Official John Wall Appreciation Thread 2.0

[montestewart]

Some very instructive observations here.

An open jumper is an open jumper regardless of who the other players on the team are.

A good PG will make any random 4 other players at the local YMCA better players.

But but but... his production of assists is *not* what's holding John Wall back.

He has no 3, doesn't shoot jumpers well, and turns it over at a high rate.

Still waiting on an epiphonic Wall. Been waiting awhile.

[hands11]

Until he can shoot reliably and add a 3 ball deserving of a start guard, he just isn't worth a #1 pick. But it was an average draft.

And even not doing those to thing, he just doesn't manage the game well enough. He isn't smooth an in control.

He might get there, but he is way more of a project then is deserving of the #1 overall pick.

Lillard has been more impressive as a rookie

For the record. Tony Parker make 12.5M for the this year and the next two.

Jrue Holiday will be making 11M for 4 years starting next year.

I sure hope Wall doesn't think that just because he was the #1 pick in a weak draft that he will be making more then that. Hell, right now I wouldn't even play him more then Jrue and I'm not sure any other team would either.


[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=omY6v5jJIjw&feature=player_embedded#![/youtube]

I know some have said this is a weak draft but I see more then a few names on this list that I would want on my team.

C.J. McCollum
Otto Porter
Victor Oladipo

And one of Nerlens Noel, Mason Plumlee

We will have a first, I high second and a late second. Plus maybe they can find a way to get another first.

[Wizardspride]

Anyone opposed to moving Wall for a lottery pick? (hopefully).


I just can't imagine having to max him out.

[mohammed10]

Anyone opposed to moving Wall for a lottery pick? (hopefully).


I just can't imagine having to max him out.

[AFM]

Is there a PG we can say is a much better prospect than Wall in this year's lottery?

[jivelikenice]

But but but... his production of assists is *not* what's holding John Wall back.

He has no 3, doesn't shoot jumpers well, and turns it over at a high rate. It was the same at Kentucky. A different cast of characters around him won't help those problems.

I don't understand your obsession with the 3 ball? When he was playing at an high level coming off the bench, was the lack of a 3 pt shot holding him back?

[AFM]

The problem is, at every court in the world, whether an NBA court or your local YMCA the ball handler is D'ed up at the 3 point line. I remember in the Denver game Andre Miller was all the way back at the free throw line. Because he can't shoot the 3, defender can back up 7 or so feet.

[jivelikenice]

A good PG will make any random 4 other players at the local YMCA better players.

They're 6-5 with him and and 5-28 without him. He has made them better...you just had something to talk about after last nights game....suddenly you ran into a lot of time

[hands11]

Is there a PG we can say is a much better prospect than Wall in this year's lottery?

I think I just posted a video of one who should get a good strong looksee

[montestewart]

But but but... his production of assists is *not* what's holding John Wall back.

He has no 3, doesn't shoot jumpers well, and turns it over at a high rate. It was the same at Kentucky. A different cast of characters around him won't help those problems.

I don't understand your obsession with the 3 ball? When he was playing at an high level coming off the bench, was the lack of a 3 pt shot holding him back?

It's held him back in the past, and over the long haul, it still will. You see defenders cheat on him, daring him to shoot while they're halfway to help defense or protecting the paint from him, and so rather than making his teammates better, his lack of a shot makes them (and his own lanes to the basket) better covered. It's not necessarily the lack of a 3, but a lack of much of any shot, period. Other PGs succeed without a 3 (Andre Miller, Rajon Rondo, etc.), but they have a shot, something defenders have to guard.

[AFM]

Is there a PG we can say is a much better prospect than Wall in this year's lottery?

I think I just posted a video of one who should get a good strong looksee

I'll check him out. 2.9 APG doesn't look like PG numbers. Seems more like an undersized SG.
Even if John Wall doesn't become a superstar, I think he's at least adequate for his position. We have 4 positions that need help more than PG. Most glaringly SF.

[jivelikenice]

The problem is, at every court in the world, whether an NBA court or your local YMCA the ball handler is D'ed up at the 3 point line. I remember in the Denver game Andre Miller was all the way back at the free throw line. Because he can't shoot the 3, defender can back up 7 or so feet.

Way to simplistic. He's had big scoring nights and defenders have always played him the same way. The problem with him is that in some cases he's too passive to start and then begins to force the issue if things aren't going well. That leads to his turnovers and forced 1 on 3 fast breaks....by that same token, when he doesn't shoot the mid range jumper early, he becomes hesitant and is more likely to hesitate on those shots when they present themselves later on. What he has to do is take a hold of the starting 5, just like he did when he was running with the second unit. He didn't worry about getting everyone touches...he worried about attacking, and then used the attn he was getting to create shots for others. He needs to be the focal point and he needs to understand that him coming out aggressive will create for himself and his teammates. His lack of consistent aggression is his biggest fault, moreso than his J.

He also needs to stop worry about TOs. When Linsanity was at its peak, he was turning it over 6 times a game. Turnover when you're putting that much pressure on a D are ok. Go back to Walls first home game of his career. He had 9 turnovers but he filled the stat sheet and dominated the game...all without a 3 pt shot. I don't know who got I. His head about the TOs but it has him thinking versus playing. That's why seeing him with the second unit was refreshing. He was aggressive & his mistakes were aggressive. He needs to learn to carry that over to his play with the starters and Randy has to help him....that's their joint responsibility.

