Official Trade Thread XIX: 3/14/12 - 6/22/12

[nate33]

Jordan Crawford for Jodie Meeks. Sure. Meeks is a more selective and efficient shooter

Trevor Booker for Gary Neal. Maybe, his shooting numbers look pretty good, but don't know much about him, and Booker could net more in return.

Jan Vesely for Courtney Lee and Patrick Patterson. Not bad value, but Vesely has the highest upside and is moving toward it, with a skill set the team will have a hard time replacing.

Andray Blatche & Jordan Crawford for Mo Williams. Oh fu...I mean, yes.

Trevor Booker for Luke Babbit. Maybe. Unlike Neal, Babbitt's a recent mid-1st round pick. Good outside shot, not much PT. I think Booker's worth more, but maybe I'm overvaluing him.

Crawford for Meeks: YES

Booker for Neal: NO. I think we can get more value for Booker.

Vesely for Lee + Patterson: NO. I don't see Lee or Patterson being an upgrade over Cartier Martin and James Singleton. I'd much rather stick with Vesely's upside.

Blatche + Crawford for Mo Williams: YES

Booker for Babbit: Interesting idea. Babbit's per minute numbers this year look great. I haven't watched him play though so I don't know if his D sucks or not.

[nate33]

I think the nunber one concern of Wiz gm is to trade Blatch because he don't match with the new Wizards team we have seen lately and it won't be easy to trade him alone because he is a really bad reputation but if you trade him with Booker or with Crawford i think you get a good role player back.

Nobody wants Blatche. We couldn't trade him right now for anything other than a bad contract like Tim Thomas. Throwing in Booker or Crawford won't substantially alter the equation.

The only way to move Blatche is if he gets in shape and plays well for an extended period of time. While that's possible, I'm not sure if it's likely since I don't know where he is going to find minutes. My guess is that we end up amnestying Blatche in 2013.

[nate33]

Who's going to cover the guards who slash in for layups? With bigs, it's not just about their assignment, it's about how they cover the pick and roll, how they cut off penetration, etc. Amare does none of that--and he's not a good rebounder (nor is Nene). Our team would have 33 million for 3 years invested in a flawed pf/c rotation.

Amare isn't a good defender but he also isn't incompetent and immobile. It's not like the other team is going 5 on 4 when he's on the floor and Nene is an excellent help defender. And let's not fool ourselves, in the right system (and ours would be "right" for him), Amare is possibly the best offensive power forward in the league. Players his caliber don't grow on trees. Our team defense would take a hit but the improvement in our offense would be astronomical.

I'd caution wanting such a good defensive team that we start to forget that we suck at actually putting the ball through the cylinder.

Add in the fact that Vesely looks like a legit player, and it just seems like it would flush all the rebuilding progress we've made right down the toilet.

I'm still not sold on Vesely nor do I think Seraphin is ready to assume the title of consistent contributor on this team. Having the two of them playing 15 and 20 minutes per game respectively seems like great roles for unpolished young big men.

Nothing is being flushed. Rather, we're taking the next step in the process -- building a really competitive team with room for major growth. Wall, Nene, Stoudemire and our lotto pick (Beal, MKG, whomever) is a core we never would have dreamed about at the end of the Arenas era.

$19,948,799
$21,679,893
$23,410,988

That's what Amare is owed over the next 3 seasons. Oh yeah, and he posted a PER of just 17.7 while missing almost a third of the season this year.

[Nivek]

Amare isn't worth his contract, which is a good reason not to trade for him. Another good reason: Don't let the Knicks off the hook. They're the ones that built around two "superstars" who aren't really superstars at all. Both of those "superstars" are from the same thought process that says "scoring = good" and so both think they should have the ball all the time so they can score and show how good they are. Neither one has a ton of interest in other basketball activities that relate to winning -- stuff like rebounding, passing and defense.

Let the Knicks figure how to make it work.










Psst -- They won't.

[tontoz]

Not sure if this has been mentioned but Amare's contract isn't insured which will make it tough to trade him.

