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Shots Fired: Waiters Says He and Irving Best Backcourt

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Re: Shots Fired: Waiters Says He and Irving Best Backcourt 

Post#41 » by CobraCommander » Wed Oct 1, 2014 5:57 am

keynote wrote:[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9tCOr6q8rTQ&feature=youtu.be[/youtube]

I enjoyed the guffaws from the peanut gallery. ;)



Wall owned him with this quote - but honestly it's easy to talk crap when you get Lebron and love- waiters won't be the reason why the Cavs win one game. Kyrie and Waiters couldn't get their team into the playoffs in a weak east.

Imo wall is a better point than Kyrie and beal is a better guard than Waiters- But that won't matter for us unless we get Durant and we can match the Cavs fire power. Otherwise LeBron gonna give Waiters a ring. It's just funny cause Kyrie not gonna be talking crap like this because he understands this is his chance at superstar status. Waiters better pray Kyrie doesn't get him moved. Also if you think about it- wiggins would have started over waiters if they didn't trade him for love. Thus Waiters is a starter by process of elimination-

IF the Cavs win this would be like BJ Armstrong talking crap :noway:
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Re: Shots Fired: Waiters Says He and Irving Best Backcourt 

Post#42 » by Sluggerface » Wed Oct 1, 2014 6:35 am

It really just blows my mind how ridiculous Kyrie's hype train still is. By mid season there were fans over at Cavs the blog who were literally proposing trading Kyrie to get more out of this draft instead of offering him the max down the line. National media begins to throw you under the bus? Oh, no worries, winning the pointless ASG mvp will take off a little heat. Still not convinced? Coach K to the rescue. Beat up on some scrubs from Serbia, everyone will love it.

Meanwhile Isaiah Thomas gets payed 7 million to be a 6th man despite being a flatout better offensive player than Kyrie. SMH.
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Re: Shots Fired: Waiters Says He and Irving Best Backcourt 

Post#43 » by Wizardspride » Wed Oct 1, 2014 1:26 pm

http://www.truthaboutit.net/2014/09/joh ... newed.html

Wall was not done with the Cavs and took a subtle jab at Kyrie Irving.

“This is how I see it: I have never been healthy most of my career. The first three years I don’t make the playoffs. ‘I’m not a point guard, I can’t lead my team.’ You have other guys who haven’t seen the playoffs yet but have individual goals, like I said, they get all the praise.”


He was later asked about why he believes that he is continually overlooked.

“I have no idea why I am overlooked. I am not a great shooter, but I’ve improved. You can’t tell me every year that I haven’t improved. When I was healthy, I improved. I am one of the most complete point guards in the league. I rebound, assist, play defense, steal, score. I don’t know why I am overlooked. I am still trying to figure it out.”


Wall emphasized that true accolades in NBA are earned by team success.

“If you are picking talent off of individual play, then it is good to be considered that, but I am person that cares about team play. The main thing is that I want to win. That is how you get known as a point guard … is winning.”
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Re: Shots Fired: Waiters Says He and Irving Best Backcourt 

Post#44 » by nate33 » Wed Oct 1, 2014 2:06 pm

Wizardspride wrote:Wall emphasized that true accolades in NBA are earned by team success.

“If you are picking talent off of individual play, then it is good to be considered that, but I am person that cares about team play. The main thing is that I want to win. That is how you get known as a point guard … is winning.”

I think this is the biggest difference between Wall/Beal and Irving/Waiters. Irving/Waiters are going to try to prove to the world that they're the best backcourt in the league. Wall and Beal are going to focus exclusively on trying to win games and advance in the playoffs.

This isn't really meant as a criticism of Irving/Waiters. That attitude is typical for young players who haven't yet made the playoffs. With Wall and Beal having had that experience, it gives them an edge.
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Re: Shots Fired: Waiters Says He and Irving Best Backcourt 

Post#45 » by Nivek » Wed Oct 1, 2014 2:17 pm

Sluggerface wrote:It really just blows my mind how ridiculous Kyrie's hype train still is. By mid season there were fans over at Cavs the blog who were literally proposing trading Kyrie to get more out of this draft instead of offering him the max down the line. National media begins to throw you under the bus? Oh, no worries, winning the pointless ASG mvp will take off a little heat. Still not convinced? Coach K to the rescue. Beat up on some scrubs from Serbia, everyone will love it.

