ImageImageImageImageImage

Countdown to Ernie Grunfeld Firing

Moderators: nate33, montestewart, LyricalRico

IS IT TIME TO FIRE ERNIE GRUNFELD?

1) Yes, I believe it is time for EG to go now.
29
69%
2) Ted should let him go at the end of the season.
9
21%
3) No, Ted needs to give him more time..(DESPITE THE FACT ERNIE HAS BEEN GM SINCE 2003)
4
10%
 
Total votes: 42

User avatar
tontoz
RealGM
Posts: 18,364
And1: 3,824
Joined: Apr 11, 2005

Re: Countdown to Ernie Grunfeld Firing 

Post#461 » by tontoz » Fri Mar 8, 2013 8:51 pm

Knighthonor wrote:Well to address that last quote. EG did manage to draft Beal. As a number 3 option, he should have been rookie of the month but some reason wasn't. Beal is a beast, and great pick. He keeps improving like this he will be an all star. What you all have to say about that?



Even a broken clock is right twice a day.
"bulky agile perimeter bone crunch pick setting draymond green" WizD
montestewart
Forum Mod - Wizards
Forum Mod - Wizards
Posts: 14,567
And1: 7,700
Joined: Feb 25, 2009

Re: Countdown to Ernie Grunfeld Firing 

Post#462 » by montestewart » Fri Mar 8, 2013 9:54 pm

tontoz wrote:
Knighthonor wrote:Well to address that last quote. EG did manage to draft Beal. As a number 3 option, he should have been rookie of the month but some reason wasn't. Beal is a beast, and great pick. He keeps improving like this he will be an all star. What you all have to say about that?



Even a broken clock is right twice a day.


The acquisitions of highly paid Nene, Okafor, and Ariza, coupled with the team still banking on PG Wall being a star, pretty much dictated that, barring some unusual circumstances/bad luck, the Wizards would select a SG. Most sources had Beal as the highest ranked SG. EG's moves and "vision" really left him no intelligent, reasonable choice but to draft Beal. I'm not quite sure how, but he didn't blow it like he usually does, and his past moves have set the bar so low that not totally blowing it seems like a huge accomplishment.

PS: Beal is man, not beast.
User avatar
Chocolate City Jordanaire
RealGM
Posts: 52,609
And1: 8,968
Joined: Aug 05, 2001
       

Re: Countdown to Ernie Grunfeld Firing 

Post#463 » by Chocolate City Jordanaire » Fri Mar 8, 2013 11:03 pm

monte, it is amazing that Ernie didn't pick Harrison Barnes or Austin Rivers instead of Beal.
Bye bye Beal.
User avatar
Mickstix
Junior
Posts: 418
And1: 27
Joined: Jan 03, 2012
Location: Debary, Fl.
     

Re: Countdown to Ernie Grunfeld Firing 

Post#464 » by Mickstix » Sat Mar 9, 2013 12:24 am

I have serious doubts, that at age 45, I ever see the day Ted fires a GM.. He doesn't have time to be bothered with trying to win a championship of anykind.. (or hold anyone accountable for not doing so) He just needs a spin master to keep selling those tickets and he's a one happy loser..
Mick
jivelikenice
Analyst
Posts: 3,074
And1: 145
Joined: Jul 15, 2005

Re: Countdown to Ernie Grunfeld Firing 

Post#465 » by jivelikenice » Sat Mar 9, 2013 3:02 am

Can we please stop using Temple at shooting guard! Is Ernie really telling us that he can't find ONE actual two guard in the d-league better than Temple? What a damn joke....

Also the fact that this team is incapable of functioning if one of Beal, Wall, or Néne is outside a freaking joke and speaks to how pathetic the roster is. Okafor/Aruza/Webster...they've all played beyond my expectations but they're all bench players...NOT STARTERS on an NBA team!
User avatar
sfam
Assistant Coach
Posts: 4,462
And1: 548
Joined: Aug 03, 2007
         

Re: Countdown to Ernie Grunfeld Firing 

Post#466 » by sfam » Sat Mar 9, 2013 3:08 am

Chocolate City Jordanaire wrote:monte, it is amazing that Ernie didn't pick Harrison Barnes or Austin Rivers instead of Beal.

