Michael Lee: Wizards Brass turned down Harden

[closg00]

Michael Lee is talking about the article he wrote about right now on 106.7FM right now! Looks like he got confirmation from several sources on both sides that this trade was rejected.

To be clear, what Lee was saying was that the Wizards rejected Harden for Beal/Singleton? I did see another quote denying or spinning that this went-down.

[montestewart]

Raptors fan coming in peace...We in Toronto understand horrible managment. I swear Wizards fans and Raps fans should hold a support group for fans destroyed by horrible management.

*hugs Why, hands him a beer*

Will you both join me for shots of Jameson to commemorate this

COUNT ME IN!

[I_Like_Dirt]

Joke all you want but Rudy Gay has turned into a good basketball player. Maybe not making the Olympic team lit a fire underneath him but I wouldn't be upset if he was on the Wizards now.

Rudy Gay is still the same player he always was: a solid player with no glaring holes in his game but with no outstanding qualities, either, who gets volume points inefficiently. Memphis' success is all about the Gasol/Conley/Randolph trio with some support on defense from Tony Allen and an improved bench spearheaded by Quincy Pondexter, of all people. Gay is contributing, too, and the Grizzlies couldn't lose him for nothing and still be successful or anything crazy like that, but at most he's the team's fourth most important player right now.

[MF23]

Nivek you're right statistically he looks average. Looking at his stats he has no business shooting that bad with bigmen like Gasol and Randolph. "Howeva" when I see him now he has a passion about him I've been waiting to see since he was a junior at Spalding.

[tontoz]

And, let's keep in mind that while the Wizards were trading for Okafor and Ariza, giving away a draft pick and cap room, bypassing the free agent market and rejecting a trade for Harden, Leonsis was publicly congratulating himself for being smart.

He was smart about one thing.... turning off his email. I ripped him a new one after the Okafor/Ariza deal and he actually reponded so i did it again. If his email was up now.....

[dobrojim]

I'm not going to claim Harden is worth the max but "especially after his dismal showing in the playoffs" is an argument that I am instinctively inclined to argue against, such is my conundrum.

Harden did great in the playoffs until the Finals.

(sorry for the redundant post which I now see several others have also said
the same thing)

-dept of redundancy dept

[MikeTheKid]

Someone posted this on the Post Article Comments:

From Chad Ford's ESPN chat today:

Drew (Indy)

The Washington Post report that the Wizards actually turned down Harden-for-Beal/Singleton can't be completely accurate? I mean, its the Wizards, but no front office is that dumb...right?
Chad Ford
(1:12 PM)

Sounds right. Before the draft I reported that the two teams were seriously talking before the draft about a similar deal. The Thunder loved Beal and even had him in for a secret workout before the draft. The holdup was the owner's reservations about paying the max to Harden. I hadn't heard about the subsequent talks after the draft, but they make sense.

[Dat2U]

Harden is not to the level of a prime Arenas. Arenas was just a notch below the Kobe's & LeBron's. Harden isn't quite to that level. I view Harden & Russell Westbrook as similar talents. Harden will need help as a #1 option as he can't do it by himself. His ability to ISO and create is a bit overrated. But Harden is an all-star quality guard and the Wizards can only hope Beal gets close to that level.

I'm surprised that OKC would have just taken Beal & Singleton to get a deal done. I was more ambivalent about Harden's availability and his upside than most. But I'm shocked Ted would turn this down, even after the OkaforAriza deal. Harden would have seemed to be exactly what this franchise needed. High quality young talent. We could have had our backcourt set for years to come.

I'm glad this came out though. News like this makes it easier to break my allegiances as a fan. I had already concluded that Teddy Leonsis would never get another dollar out of me unless things changed. Now I'm leaning towards not supporting them or following them altogether. I was thinking the other day, "I don't have to support this team anymore". Why would any self-respecting fan endure this. It's not about the win-loss record, it's how poorly the franchise is run. It's about the disingenuous owner who not only lies, but makes it even worse by trying to portray his ownership style as being open, accessable and honest with his fan base.

I don't even watch Wizards games anymore. Only reason I come to this board is because all of the wonderful friends I've met over the years.

[Nivek]

Harden is not to the level of a prime Arenas.

This is true, but remember -- Harden is 23 years old. Prime Arenas was 24-25 years old. NBA players on average peak between ages 25-27 and then maintain that level of play until about age 30. Harden is likely to be better 2 years from now than he is today -- just as Arenas was better at age 25 than he was at age 23.

