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The Amazingly Sucky Andray Blatche Thread

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Post#1066 Re: The Amazingly Sucky Andray Blatche Thread
Wed Oct 17, 2012 8:46 am by Chocolate City Jordanaire

fishercob wrote:Whatever success Blatche experiences would be a testament to him finally growing up and in no way an indictment of this organization. That Blatche needed to face the specter of being out of the NBA to actually show up in shape is absurd.

This organization drafted him when nearly no one else would. They signed him to two contract extensions, the second of which was clearly undeserved, and in doing so made him rich beyond most of our imaginations. They gave him responsibility that belied an underlying trust and belief .

He paid them back by being a complete turd -- a fat, out of shape, entitled turd, who couldn't keep his mouth shut and was hellatiously bad on the court. He stole money from ownership and paying customers. The investment the team made in him, the patience, the saga, and ultimately the use of the amnesty all represent significant opportunity cost. Dray hurt this organization and the fan base. While I'm for second (fifth? eighth?) chances in the abstract, I cannot honestly say that I'm rooting for Blatche to succeed when he acted like such a **** here.


While I agree with this I can't help but remember when Flip Saunders became coach. Blatche was his next KG. Flip enabled some of the entitlement mentality IMO, fish. Ernie Grunfeld didn't exactly surround Blatche with talent,either. The Wizards organization did not draft beefy, scrappy players that might have helped Andray. (Millsap, Blair, Faried could have helped). They drafted or otherwise acquired McGee, Pecherov, Oberto, Armstrong, Yi Jianlian, and asked Andray to be the go to big.

Blatche is the one who lacked professionalism, partied, stayed out of shape but I also remember he was injured quite a bit and had no help. I think he will do much better post-Grunfeld, and in a supportive role off the bench with Brooklyn.
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Post#1067 Re: The Amazingly Sucky Andray Blatche Thread
Wed Oct 17, 2012 9:20 am by nate33

CCJ, you gotta stop making excuses for Blatche. Are you seriously trying to tell me that if we had drafted Faried instead of Vesely, it would have made the difference in Blatche's development? C'mon now. For years, Blatche played alongside hard working pros like Jamison, Haywood and Etan Thomas and none of their work ethic rubbed off on Blatche.

So, maybe the problem was that Blatche felt he should be "the man"? Okay, then. The Wizards tried that too. They traded away Jamison, Butler and Haywood and thrust Blatche into the primary option role while giving him a $30M extension. What did we get?

Neck fat.

I am absolutely certain that whatever success Blatche has in Brooklyn will be fleeting. Maybe he plays hard for a year or so, but sooner or later, the old 7-Layer Blatche will reassert himself.
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Post#1068 Re: The Amazingly Sucky Andray Blatche Thread
Wed Oct 17, 2012 9:31 am by fishercob

nate33 wrote: The Wizards tried that too. They traded away Jamison, Butler and Haywood and thrust Blatche into the primary option role while giving him a $30M extension. What did we get?

Neck fat.



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Post#1069 Re: The Amazingly Sucky Andray Blatche Thread
Wed Oct 17, 2012 9:35 am by Chocolate City Jordanaire

nate, I'm saying he should not be the scapegoat.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/WAS/2009.html
http://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/WAS/2010.html
http://www.basketball-reference.com/teams/WAS/2011.html

Washington was 19-63, 26-56, and 23-59 under Tapscott and Saunders. If you check each of those seasons and sort by minutes played, you will find out facts about this roster and not opinions. I know who played and how much. Blatche played behind Jamison for years and was thrust into a starting situation with a crappy frontcourt and for a crappy general manager. He is better off now as nearly all Ex-Wizards are.

When Flip came and players started being referred to as knuckleheads that bothered me. It is not right for the players to get the blame when coaching and management lacks insight.
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Post#1070 Re: The Amazingly Sucky Andray Blatche Thread
Wed Oct 17, 2012 9:46 am by fishercob

No one is scapegoating Blatche or saying our record has been bad solely because of Dray or even close. The overwhelming majority of Blatche's suckiness is on him. Frankly, espousing anything to the contrary is a disservice to Blatche and the hope that he might learn the true meaning of accountability.
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Post#1071 Re: The Amazingly Sucky Andray Blatche Thread
Wed Oct 17, 2012 9:57 am by Chocolate City Jordanaire

I think he's got to mature and will do so with time. Lamar Odom is the best comparison I can think of to Blatche. Odom is more physically gifted but he has a similar work ethic IMO. If Blatche is around a Kobe-type leader he will follow and work hard IMO. I think Andray is going to be compelled to grow as a player. Environment matters a lot. As with Odom, I would only expect Blatche to do well under favorable circumstances to him. He's predictable IMO.