In retrospect, I'm really wondering what stopped him from pulling the trigger on Rivers. And tanking this year just means we are once again at the whim of EG's decision making.
User avatar
AFM
General Manager
Posts: 9,835
And1: 6,112
Joined: May 25, 2012
   

Re: Countdown to Ernie Grunfeld Firing 

Post#467 » by AFM » Sat Mar 9, 2013 3:14 am

Rivers is so ungodly awful that he looks like an Ernie pick. How can his father be an NBA coach and not tell this guy to stay in school? He's terrible.
User avatar
sfam
Assistant Coach
Posts: 4,462
And1: 548
Joined: Aug 03, 2007
         

Re: Countdown to Ernie Grunfeld Firing 

Post#468 » by sfam » Sat Mar 9, 2013 3:17 am

AFM wrote:Rivers is so ungodly awful that he looks like an Ernie pick. How can his father be an NBA coach and not tell this guy to stay in school? He's terrible.

He really is, but God clearly loves him. Unlike Vesely, God gave Rivers a broken wrist
User avatar
sfam
Assistant Coach
Posts: 4,462
And1: 548
Joined: Aug 03, 2007
         

Re: Countdown to Ernie Grunfeld Firing 

Post#469 » by sfam » Sat Mar 9, 2013 3:18 am

Maybe we can get a social movement started in DC to get Ted to allow Wizards fans to crowdsource the draft pick. After all, the wisdom of the crowd, even Wizards fans in this case, have got to be able to do a better job than EG.
User avatar
AFM
General Manager
Posts: 9,835
And1: 6,112
Joined: May 25, 2012
   

Re: Countdown to Ernie Grunfeld Firing 

Post#470 » by AFM » Sat Mar 9, 2013 3:24 am

How about I get really drunk, spin my head around a bat 50 times, and then throw a dart at a dart board? I think that would be more effective than having this imbecile EG choosing players.

Seriously.


How can you look at Vesely and say "there's an NBA player!"

He looks like he should be cleaning my pool.
payitforward
RealGM
Posts: 21,927
And1: 7,853
Joined: May 02, 2012
Location: On the Atlantic

Re: Countdown to Ernie Grunfeld Firing 

Post#471 » by payitforward » Sun Mar 10, 2013 11:53 pm

Knighthonor wrote:
nate33 wrote:
payitforward wrote:We are now almost exactly 3 years from when management completely broke up the previous team and started over. In 3 years, it's acceptable FO performance to climb all the way back to 30 wins. To be a .500 team. That's the performance level he demands of his GM.

The expectations are to be a .500 team only when fully healthy? That's sad. They don't seem to get that in real life, the ".500" teams are actually .600 teams when healthy but suffer the usual injuries that come with being an NBA team. You don't see Chicago slumming in the lottery just because Rose missed the season, or Boston throwing in the towel when Rondo got hurt.

The expectations are way too low. This team has two quality big men, a #1 overall pick in his 3rd season, and a $58M payroll. They should be aiming much higher. They suck because there is no depth on this team thanks to 4 years of botched draft picks.

No but did the Bulls have their team gutted like the Wizards did following Gil injury and his return which lead to the gun situation...
Everybody from that era is gone. Totally gutted. A bulls team would be in shambles like the Wizards/Cats if that were to happen.