[montestewart]

Dat2U, I still watch games with my father-in-law (who just has to watch all DC sports, all the time), but I find myself doing work, email, bills, etc. while I'm watching. Barely engaged.

One funny thing about passing on Harden is a Harden/Wall backcourt, even if it was doomed to low seed mediocrity, probably would sell some tickets and make Washington look like more of a serious player and desirable destination for FAs. Maybe Leonsis doesn't want that. Maybe he bought the Wizards as a tax write off, and any Wizards success will come despite his efforts, the "Springtime for Hitler" of the NBA.

[Dat2U]

Dat2U, I still watch games with my father-in-law (who just has to watch all DC sports, all the time), but I find myself doing work, email, bills, etc. while I'm watching. Barely engaged.

One funny thing about passing on Harden is a Harden/Wall backcourt, even if it was doomed to low seed mediocrity, probably would sell some tickets and make Washington look like more of a serious player and desirable destination for FAs. Maybe Leonsis doesn't want that. Maybe he bought the Wizards as a tax write off, and any Wizards success will come despite his efforts, the "Springtime for Hitler" of the NBA.

Well if its just Wall & Harden, then yes, that's doomed to a low seed. But in this day and age, if you got two legit stars or all-stars, you do everything to find a third. With Wall & Harden, I'm doing everything to create enough cap room or enough assets to eventually add the 3rd piece, Ideally a legit big.

Even if we had just signed Ryan Anderson (a very solid player in his own right) in addition to trading for Harden, that's a pretty good starting core IMO.

[jivelikenice]

I don't see why why a Wall/Harden backcourt is doomed to be a low seed. You still would have Nene & Seraphin up front...How many teams can match up with that type of backcourt to go along with low post scoring? Myabe a low seed this year, but I don't see why that team couldn't be a top 4 seed in the east down the road with the inclusion of a 3 and D SF.

To a much less degree, I now know how Browns fans felt when they realized the Skins landed RG3 instead of them....

[jivelikenice]

And, let's keep in mind that while the Wizards were trading for Okafor and Ariza, giving away a draft pick and cap room, bypassing the free agent market and rejecting a trade for Harden, Leonsis was publicly congratulating himself for being smart.

He was smart about one thing.... turning off his email. I ripped him a new one after the Okafor/Ariza deal and he actually reponded so i did it again. If his email was up now.....

How did he respond? When I criticized moves or lack of moves his response was "why don't you buy a full season ticket plan". Absolute loser response. I have a partial plan and don't plan on renewing it. If he wants my money, he needs to give me something worth paying for.

[tontoz]

How did he respond? When I criticized moves or lack of moves his response was "why don't you buy a full season ticket plan". Absolute loser response. I have a partial plan and don't plan on renewing it. If he wants my money, he needs to give me something worth paying for.

I don't have it on my email any more. I remember his first email started something like "Ummm.. Wow...ok." And then tried to defend the deal. When i responded he tried to act like i didn't understand the cap. I understand it just fine but apparently he doesn't, or at least doesn't understand the concept of "opportunity cost" which so many of us were screaming about last summer.

[Upper Decker]

I don't see why why a Wall/Harden backcourt is doomed to be a low seed. You still would have Nene & Seraphin up front...How many teams can match up with that type of backcourt to go along with low post scoring? Myabe a low seed this year, but I don't see why that team couldn't be a top 4 seed in the east down the road with the inclusion of a 3 and D SF.

To a much less degree, I now know how Browns fans felt when they realized the Skins landed RG3 instead of them....

I agree with this as well. Nene, Serpahin, and Anderson (or other FA acquisition) would be a very solid front court. The Wiz would rarely be at a competitive disadvantage in the front court.

Neither Wall or Harden are elite #1's, however, the combination of the two would have rediculous potential. Both have elite dribble penetration ability and both are great passers. I consider them a better version of Arenas/Hughes. If you gave Arenas and Hughes a top shelf front court I believe the Arenas era would have been incredibly successful.

If idiot Ted was so worried about the luxary tax I think it'd have been really easy to package the #1 and vesely to a team with cap space.

[TheKingOfVa360]

And I respectfully disagree with your respectful disagreement, TKOV360.

(Doesn't that mean I agree? Seems like it should….It does! It means I agree with myself. Whew, I was worried …)

I wouldn't say Harden played like crap in the Finals. He certainly played 3 crappy games out of the 5, the first of which the Thunder won despite his play. Harden had fairly strong games in games 2 and 5. He was, as you allude, really bad in games 3 and 4. Overall, Harden in the playoffs Harden was terrific against SA and DAL. The Thunder might not have even made the Finals without him.

http://www.basketball-reference.com/pla ... elog/2012/

Harden is only 23 years old. He sacrificed shots and minutes at OKC. He will make all star teams and 2nd or 3rd all NBA teams for years to come, TKOV360.