Avery Johnson is a great coach for Blatche. Fiery and supportive, always in your face-type coach. He will put the slightest drift to the right or left by Blatche on blast. Also, the guys Andray has to go against in practice are straight up beasts! Kris Humphries, Reggie Evans, Gerald Wallace all seem like they'd be at home in the WWE if they weren't ballers. Teletovic is an aggressive scorer, too. All those guys are going to bring out the best in Blatche, because one thing I do know is Blatche doesn't back down. As long as he is healthy he will do well in Brooklyn.

I think the Wizards focused on his faults in work ethic without considering their own lack of professional development and roster development. That young man is definitely shaky and flaky but what about the Wizards?

Whoever said give Blatche another year would have been a good idea, I agree. We saw his best and worst. He got in shape one time before and came back as Seven Day Dray. Seems to me with Nene his job would have been easier … and it would have become easier to trade Blatche once his image were rehabilitated. Instead, the Wizards forced a showdown, got no takers in trade because they played their hand, and per usual lost what might have been an asset for nothing.

I'm not saying Blatche isn't a bum at times at all ...
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Post#1072 Re: The Amazingly Sucky Andray Blatche Thread
Wed Oct 17, 2012 10:23 am by DMVleGeND

GhostsOfGil wrote:
DMVleGeND wrote:I was on record for saying we should've kept Dray for at least one more yr. I still don't think he's in peak shape, but he's definitely in better shaped than he was last yr. He's running the floor better, and has look musch more energetic on the boards and on defense. Knowing this city, he's going to become great like every other young player on the Bullets/Wizards that was traded too early while young SMDH.


There's no guarantee Blatche would have put it together this year. Being amnestied was the motivator that seemed to have started "project zero"

And lets be honest, even if he's motivated, theres absolutely no way he will sustains this level of play once he gets his next contract.


I think he was motivated before he was amnestied though. Like dlts20 said, he had hit rock bottom - he got benched, was constantly being booed by his home fans, and was asked to take a leave for being out of shape. He started working out w/ John Lucas before he was amnestied. I think he would've been just as motivated if we kept him to show the fans that he's a changed man.
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Post#1073 Re: The Amazingly Sucky Andray Blatche Thread
Wed Oct 17, 2012 10:26 am by verbal8

Chocolate City Jordanaire wrote:I think he's got to mature and will do so with time. Lamar Odom is the best comparison I can think of to Blatche. Odom is more physically gifted but he has a similar work ethic IMO. If Blatche is around a Kobe-type leader he will follow and work hard IMO. I think Andray is going to be compelled to grow as a player. Environment matters a lot. As with Odom, I would only expect Blatche to do well under favorable circumstances to him. He's predictable IMO.

I think you are on to something with the Lamar Odom comparison. I think both players are dependent on the situation for whether they will be successful or not. I think Kwame Brown may be another situation with some parallels. I think Blatche like Kwame will be more successful trying to do the basics rather than be a superstar.

I don't think there is much evidence that there was any realistic chance of Blatche being successful for the Wizards. I hope the Nets are good situation for him and he manages to get his act together.
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Post#1074 Re: The Amazingly Sucky Andray Blatche Thread
Wed Oct 17, 2012 11:09 am by jivelikenice

DMVleGeND wrote:I think he was motivated before he was amnestied though. Like dlts20 said, he had hit rock bottom - he got benched, was constantly being booed by his home fans, and was asked to take a leave for being out of shape. He started working out w/ John Lucas before he was amnestied. I think he would've been just as motivated if we kept him to show the fans that he's a changed man.


Absolutely disagree. Dray has shown no mental toughness in his career. What do you think the result would have been the first time he was boo'd by the home team? he would have thrown in the towel and sulked. Dray needed a fresh start and he seems like he's doing ok. Do I think he'll make us regret the move? No. He's doing a lot of damage against players like Shavlick Randolph (who has no business on an NBA court). He'll benfit slightly by playing next to vets not doubt, but the main thing is over there he know he has to accept his role. He's not a primary option over Deron and JJ. Over here he would have tried to do too much on the perimeter and he'd be the same player.
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Post#1075 Re: The Amazingly Sucky Andray Blatche Thread
Wed Oct 17, 2012 11:11 am by jivelikenice

jivelikenice wrote:
DMVleGeND wrote:I think he was motivated before he was amnestied though. Like dlts20 said, he had hit rock bottom - he got benched, was constantly being booed by his home fans, and was asked to take a leave for being out of shape. He started working out w/ John Lucas before he was amnestied. I think he would've been just as motivated if we kept him to show the fans that he's a changed man.