Meanwhile Isaiah Thomas gets payed 7 million to be a 6th man despite being a flatout better offensive player than Kyrie. SMH.


Isaiah Thomas was up against two things that limit pay in the NBA market: his lack of size and his draft position. David Berri has published research showing that player compensation and playing time is affected by draft position -- even after the rookie contract. Witness Kwame Brown continuing to get contracts despite YEARS of unproductive, indifferent performance. In Thomas's case, he was picked last in the draft and his team stunk. Their stinkitude wasn't his fault -- he and Cousins (and then Gay) were the only guys producing worth a damn for the Kings.

One fair issue with Thomas is his defense. In the defense portion of my metric, he rated as having a well below average defensive impact. His offensive contributions were greater, however -- he was both high usage and efficient.

As an aside, the Kings have hired Dean Oliver in their front office. That's a good move by them.
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Re: Shots Fired: Waiters Says He and Irving Best Backcourt 

Post#46 » by fishercob » Wed Oct 1, 2014 2:25 pm

Adorable that Waiters is all chesty now that he has Lebron and Love as teammates. He's what, Cleveland's 5th best player? 6th? 7th?

Waiters/Irving will lead all NBA backcourts in sharing the court with Lebron and Love. Mazel tov, kiddo.
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Re: Shots Fired: Waiters Says He and Irving Best Backcourt 

Post#47 » by Nivek » Wed Oct 1, 2014 2:33 pm

fishercob wrote:Adorable that Waiters is all chesty now that he has Lebron and Love as teammates. He's what, Cleveland's 5th best player? 6th? 7th?

Waiters/Irving will lead all NBA backcourts in sharing the court with Lebron and Love. Mazel tov, kiddo.


Last season, among Cleveland players with at least 500 total minutes, Waiters was 9th in PPA. But hey, it's good to have big brothers like Lebron and Kevin Love to fight his battles.
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Re: Shots Fired: Waiters Says He and Irving Best Backcourt 

Post#48 » by keynote » Wed Oct 1, 2014 10:27 pm

[tweet]https://twitter.com/dionwaiters3/status/517158752345415682[/tweet]

Man, this guy is chatty.

This is gonna get chippy. :)
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Re: Shots Fired: Waiters Says He and Irving Best Backcourt 

Post#49 » by Proven_Winner » Thu Oct 2, 2014 1:36 am

Sluggerface wrote:It really just blows my mind how ridiculous Kyrie's hype train still is. By mid season there were fans over at Cavs the blog who were literally proposing trading Kyrie to get more out of this draft instead of offering him the max down the line. National media begins to throw you under the bus? Oh, no worries, winning the pointless ASG mvp will take off a little heat. Still not convinced? Coach K to the rescue. Beat up on some scrubs from Serbia, everyone will love it.

Meanwhile Isaiah Thomas gets payed 7 million to be a 6th man despite being a flatout better offensive player than Kyrie. SMH.


This post is one of the truest ones I've ever seen on RealGM.

As for that last sentence I'm guessing you must watch Coach Nick? :D

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=htiURZVuoks[/youtube]

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6ofiEqogb8w[/youtube]
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Re: Shots Fired: Waiters Says He and Irving Best Backcourt 

Post#50 » by SaiCLE » Thu Oct 2, 2014 2:44 am

Cavs fan, I come in peace.

I'm a huge fan of both wall/beal and Irving/waiters. So here me out please. Waiters has always been my favorite player mainly because he's never afraid to speak his mind and he always back it up on the court(especially when lance Stephenson called him out and Dion almost single handedly won the game for the cavs)

The reason I'm saying this is because waiters is always painted in a negative light for a bunch of b.s. that was made up by the media. He never got into it with kyrie. The media baited Dion into responding to Beal comments. Wall took it way too far imo. He comes off as bitter for some reason.

Either way the bickering from both wiz and cavs fans are annoying as hell which is I why I prefer to stay on rcf. Good luck to your season guys.