In regards to the team around him...they've obviously done a poor job. It's not bs..it is what it is. Everyone who isn't t acknowledging it also wants Ernie fired so go figure I'm not saying he needs all stars but in my opinion if you had a starting 5 of Wall. Beal, Webster, Ryan Anderson, and Okafor, he could average 19 & 10 and get that team to the playoffs....

[jivelikenice]

Hands, they're not going to trade for another first round pick or use 3 selections on players that will be on the roster next season. And this offseason isn't the yr to draft a point. get a front court weapon or trade the pick if an all star caliber player is available and see if this team lead by a wall/beal backcourt can break through. If we're in the same spot next season, the you prepare to move on. You can't keep resetting and you can't keep throwing a bunch of rookies together and think they'll get it. More often than not, it doesn't work....

If we traded Wall and took a scoring pg, how long til the trade Beal posts begin. In fact there have already been a few trade Beal for a lotto picks posts.

[AFM]

I honestly think Shabazz is our best bet this year. We need scoring terribly. Especially at the 3. Beal Wall Shabazz. Sounds like a good mix. Shabazz is ridiculously gifted at putting the ball in the hoop. We are historically awful at doing so. I love Noel but if we draft him I'm going to be very upset. This team has a ridiculous weakness and he doesn't address that.

[jivelikenice]

I honestly think Shabazz is our best bet this year. We need scoring terribly. Especially at the 3. Beal Wall Shabazz. Sounds like a good mix. Shabazz is ridiculously gifted at putting the ball in the hoop. We are historically awful at doing so. I love Noel but if we draft him I'm going to be very upset. This team has a ridiculous weakness and he doesn't address that.

Shabazz is too small to play the 3, doesn't pass, and isn't great off the ball. I like Zeller early and Porter mid lotter. We need guys who can score without needing to dominate the ball.

[AFM]

I thought that was a good thing. He doesn't pass. Just scores. Isn't that what we need now?
I dont know about Zeller. Porter maybe. Shabazz looks like the better prospect. I mean he's shooting 43 from 3 and isn't even known as a 3pt shooter. I like his game.
Porter I have to look more at.
Who else do you like? Any other 3's?

[jivelikenice]

Portter has picked up his shooting big time. When a guy goes from 22% to 46% in one offseason, you have to take notice. Add to that his defense and rebonding and he can be special....I think people are under rating his upside.

[JonathanJoseph]

A good PG will make any random 4 other players at the local YMCA better players.

They're 6-5 with him and and 5-28 without him. He has made them better...you just had something to talk about after last nights game....suddenly you ran into a lot of time

Correlation does not imply causation. Andray Blatche had a more effective 11 game span as a Wizard than Wall's last 11 games in both production and wins with far, far less talent than is on the roster right now.

[JonathanJoseph]

The problem is, at every court in the world, whether an NBA court or your local YMCA the ball handler is D'ed up at the 3 point line. I remember in the Denver game Andre Miller was all the way back at the free throw line. Because he can't shoot the 3, defender can back up 7 or so feet.

Way to simplistic. He's had big scoring nights and defenders have always played him the same way. The problem with him is that in some cases he's too passive to start and then begins to force the issue if things aren't going well. That leads to his turnovers and forced 1 on 3 fast breaks....by that same token, when he doesn't shoot the mid range jumper early, he becomes hesitant and is more likely to hesitate on those shots when they present themselves later on. What he has to do is take a hold of the starting 5, just like he did when he was running with the second unit. He didn't worry about getting everyone touches...he worried about attacking, and then used the attn he was getting to create shots for others. He needs to be the focal point and he needs to understand that him coming out aggressive will create for himself and his teammates. His lack of consistent aggression is his biggest fault, moreso than his J.

He also needs to stop worry about TOs. When Linsanity was at its peak, he was turning it over 6 times a game. Turnover when you're putting that much pressure on a D are ok. Go back to Walls first home game of his career. He had 9 turnovers but he filled the stat sheet and dominated the game...all without a 3 pt shot. I don't know who got I. His head about the TOs but it has him thinking versus playing. That's why seeing him with the second unit was refreshing. He was aggressive & his mistakes were aggressive. He needs to learn to carry that over to his play with the starters and Randy has to help him....that's their joint responsibility.

In regards to the team around him...they've obviously done a poor job. It's not bs..it is what it is. Everyone who isn't t acknowledging it also wants Ernie fired so go figure I'm not saying he needs all stars but in my opinion if you had a starting 5 of Wall. Beal, Webster, Ryan Anderson, and Okafor, he could average 19 & 10 and get that team to the playoffs....

I was with you all the way up until the end. You think trading Nene (even hobbled) for Ryan Anderson would make this a playoff team? Whoa.

[jivelikenice]

I don't think so this year obviously, but I think with that type of lineup, Wall can be a 19-10 all star and we can push for the playoffs. The bench would have to be improved. I'm also assuming more growth out of the backcourt with a full offseason, along with a young SF to develop and push Webster. I wasn't suggesting a trade though, moreso giving a lineup example that would play better than the combinations we have right now.