Absolutely disagree. Dray has shown no mental toughness in his career. What do you think the result would have been the first time he was boo'd by the Verizon Center crowd? He would have thrown in the towel and sulked. Dray needed a fresh start and he seems like he's doing ok. Do I think he'll make us regret the move? No. He's doing a lot of damage against players like Shavlick Randolph (who has no business on an NBA court). He'll benfit slightly by playing next to vets not doubt, but the main thing is over there he know he has to accept his role. He's not a primary option over Deron and JJ. Over here he would have tried to do too much on the perimeter and he'd be the same player.
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Post#1076 Re: The Amazingly Sucky Andray Blatche Thread
Wed Oct 17, 2012 11:25 am by keynote

Agree with the Blatche/Odom comparison. But note that Odom *still* isn't that mentally tough. In the right circumstances (i.e., HOF SG leader, uber-talented front court teammates, one of the best coaches of all time - *and* making Hollywood $ from a reality show), he did well. The minute he was moved to another team (and not a dysfunctional team, mind you; a championship team with a good coach and solid, professional teammates - well, and Vince Carter), he fell apart. He's that fragile.

I think Blatche is, too.
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Post#1077 Re: The Amazingly Sucky Andray Blatche Thread
Wed Oct 17, 2012 7:24 pm by hands11

I can't believe what I am reading here.

It should be fun to go back into this thread and see what those who are taking shots at EG and the organization had to say about what to do with Dray.

I think we have a few posters who are Mitting the topic.
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Post#1078 Re: The Amazingly Sucky Andray Blatche Thread
Wed Oct 17, 2012 8:50 pm by Chocolate City Jordanaire

keynote wrote:Agree with the Blatche/Odom comparison. But note that Odom *still* isn't that mentally tough. In the right circumstances (i.e., HOF SG leader, uber-talented front court teammates, one of the best coaches of all time - *and* making Hollywood $ from a reality show), he did well. The minute he was moved to another team (and not a dysfunctional team, mind you; a championship team with a good coach and solid, professional teammates - well, and Vince Carter), he fell apart. He's that fragile.

I think Blatche is, too.


keynote, Odom had a couple deaths to deal with as well as being traded by the Lakers.

http://articles.latimes.com/2011/aug/02 ... t-20110803

"Death always seems to be around me," Odom said in a low tone. "I've been burying people for a long time. When I had to bury my child, I probably didn't start grieving until a year and a half later.

"I think the effects of seeing [my cousin] die and then watching this kid die, it beat me down. I consider myself a little weak. I thought I was breaking down mentally. I'm doing a lot of reflecting."


Odom said he didn't eat much for "eight or nine days" after the events. All the while, thoughts of dark moments in his life consumed him.

His mother, Cathy Mercer, died of colon cancer when he was 12. His grandmother Mildred Mercer, who reared him, died in 2004. His son Jayden, not quite 7 months old, died of sudden infant death syndrome in his crib in 2006.

There are aunts, cousins and friends, Odom said, all of them "taken away from me."

As he began to soul-search yet again, Odom concluded, "I may need to see a psychologist."


When your kid, your close cousin, a pedestrian you watch die, your mom, and your grandmother who raised you all die--and you're married to a Kardashian but traded mid-tv ratings-- you might have a lot on your mind.

A lot of people judge, but a few actually take the time to empathize. I'm not perfect by a LONG shot, but I try to think of why people act the way they do.

His mom died when he was 12. I think Odom is a heck of a success story, all things considered.
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Post#1079 Re: The Amazingly Sucky Andray Blatche Thread
Thu Oct 18, 2012 10:47 pm by keynote

Chocolate City Jordanaire wrote:
keynote wrote:Agree with the Blatche/Odom comparison. But note that Odom *still* isn't that mentally tough. In the right circumstances (i.e., HOF SG leader, uber-talented front court teammates, one of the best coaches of all time - *and* making Hollywood $ from a reality show), he did well. The minute he was moved to another team (and not a dysfunctional team, mind you; a championship team with a good coach and solid, professional teammates - well, and Vince Carter), he fell apart. He's that fragile.

I think Blatche is, too.


keynote, Odom had a couple deaths to deal with as well as being traded by the Lakers.

http://articles.latimes.com/2011/aug/02 ... t-20110803


When your kid, your close cousin, a pedestrian you watch die, your mom, and your grandmother who raised you all die--and you're married to a Kardashian but traded mid-tv ratings-- you might have a lot on your mind.