Btw, Isaiah Thomas will forever be a sixth man. Kyrie is on another level stop the nonsense
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Re: Shots Fired: Waiters Says He and Irving Best Backcourt 

Post#51 » by WallWithTheDime » Thu Oct 2, 2014 3:05 am

SaiCLE wrote:Cavs fan, I come in peace.

I'm a huge fan of both wall/beal and Irving/waiters. So here me out please. Waiters has always been my favorite player mainly because he's never afraid to speak his mind and he always back it up on the court(especially when lance Stephenson called him out and Dion almost single handedly won the game for the cavs)

The reason I'm saying this is because waiters is always painted in a negative light for a bunch of b.s. that was made up by the media. He never got into it with kyrie. The media baited Dion into responding to Beal comments. Wall took it way too far imo. He comes off as bitter for some reason.

Either way the bickering from both wiz and cavs fans are annoying as hell which is I why I prefer to stay on rcf. Good luck to your season guys.

Btw, Isaiah Thomas will forever be a sixth man. Kyrie is on another level stop the nonsense


Classy fan always appreciated, good luck to your season too fella, As much as I fed into this , I see this as two things

Hype for the season to begin for both teams

, and players talking/gonna try to back up things they say.

For not knowing Wall, He has been seen as arrogant in his college stint IMO, but that comes with number 1 projected draft pick at that young of an age. and what player isn't
and in his fairness he feels somethings that happened so far are unfair to him in his eyes, List can go on....but I don't see this as anything personal just a little preseason trash talk. You could look at Wall's comments as going a little too far.

Not hating on Waiters, but he kinda baited Wall into that question

He was baited into answering those questions....BUT

Beal said something on his media day at his home....Waiters said something about what Beal said at his media day
also stating he knew that's what he had to say. Those comments made by Waiters in turn lead to the John Wall question and how else would you expect Wall to answer

So if you are Waiters why say anything When the comments Beal made had nothing to do with Waiters/Irving or anyone on the Cavs. Also you don't see anyone else in the league complaining about who has a better back court when there are some great ones. I'm sure Curry and Thompson had to of had the same question by now. Waiters may have been baited into that question, but so did Beal.

If Waiters did not say anything, like I don't have an answer for you on that , or I'll get back to you later. "or im not answering that"
Then Wall would not have responded to that question since, that question for Wall would not have existed. You Could also say the same thing about Beal, but it's media day when those type of questions get asked all the time especially coming off a good year.

Not taking anything away from Waiters, I just think this whole situation could have been avoided, by either Waiters not commenting on anything about the Wizards, But when you got a young player thats what they want to do stir up the pot create intensity for match ups. I'm sure these players respect each others games.

As for Wall's response it was due to the way the question was asked, and a combo of him feeling like they actually improved their squad and individual play as well. Ask any young player in the league this question and I guarantee you that some will disagree with what the other said, and made a comment about it. while most vets and older players who have been in the league will not respond in this way.

I think both sides are childish, but they are just having a little fun banter.Means nothing in terms of overall teams progress this year and I believe

The question to Beal was just made by the media due to their performance last year. The question and response by Beal did not have to do with the Cavaliers but had to do with the progression of John Wall and Bradley Beal as a young good back court.

It's a fact that Beal and Wall got some recognition last year as potentially being one of the best back courts by ESPN and other media sources, Wall and Beal improved this off season and worked on their game and they believe they are better now.

going back to the hype for the season, book it for a sold out game, national media coverage, if hyping up the season is what both these teams going for then it worked.
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Re: Shots Fired: Waiters Says He and Irving Best Backcourt 

Post#52 » by Knighthonor » Thu Oct 2, 2014 4:15 am

MikeTheKid wrote:
CntOutSmrtCrazy wrote:http://espn.go.com/nba/story/_/id/11618576/dion-waiters-cleveland-cavaliers-says-kyrie-irving-nba-best-backcourt?ex_cid=espnapi_public

Ah Waiters running his mouth because he just lucked into an offseason that saw his team add Lebron/Love.