Right now Harden averages 24.7 points, 5.6 assists, 4.4 rebounds, 1.8 steals, 4.1 turnovers.
http://www.basketball-reference.com/pla ... eja01.html

I would put Harden in the same category of Gilbert Arenas, when Gilbert was 23. Harden can go off for 40 on any given night. He is most certainly a star who has the potential to become a superstar as Gilbert Arenas did by the time he was 25 or 26 years old.

I sort of agree with you that Harden isn't likely to be the best player on a championship team, TKOV360. We are seeing that his iso ability was greatly enhanced by having Kevin Durant as his teammate, and to a lesser extent Russell Westbrook. Still, Harden is a baller.

Where we obviously disagree is on John Wall. I don't think he's a franchise talent. Time will tell.

As for hoping we continue to suck, I'm really, tired of doing so. Maybe it is because I am over 50. Waiting three years or 5 years or 10 there are no guarantees. I want them to win. I want them to trade Okafor and Ariza next season when they are expiring, OR this season as teams like the Lakers get DESPERATE.

Most of the crap Ted/EG have done is reversible.

Haha, yeah that means you agree with yourself. You're right Harden is a great talent and it's shocking they would do the Okafor Ariza trade but not this one. I prefer to built through the draft but the Wiz have shown they aren't so they probably should have traded for Harden. Harden does have potential to be a stud, I agree with you on that. Harden and Wall would be one of the best backcourts in the NBA for years to come.

Also about Wall I wasn't saying he is a franchise talent now but that he has potential to be one day. We can only hope he reaches that potential and doesn't leave this franchise the first chance he gets. I'm also tired of sucking but I have no clue what else can help this team. EG's quick fixes have failed time and time again. I think we both can agree EG needs to be fired right now. Majority of this board would be better gm's than him. I kind of miss the days of the Wiz being a treadmill team, at least they were entertaining and you got your moneys worth when you went to the game.

[Dat2U]

Funny thing is, with two ball-handlers like Wall & Harden, the team might be better off running the Princeton offense or something akin to that to really involve the skills of both.

[Illuminaire]

The Harden thing is a nail in the coffin for me too. I've never quit a team before. Ever. I've been a hardluck fan of the Bullets, the Wiz, the 'Skins, and the Orioles for twenty+ years.

After this, though, I'm drawing the line. It is no longer reasonable to hope for the best - not as long as the current regime is in place. I'm giving the Wiz until the all-star break to clean house and bring in a competent GM and front office staff. If that doesn't happen (and I don't expect it to), I am officially breaking up with this team. I wouldn't stay in a romantic relationship this dysfunctional and hopeless; I won't be tied to a sports one either.

I'd rather be an NBA orphan than a Wizfan, as long as Teddy is patting himself on the back for how smart he and his broskie Ernie are.

[payitforward]

Since Harden was already successful at the highest level, had he been signed and found to be a bad fit next to Wall, then trading Wall for a good fit next to Harden would have been one way to proceed, TheKingOfVa360.

Trading Wall could get you the rights to Cody Zeller, Alex Len, Nerlens Noel, etc. PLUS the Wizards could look to draft a lottery-quality PG like Michael Carter-Williams or C. J. McCollum.

I would swap Wall for Len and McCollum any day of the week and twice on Sunday. Those two with Harden, Nene, and Seraphin would be sick.

I respectfully disagree, Wall has a chance to be a franchise talent. Harden hasn't been successful on the highest level. He played like crap in the finals, has never been an all star, never made an all-nba team. I know you're not a big fan of Wall CCJ but he could be the best PG in the NBA one day. I would never trade him to find a better fit for Harden. Harden at his best isn't the best player on a championship team and maybe not even a playoff team. I just hope we suck for two more years so we have a shot at Wiggins or Jabari parker.

Regardless, I had high hopes for Teddy as an owner. He has been a massive disappointment so far. He clearly needs a new GM to lead this team and needs to fire EG but he won't do it for some reason.

Except when he destroyed the Spurs and daggered the Lakers with his closing ability during the playoffs. No excuse for his finals performance but people acting like he wasn't outstanding during the playoffs is absurd.

Not to mention the pretty ridiculous idea that "Wall has a chance to be a franchise talent." Wall has a chance to be a good point guard. Lets see him realize that potential before handing out all these props to a guy who has done nothing at all, to be straightforward about it.

[GhostsOfGil]

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