[miller31time]

Who's going to cover the guards who slash in for layups? With bigs, it's not just about their assignment, it's about how they cover the pick and roll, how they cut off penetration, etc. Amare does none of that--and he's not a good rebounder (nor is Nene). Our team would have 33 million for 3 years invested in a flawed pf/c rotation.

Amare isn't a good defender but he also isn't incompetent and immobile. It's not like the other team is going 5 on 4 when he's on the floor and Nene is an excellent help defender. And let's not fool ourselves, in the right system (and ours would be "right" for him), Amare is possibly the best offensive power forward in the league. Players his caliber don't grow on trees. Our team defense would take a hit but the improvement in our offense would be astronomical.

I'd caution wanting such a good defensive team that we start to forget that we suck at actually putting the ball through the cylinder.

Add in the fact that Vesely looks like a legit player, and it just seems like it would flush all the rebuilding progress we've made right down the toilet.

I'm still not sold on Vesely nor do I think Seraphin is ready to assume the title of consistent contributor on this team. Having the two of them playing 15 and 20 minutes per game respectively seems like great roles for unpolished young big men.

Nothing is being flushed. Rather, we're taking the next step in the process -- building a really competitive team with room for major growth. Wall, Nene, Stoudemire and our lotto pick (Beal, MKG, whomever) is a core we never would have dreamed about at the end of the Arenas era.

$19,948,799
$21,679,893
$23,410,988

That's what Amare is owed over the next 3 seasons. Oh yeah, and he posted a PER of just 17.7 while missing almost a third of the season this year.

It's pretty selective to choose this season's PER as the one to post. It's clear that he doesn't mesh with Melo. This was projected to happen well before Anthony even stepped onto the court as a Knick. Basketball prognosticators and statisticians all came to the same conclusion that the respective styles of Anthony and Stoudemire couldn't co-exist while both perform at a high level.

Look at the Stoudemire in New York before the Melo acquisition -- per-36 numbers: 24.7pts, 8.0rebs, 2.5asts, 1.9blks, PER of 22.7. He was single-handedly carrying the team and they were doing well from what I remember.

[rockymac52]

This is being mentioned on the trade board by a Nets fan...

He wants to get rid of Morrow, Farmar, and/or Petro, and is willing to trade away Houston's 1st round pick (lottery protected) in return for one of our 2nd round picks.

Sounds like a winner to me. We add a likely mid 1st round pick in the next few years for free. AND we get a big upgrade at backup PG in Farmar, and an awesome three point shooter at the 2 in Morrow. Petro doesn't interest me in the slightest bit.

I'd gladly trade Farmar/Morrow/HOU 1st for WAS 2nd (32).

Thoughts? Is this something New Jersey (errr Brooklyn) would actually consider?

[montestewart]

This is being mentioned on the trade board by a Nets fan...

He wants to get rid of Morrow, Farmar, and/or Petro, and is willing to trade away Houston's 1st round pick (lottery protected) in return for one of our 2nd round picks.

Sounds like a winner to me. We add a likely mid 1st round pick in the next few years for free. AND we get a big upgrade at backup PG in Farmar, and an awesome three point shooter at the 2 in Morrow. Petro doesn't interest me in the slightest bit.

I'd gladly trade Farmar/Morrow/HOU 1st for WAS 2nd (32).

Thoughts? Is this something New Jersey (errr Brooklyn) would actually consider?

It's lottery protected through 2017, when it becomes a 2nd round pick. Taking on $8M+ salary next year to do so. Really, they get a salary dump and a high 2nd (which to many is preferable to a low 1st) in exchange for a future reward that, even without prorating the time/value could be worth less than we gave up. Id start with changing to the lower 2nd (the Dallas pick), then analyze whether the Wizards can make good use of a year of Farmar and Morrow (don't want Petro) and whether NJ can squeak into the playoffs soon (a 7th or 8th seed will get a decent mid-round pick).

Looks a little risky to me.

[Dat2U]

Amare looks slow and rundown. I wouldn't even consider it even if NY was willing to take Blatche. At least Blatche can be amnestied.

[Spence]

Amare looks slow and rundown. I wouldn't even consider it even if NY was willing to take Blatche. At least Blatche can be amnestied.