Sorry, that's BS. How many guys are on the Rockets squad that were on the team last year? Two. Sub Greg Smith and Chandler Parsons.
Breaking News: In a shocking development, Wizards owner Ted Leonsis has sold the NBA franchise to a consortium of participants in a discussion board devoted to the team on realgm.com. Details to follow....
Ruzious
Retired Mod
Retired Mod
Posts: 47,909
And1: 11,579
Joined: Jul 17, 2001
       

Re: Countdown to Ernie Grunfeld Firing 

Post#472 » by Ruzious » Mon Mar 11, 2013 1:19 am

Btw, Ryan Anderson made a 3 point shot and a 3 point play in the last 20 seconds of the game to beat Portland by 2. Ernie Grunfeld played no small part in making that happen... for New Orleans.
"A common mistake that people make when trying to design something completely foolproof is to underestimate the ingenuity of complete fools." - Douglas Adams
User avatar
nate33
Forum Mod - Wizards
Forum Mod - Wizards
Posts: 66,783
And1: 19,069
Joined: Oct 28, 2002

Re: Countdown to Ernie Grunfeld Firing 

Post#473 » by nate33 » Mon Mar 11, 2013 1:33 am

Ruzious wrote:Btw, Ryan Anderson made a 3 point shot and a 3 point play in the last 20 seconds of the game to beat Portland by 2. Ernie Grunfeld played no small part in making that happen... for New Orleans.

All part of EG's master plan: make everyone better so we can get a high pick.
hands11
Banned User
Posts: 31,171
And1: 2,444
Joined: May 16, 2005

Re: Countdown to Ernie Grunfeld Firing 

Post#474 » by hands11 » Tue Mar 12, 2013 7:20 am

Well, it has been a long wait for some but the time is growing near.

For good or bad, I think Ted keeps EG around for the term of his contract. That means this draft / off season is likely his last swing at the plate. Then his contract is up. Ted my not of fired any GMs but this would not be a firing. It would just be time for a change. And with a better team and a culture change we should be able to attract a good GM. Consider what things look like when Abe hired EG. It was a total mess.

If we get a high pick and its Noel or Potter, I think most would agree he isn't going to mess up. Its the later picks that he is more likely to miss.

Will he also get some of.

Pierre Jackson
Cory Jefferson
Erik Murphy

If we don't get Noel, will he find a way to add a Jeff Withey

Can he move Singleton, Booker, and Ves and find a way to add a Doug McDermott or Ryan Kelly

Who will he find via FA as the back up SG ?

This team actually has a pretty decent core with Wall, Beal, Webster, Trevor A, Nene, Okafor and maybe Temple as a defensive roll playing bench guard. Its the depth that is killing them.

Wall/Pierre Jackson
Beal/Leandro Barbosa
Webser/Trevor A/Otto
Nene/Kevin, Cory Jefferson
Okafor/Jeff Withey

I wouldn't be upset if that was our team. Hell, they could even keep Ves around as the 13th.
Ruzious
Retired Mod
Retired Mod
Posts: 47,909
And1: 11,579
Joined: Jul 17, 2001
       

Re: Countdown to Ernie Grunfeld Firing 

Post#475 » by Ruzious » Tue Mar 12, 2013 1:59 pm

The core is Beal - period.
"A common mistake that people make when trying to design something completely foolproof is to underestimate the ingenuity of complete fools." - Douglas Adams
User avatar
FAH1223
RealGM
Posts: 15,868
And1: 6,961
Joined: Nov 01, 2005
Location: Laurel, MD
       

Re: Countdown to Ernie Grunfeld Firing 

Post#476 » by FAH1223 » Tue Mar 12, 2013 5:33 pm

Image
montestewart
Forum Mod - Wizards
Forum Mod - Wizards
Posts: 14,567
And1: 7,700
Joined: Feb 25, 2009

Re: Countdown to Ernie Grunfeld Firing 

Post#477 » by montestewart » Tue Mar 12, 2013 6:05 pm

FAH1223 wrote:http://www.truthaboutit.net/2013/03/how-to-alienate-players-and-lose-a-lot-of-games-the-washington-wizards-way.html#more-27917

A harsh and (to me) very accurate summary of what is wrong with the Wizards, encompassing (as far as I can see) most or all of the criticisms frequently voiced on this board. Compare EG to the following:
Houston Rockets GM Daryl Morey is a good example of a team builder who knows when to deal, and while any individual trade made by Morey may not be impressive, the incremental improvement of both the assets of the team, and the team itself, shows how seemingly low-value players or picks can eventually be flipped into meaningful contributors.