A lot of people judge, but a few actually take the time to empathize. I'm not perfect by a LONG shot, but I try to think of why people act the way they do.

His mom died when he was 12. I think Odom is a heck of a success story, all things considered.


None of this contradicts my point. He's been through some stuff, to be sure. But he's also fragile.

http://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/22 ... ght_Issues
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Post#1080 Re: The Amazingly Sucky Andray Blatche Thread
Fri Oct 19, 2012 12:50 am by hands11

Chocolate City Jordanaire wrote:I think he's got to mature and will do so with time. Lamar Odom is the best comparison I can think of to Blatche. Odom is more physically gifted but he has a similar work ethic IMO. If Blatche is around a Kobe-type leader he will follow and work hard IMO. I think Andray is going to be compelled to grow as a player. Environment matters a lot. As with Odom, I would only expect Blatche to do well under favorable circumstances to him. He's predictable IMO.

Avery Johnson is a great coach for Blatche. Fiery and supportive, always in your face-type coach. He will put the slightest drift to the right or left by Blatche on blast. Also, the guys Andray has to go against in practice are straight up beasts! Kris Humphries, Reggie Evans, Gerald Wallace all seem like they'd be at home in the WWE if they weren't ballers. Teletovic is an aggressive scorer, too. All those guys are going to bring out the best in Blatche, because one thing I do know is Blatche doesn't back down. As long as he is healthy he will do well in Brooklyn.

I think the Wizards focused on his faults in work ethic without considering their own lack of professional development and roster development. That young man is definitely shaky and flaky but what about the Wizards?

Whoever said give Blatche another year would have been a good idea, I agree. We saw his best and worst. He got in shape one time before and came back as Seven Day Dray. Seems to me with Nene his job would have been easier … and it would have become easier to trade Blatche once his image were rehabilitated. Instead, the Wizards forced a showdown, got no takers in trade because they played their hand, and per usual lost what might have been an asset for nothing.

I'm not saying Blatche isn't a bum at times at all ...


As someone who held out hope for Dray, here is the problem CCJ. That year for him to do it was last year. That was his audition. It was the make or break year for him to be a core player for the Wizards. He was given the green light. A starting slot. A captain spot and a microphone.

He didn't get it done. They held onto him and tried to get something in return. There were no takers. At some point, you just have to move on.

Wall and Beal are their core now and they wanted/needed to start surrounding him with a more mature team. Dray had his chance. They ran out of time waiting for him to get it while he was here.

Dray may be better where he is. But so are the Wizards. Same with the McGee trade.

The Wizards are now built more like the type of mature team they can bring in someone elses Dray or McGee types where they can get a fresh start. So far, its looking like Webster is one of those types. There will be more down the road.
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Post#1081 Re: The Amazingly Sucky Andray Blatche Thread
Fri Oct 19, 2012 2:04 am by willbcocks

I think it's rare that people make dramatic improvements in their habits or lives. It is really, really, hard to change. But a lot of people, if not most people, do make such a transition at least once in their lives, and in my experience, both personally and with people I know, people make changes after they hit the bottom.

Dray was amnestied for having neck fat. Is that the bottom for him? Has this caused profound change?

Amnestied for neck fat seems craterous. But then again Blatche is still getting paid a ton of money, still probably has groupies and leeches acting as yes-men, and two playoff teams, including the NBA champion heat, wanted his services. I seriously doubt he's a reformed, humbled player or man.

I don't have the exact stats in front of me, but Blatche might be leading the nets in FGA or FGA per minute. He did one of his patented behind the back dribbles in the Wiz game. I don't see humbled in his game, either.
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Post#1082 Re: The Amazingly Sucky Andray Blatche Thread
Fri Oct 19, 2012 8:17 am by closg00

Interesting comment from a poster replying to an article about Blatche in the NY Post. The poster knows a lot about the Wizards offense and about how the Nets are utilizing Blatche. I think Wiz D would approve this post :D
http://www.nypost.com/p/blogs/netsblog/ ... uUaJH1RXyL
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Post#1083 Re: The Amazingly Sucky Andray Blatche Thread
Sun Oct 21, 2012 2:30 am by Knighthonor

hands11 wrote:
Chocolate City Jordanaire wrote:I think he's got to mature and will do so with time. Lamar Odom is the best comparison I can think of to Blatche. Odom is more physically gifted but he has a similar work ethic IMO. If Blatche is around a Kobe-type leader he will follow and work hard IMO. I think Andray is going to be compelled to grow as a player. Environment matters a lot. As with Odom, I would only expect Blatche to do well under favorable circumstances to him. He's predictable IMO.