Ditto. I've got nothing against Amare, but as far as trading for him, he might as well have leprosy. I can't imagine why any team in the NBA would deal for him, least of all the Wizards.

[fishercob]

There are only two teams I can think of at the moment who would consider the risk of trading for Amare and have the "assets" to do so.

1. Orlando: The Devos family has unlimited money seeing as they sit atop the world's largest pyramid scheme. They would give back trash like Hedo, Q-Rich and Duhon. I wouldn't expect Amare to work great with Dwight, but Orlando might try as a means to bring in a "star" to support Howard.

2. Charlotte: If things don't get better quickly for MJ and he is really desperate to put asses in the seats, he could trade Diop and Ty Thomas for Amare. I imagine Rich Cho would hand in his resignation with the trade paperwork to the league.

I think the Knicks are stuck with him. Breaks my heart, too.

[rockymac52]

This is being mentioned on the trade board by a Nets fan...

He wants to get rid of Morrow, Farmar, and/or Petro, and is willing to trade away Houston's 1st round pick (lottery protected) in return for one of our 2nd round picks.

Sounds like a winner to me. We add a likely mid 1st round pick in the next few years for free. AND we get a big upgrade at backup PG in Farmar, and an awesome three point shooter at the 2 in Morrow. Petro doesn't interest me in the slightest bit.

I'd gladly trade Farmar/Morrow/HOU 1st for WAS 2nd (32).

Thoughts? Is this something New Jersey (errr Brooklyn) would actually consider?

It's lottery protected through 2017, when it becomes a 2nd round pick. Taking on $8M+ salary next year to do so. Really, they get a salary dump and a high 2nd (which to many is preferable to a low 1st) in exchange for a future reward that, even without prorating the time/value could be worth less than we gave up. Id start with changing to the lower 2nd (the Dallas pick), then analyze whether the Wizards can make good use of a year of Farmar and Morrow (don't want Petro) and whether NJ can squeak into the playoffs soon (a 7th or 8th seed will get a decent mid-round pick).

Looks a little risky to me.

Well we would need Houston to make the playoffs actually, not the Nets. It's Houston's pick that is now owned by Brooklyn. Houston's right on the edge, so I could definitely see them making the playoffs as a 7 or 8 seed, meaning we'd get a pick in the 15-18 range in the next year or two. I don't think it's that ridiculous to assume the Rockets can make the playoffs in the next two years.

I understand wanting to use the Dallas 2nd round pick instead of ours. That's fine by me.

The way I see it, yes, it's a bit of a salary dump, but it's not that bad all things considered. Both Farmar and Morrow only have one year left and it's at about $4 million each. So we could let them walk and still have cap space in 2013 if we want to go after Harden or somebody else. And in the meantime, we have a very good backup PG, and a much needed SG with fantastic range. What's not to like?

[montestewart]

D'oh! rockymac52, I even looked it up to see what the restrictions were, then promptly forgot it was Houston's pick. And that changes my analysis by a bit, since I can easily see Houston being at that cusp next year.

If Wizards luck out and get Davis, and can get Crowder with the later pick, that would be a pretty ideal draft. If they somehow buy into another pick and can get a shooter too, that would be best, but even if, that would likely be a more speculative pick, and Morrow and Farmar could offer backcourt depth and range at a price of $8 million+ for one year. If they could do it for the lower 2nd, I might go for it, but I'd want to wait and see at least where the Wizards pick and probably wait to see what they get. If they get Beal and can't move Crawford, that's a crowd at SG.

[Upper Decker]

Would you trade Sharts contract/singleton/future 1st for Melo? I know he appears toxic and i suspect NY may try to get out of his or Amares deal, so if they salary dumped him would you be interested?

[Nivek]

Would you trade Sharts contract/singleton/future 1st for Melo? I know he appears toxic and i suspect NY may try to get out of his or Amares deal, so if they salary dumped him would you be interested?

No. Carmelo wants to be The Man. Which, in his mind means having the team run isos for him on a near constant basis. His teammates are supporting cast -- there to pass the ball to him where he wants it, set screens for him now and then so he can get better shots, and to offensive rebound when he misses so that he can get the ball back and take another shot. I'd rather have a well-constructed TEAM that plays a team concept.