Last April, he emerged as a starter and averaged 15.5 points and 7.0 boards, flashing a vastly improved midrange jumper and a nice jump hook from the block. He turns 23 in December and took up the game at a late age, so there's still a lot of potential improvement on the way. He missed Washington's season opener, unfortunately, but look for him to establish himself as a solid frontcourt starter this season.


How is getting 30 minutes getting boxed in by Okafor and Nene.
http://insider.espn.go.com/nba/story/_/ ... am-2012-13
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Post#1419 Re: Kevin Seraphin
Wed Nov 7, 2012 6:00 am by le crapaud

That's great to see you, wiz fans, loving our french big fella :D . His game vs Boston was just a stellar performance on both ends of the floor. I'm still angry at our french national coach for not using him properly in olympics. He's obviously our future in NT but he's already our present and the fact is that they don't have a clue...it's all for Parker & Diaw, same mistakes all over again...and after every elmimination we hear same BS as "TP can't do it all by himself". Well, Kevin isn't a role player who just set big screens and watch you play. You have to use him and i'm glad that the wiz are trying to do so.

I don't know why you have concerns about his rebounding. It's all about the team and if you look at it, wizards just totally outrebounded celtics last game. I mean, Kev's way to box out is impressive and nobody in green shirt could approach the paint and try to take an offensive rebound. He's just rock solid and control perfectly his opponent so that his teammates can grab those rebounds quite easily. His rebounding is really not an issue.
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Post#1420 Re: Kevin Seraphin
Wed Nov 7, 2012 1:55 pm by Higga

Good to see a young project draft pick start to pan out. Hope he continues to get minutes.

With Wall, Beal, and Seraphin we have three nice young pieces to build around. Wish we didn't anchor ourselves with so many bad contracts though...
Eric Maynor is the worst basketball player I've ever seen.
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Post#1421 Re: Kevin Seraphin
Wed Nov 7, 2012 8:47 pm by Zonkerbl

KSera for MIP!
Comparing Rose to Wall is like asking which is a more impressive cat: A cheetah or a wolf? Dude, Wall ain’t no damn cat!
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Post#1422 Re: Kevin Seraphin
Thu Nov 8, 2012 10:33 am by Limo

Those two last games against Boston (and the two first for Kevin) were interesting to watch. For the first time, Kevin's role's changed and he was the very first go-to-guy. Not an easy thing against a great defensive team but he seems to have learnt a lot.

He's already showed that he could play one on one against KG, play good defense against him. Twice, he's had a good starting game. With a double team, more pressure, it was harder and predictable. How to became a player in the shadow, putting 15-20pts anonymously and became the focal point in clutch time...

Before those games, it was a confidence issue, now he has to show and prove that he could be this go-to-guy, not only coming from nowhere but in money time when the defense is focused on him. Few players can manage it with constance and success. And he has to found to do it because without Néné and Wall there's not much talent in this team. That's a great experience for him. A lot of respect from his coach and teammates.

Now, he showed that he has problems with double team and I don't think at this point it's only an attention issue. Being able to pass the ball at the right moment, OK, but he did it twice, but when you're in the paint, you have to do the job before the double team comes. He seems static or trying to make his move at the post, maybe he could be more aggressive with his pivot foot to create space, moving the ball without dribbling. If the double team comes, it's harder for the defense to do it without foul. But he has to do it changing his natural pace. Being aggressive it's not only attacking the basket, it's being able to change rhythm, making fake, pump fake, false pass, and do all of these thing with a quick execution. Kevin seems a bit sloppy at time and his game is very predictable: "OK I have the ball, I like this spot, I'm balanced, I have good rhythm and confidence, yeah, two points", or "OK, look my ass, I like the paint, look how my hook is beautiful". The execution has to be quicker. He has confidence now, he needs to found another confidence in the execution to be less predictable. Maybe the pump fake is the key. Starting with a pump create space and could force a foul. Also, he has to learn to read faster the defense and see where is the open man; and he will need to pass the ball again, with confidence... It's better to take a bad shot than make a bad pass, with his shot and his confidence he has to to it now a bit faster, the double team will never come. Some times, he was a little shy taking a bad shot... well take the shot or lose the ball, if your shot is blocked, you can gain the rebound, that's not the worst scenario.