This article quotes an SI article that follows Houston's progressive trades of Rafer Alston, Aaron Brooks, and Kyle Lowry, which not only made them better on court, but gave them a 1st round pick that was key to acquiring Harden. Contrast that to the following:
It is easy to label Crawford, McGee, Young, Blatche, and even Arenas as players who “didn’t fit” or more perniciously, “didn’t want to be here.” One has to wonder, though, whether these labels are appropriate, or whether they are a product of an organization scrambling to explain a series of failed projects, projects that were once propped up as pieces of a legitimate basketball product. Players have a vested interest in success. It translates, in the NBA, almost directly to salary increases. Players don’t start out as “bad fits” or as malcontents within an organization. If they did, they wouldn’t be acquired.

The Wizards either pick wrong, or are repeatedly incapable of developing or motivating players much beyond what they arrived with, or both, and the way they handle such players (erratic playing time, public throw-them-under-the-bus criticism, waiting too long to decide to deal them) does nothing to enhance their trade value. Something is seriously wrong when the influx of talent--McGee, Young, Blatche, and now probably a whole new generation of picks--keeps leaving DC, having accomplished nothing, and with nothing to show for it.
User avatar
nate33
Forum Mod - Wizards
Forum Mod - Wizards
Posts: 66,783
And1: 19,069
Joined: Oct 28, 2002

Re: Countdown to Ernie Grunfeld Firing 

Post#478 » by nate33 » Tue Mar 12, 2013 7:33 pm

FAH1223 wrote:http://www.truthaboutit.net/2013/03/how-to-alienate-players-and-lose-a-lot-of-games-the-washington-wizards-way.html#more-27917

Some portions of the article were spot on, but I differed with some of it.

He accurately diagnosed one of EG's biggest failings. He falls in love with his "talent" and then waits too long to trade them. Morey is so much better about considering any player to merely be an asset. As soon as conditions arise that may devalue an asset (such as competition with another player for playing time, or the development of some negative attitude), Morey quickly trades that asset before the rest of the league realizes it. EG waits until the player has no trade value.

I disagree with the notion that former Wizards become productive after they are traded. That is manifestly untrue. With the lone exception of Blatche, every player traded has done equal or worse with his new organization. Crawford, Young, Haywood, Butler and Jamison were all disappointments. McGee has played about the same. Blatche played better, but the Wizards really didn't have a choice in amnestying him.
User avatar
GhostsOfGil
General Manager
Posts: 8,506
And1: 899
Joined: Jul 06, 2006

Re: Countdown to Ernie Grunfeld Firing 

Post#479 » by GhostsOfGil » Sun Mar 24, 2013 1:12 pm

Ernie Grunfeld is expected to return for the second year of his two-year contract, reports CSN Bay Area's Ric Bucher.

http://www.bulletsforever.com/2013/3/24 ... al-manager
User avatar
nate33
Forum Mod - Wizards
Forum Mod - Wizards
Posts: 66,783
And1: 19,069
Joined: Oct 28, 2002

Re: Countdown to Ernie Grunfeld Firing 

Post#480 » by nate33 » Sun Mar 24, 2013 4:16 pm

GhostsOfGil wrote:Ernie Grunfeld is expected to return for the second year of his two-year contract, reports CSN Bay Area's Ric Bucher.

http://www.bulletsforever.com/2013/3/24 ... al-manager

It doesn't surprise me one bit, but it's still pretty annoying.

EG is getting credit for putting together a backcourt with talent and great chemistry, but I fail to see why that's so praiseworthy. Both were consensus picks at their position. A (Please Use More Appropriate Word) monkey would have drafted them. If anything EG should be blamed for sucking so bad for so long that we got two high draft picks in the first place. And I didn't hear the article mention what EG did with our other two top 6 picks in the last 4 years.

Return to Washington Wizards