Avery Johnson is a great coach for Blatche. Fiery and supportive, always in your face-type coach. He will put the slightest drift to the right or left by Blatche on blast. Also, the guys Andray has to go against in practice are straight up beasts! Kris Humphries, Reggie Evans, Gerald Wallace all seem like they'd be at home in the WWE if they weren't ballers. Teletovic is an aggressive scorer, too. All those guys are going to bring out the best in Blatche, because one thing I do know is Blatche doesn't back down. As long as he is healthy he will do well in Brooklyn.

I think the Wizards focused on his faults in work ethic without considering their own lack of professional development and roster development. That young man is definitely shaky and flaky but what about the Wizards?

Whoever said give Blatche another year would have been a good idea, I agree. We saw his best and worst. He got in shape one time before and came back as Seven Day Dray. Seems to me with Nene his job would have been easier … and it would have become easier to trade Blatche once his image were rehabilitated. Instead, the Wizards forced a showdown, got no takers in trade because they played their hand, and per usual lost what might have been an asset for nothing.

I'm not saying Blatche isn't a bum at times at all ...


As someone who held out hope for Dray, here is the problem CCJ. That year for him to do it was last year. That was his audition. It was the make or break year for him to be a core player for the Wizards. He was given the green light. A starting slot. A captain spot and a microphone.

He didn't get it done. They held onto him and tried to get something in return. There were no takers. At some point, you just have to move on.

Wall and Beal are their core now and they wanted/needed to start surrounding him with a more mature team. Dray had his chance. They ran out of time waiting for him to get it while he was here.

Dray may be better where he is. But so are the Wizards. Same with the McGee trade.

The Wizards are now built more like the type of mature team they can bring in someone elses Dray or McGee types where they can get a fresh start. So far, its looking like Webster is one of those types. There will be more down the road.
Oh please. The Wizards were in a position where the team just all out sucked after it scrap 90% of its playoff team. What did you expect Dray to do on his own? That's like expecting Wall to lead this team on his own... Lol

Get over it.., you Wizards fan overreacted once again. Now Crawford is the next Dray that the team will put all blame on for everything wrong with this team.

This team won't go anywhere because it's not set up right by management.
No legit bigs, Wall is out, and havnt shown shooting talent. Their Gs are all afraid to shoot from behind the 3 at all...

What kind of team is that? This not football.

Wizards need to get star talent at the G if they can't get a star big man.
Look at the draft and stop getting these euro guys for the time being.
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Post#1084 Re: The Amazingly Sucky Andray Blatche Thread
Fri Nov 30, 2012 9:58 pm by payitforward

Anyone ready to speak up for Dray? So far, in @ 17-18 minutes/game, he's playing at a level much higher than he ever has in the league.

Above all his offensive rebounding and getting to the line. Still not a lot of minutes of course, so not necessarily enough to be confident it'll continue. Worth mentioning all the same.
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Post#1085 Re: The Amazingly Sucky Andray Blatche Thread
Fri Nov 30, 2012 10:19 pm by montestewart

payitforward wrote:Anyone ready to speak up for Dray? So far, in @ 17-18 minutes/game, he's playing at a level much higher than he ever has in the league.

Above all his offensive rebounding and getting to the line. Still not a lot of minutes of course, so not necessarily enough to be confident it'll continue. Worth mentioning all the same.

Blatchemo! How can you do this to me?

The reason so many (including myself sometimes) held out irrational hope for so long is because we would see flashes of him putting together good stretches, not just minutes, bit sometimes even several games in a row. When he was in better shape and he bodied up, he could play decent defense, and when he stayed closer to the basket, he was a decent rebounder. But he usually was way out of shape (not only injuries, but conditioning), and he saw himself a stretch big, and as time passed he was slow and/or shied away from contact. Much of his Wizards failure is on him, but much of it is also on EG for crafting a team that positioned Blatche as a #1 option when he's never been a particularly efficient scorer (and he still isn't), and letting Blatche's high profile embarrassment drop his trade value to zero.

As a backup big on a team with plenty of scorers already, Blatche can now focus on using his size to get rebounds, put backs, and draw fouls, while still passing to cutters or spot shooters and reminding he has some skills most bigs do not have. (Although in the games I've seen, he's still struggling with fading to the perimeter a little.) It's a great role for him, and I hope he takes advantage of his second chance and keeps developing his game. AND STAY IN SHAPE DAMMIT!
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