At the moment, Kevin has his confidence but he has to found a way to gain a total and permanent confidence from his teammates. Kevin is too polite, too shy. In this context, he has to be a leader, more aware, voluble. Because if he's not, the other team will try to steal the ball of his hand and contest his leadership. He has to impose himself, show some authority. Authority it's not only aggressiveness (not bad aggressiveness), it is showing that you're concerned, involved, and making things with confidence. It's not a shooting contest, he has to show who's the boss^^. Right now, other teams respect him, for his talent, but they should fear his presence, his aggressiveness and unpredictable - but right - choices. Talent is not everything. Right now he is a role player with a lot of talent, if he wants to be more than that he needs to stop to be the nice guy (you don't want another Boris Diaw right?). Aggressiveness without bad temper, with self-control, it's against his nature I would say (he can be angry but it will be the result of an injustice, a bad call, a response to someone else's behavior) but come on Kevin, just try or pretend you can do it^^.
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Post#1423 Re: Kevin Seraphin
Thu Nov 8, 2012 10:45 am by tontoz

It is easier to handle a double team when you face up rather than have your back to the basket. When you face up your defender can't put his hand on your or it is a foul. Also when you face up you can see the whole floor and can see a double team coming.
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Post#1424 Re: Kevin Seraphin
Thu Nov 8, 2012 10:46 am by GhostsOfGil

I have no data on this, but it seems like it takes a while for bigs to learn to pass out of the post effectively. I specifically remember Duncan struggling with this early in his career. It's just not something young guys ever have to practice before they have success in the NBA.
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Post#1425 Re: Kevin Seraphin
Thu Nov 8, 2012 11:15 am by pancakes3

It's tough for Seraphin to handle double teams for a myriad of reasons. He's not tall, he's not used to it, he doesn't have great cutting teammates, he's playing against a good defensive team, and he's got extra motivation to be selfish and score on KG.
Bullets -> Wizards
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Post#1426 Re: Kevin Seraphin
Thu Nov 8, 2012 12:07 pm by veji1

great post Limo, I agree that Seraphin has been very mechanic. This is a young player who has been putting a tremendous amount of work to improve and know where to be on the floor, identify his spots and use them well. This helped him "slow the game" after a first year where everything was just going to fast.

Now he has a confort zone, he actually started having it when he played for the french team and Vittoria last year. This confort zone means that when he gets the ball in the right situation, he knows what to try to do with it and how to do it pretty effectively.

Of course step 2 is adapting to teams identifying your conforts zone and disrupting it. This what Boston did well here. Get him out of his grove, preventing him from executing his moves in the tempo he loves.

This is where indeed he will have to learn to be more aggressive, exploit the defense commiting to disrupting his play by deceiving it (ie you think I am starting a post up for the hook, quick turn around base-line/one dribble/attack the basket, etc...) getting the ball out or meeting it straight up (see the double coming, get in motion to get a foul from an unset defender, etc...).

Basically KS has perfected his moves, now the work starts on his counter-moves... If he can perfect that too than he becomes a very special player, Elton Brandish (well if he can get to the FT line as well). If he can't he will still be a good 4/5 with solid game but not able to be one of the very first options of his team.

One last point. For and inside-out game to work, you need to have efficient outside scorers as well. Give Serapin a Korver standing curling to get the ball out of the post and he can be a lot more efficient. Hopefully Beal can become one of those legit 38% 3PT shooters that open up the floor.
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Post#1427 Re: Kevin Seraphin
Thu Nov 8, 2012 5:13 pm by loot

If you ook at his current arsenal of moves on O, and him being ambidextrous... can you imagine what he'd look like after a summer with Hakeem?
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Post#1428 Re: Kevin Seraphin
Fri Nov 9, 2012 12:41 am by hands11

loot wrote:If you ook at his current arsenal of moves on O, and him being ambidextrous... can you imagine what he'd look like after a summer with Hakeem?


http://www.nba.com/wizards/video/2012/1 ... p4-2287276

Love the young guys on this team. Kevin is a cool young man.
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Post#1429 Re: Kevin Seraphin
Fri Nov 9, 2012 4:28 am by veji1

loot wrote:If you ook at his current arsenal of moves on O, and him being ambidextrous... can you imagine what he'd look like after a summer with Hakeem?


Look I love Hakeem and all, but it sounds like half of the league young big men have been working out with him or Kareem at some point and yet the result aren't impressive to say the least.

To me learning to trust his strength and just playing a more direct game is the first priority, than nifty counter moves are great too of course, but before he can master the pump and head fakes of the Dreem, he could usefully watch videos of Blake Griffin or Dwight Howard to see how to use his strength and speed better.
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Post#1430 Re: Kevin Seraphin
Fri Nov 9, 2012 5:10 am by loot

Look at some of the big men whoé worked with Hakeem: McGee, Aamare eetc.. Those guys dont have the right mindset. Given the way Serpahin caries himself, I think the influence a few weeks of trainign with Hakeem could have on him would be great.
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