Image

Lol I was looking for this for he general thread
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Re: Shots Fired: Waiters Says He and Irving Best Backcourt 

Post#53 » by Sluggerface » Thu Oct 2, 2014 4:53 am

SaiCLE wrote:
Btw, Isaiah Thomas will forever be a sixth man. Kyrie is on another level stop the nonsense


Lol it's not nonsense. Isaiah has been a better shooter than Kyrie for their entire careers, He has better career win shares, and he gets to the line more, and he did it in a vastly superior conference. Kyrie has been a marginally better passer and they are equivalent defenders. Kyrie is by no means "on another level" to Isaiah Thomas.
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Re: Shots Fired: Waiters Says He and Irving Best Backcourt 

Post#54 » by lastemp3ror » Thu Oct 2, 2014 11:34 am

nate33 wrote:
Wizardspride wrote:Wall emphasized that true accolades in NBA are earned by team success.

“If you are picking talent off of individual play, then it is good to be considered that, but I am person that cares about team play. The main thing is that I want to win. That is how you get known as a point guard … is winning.”

I think this is the biggest difference between Wall/Beal and Irving/Waiters. Irving/Waiters are going to try to prove to the world that they're the best backcourt in the league. Wall and Beal are going to focus exclusively on trying to win games and advance in the playoffs.

This isn't really meant as a criticism of Irving/Waiters. That attitude is typical for young players who haven't yet made the playoffs. With Wall and Beal having had that experience, it gives them an edge.


If Lebron and Love didn't join the team, they may have had the chance to prove it. Irving's assists may go up, but outside of that both of their number's will go down.
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Re: Shots Fired: Waiters Says He and Irving Best Backcourt 

Post#55 » by hands11 » Thu Oct 2, 2014 1:23 pm

Sluggerface wrote:It really just blows my mind how ridiculous Kyrie's hype train still is. By mid season there were fans over at Cavs the blog who were literally proposing trading Kyrie to get more out of this draft instead of offering him the max down the line. National media begins to throw you under the bus? Oh, no worries, winning the pointless ASG mvp will take off a little heat. Still not convinced? Coach K to the rescue. Beat up on some scrubs from Serbia, everyone will love it.

Meanwhile Isaiah Thomas gets payed 7 million to be a 6th man despite being a flatout better offensive player than Kyrie. SMH.


Hate if you want but Kyrie is going to have an awesome year with LeBron and Love spreading the floor. The court should be wide open now.

Kyrie can do it all. Its just they had no one else to score or turn to before. Now a ton of pressure has been taken off his shoulders so he can open up more areas of this game. Adding LeBron and Love is huge for Kyrie. Consider that team last year to this year and what his role was. He was the best player on the team last year. Now look at them.

LeBron can close out or run the offense allowing him to spot up, drive and dish. He can play off or on ball.
LeBron can catch his passes as well and finish. You are going to see some pretty assists from Kyrie.

The two playing off each other is a dangerous combination. And thats not even mentioning Love spotting up and grabbing rebounds for outlet to LeBron and Kyrie.

Kyrie has sick sick handles. Maybe the best in the league. He can also pass.

I just watch a few long interviews with him. He is actually a nice young man. Almost like Beal. Very humble. Very competitive. Very team focused.

Cavs lucked out big time with LeBron coming home.

He is going to have a great year. He will be an AS again. I think he even gets some votes for MVP, MIP, etc.

The gap between Kyrie and Curry will close a lot this year.

I like Wall a lot but he doesn't have Kyries handles, shooting or creative driving skills. What Wall has is that he is more athletic, bigger, and stronger. Walls upside to be a more explosive Westbrook type is there but Kyrie just has a smoother more polished skilled game right now.
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Re: Shots Fired: Waiters Says He and Irving Best Backcourt 

Post#56 » by Severn Hoos » Thu Oct 2, 2014 1:47 pm

Kanyewest wrote:
Severn Hoos wrote:They might be the best backcourt if the Cavs were playing in a FIBA competition. In the NBA? Not so much.


In FIBA, probably not.

You've got

Curry/Thompson
Dragic/Bledsoe
Lowry/DeRozan

Wall and Beal might be better too especially since they at least both got to tryout while Waiters didn't.


Sorry, my post was poorly worded. What I meant is that Kyrie excels in certain circumstances - All-Star Game, FIBA, Uncle Drew, stats, etc. But actually winning relevant NBA games is a whole different story. And that doesn't even begin to address the ridiculousness of Waiters chirping about anything since he has accomplished..... getting himself picked high in the draft. But beyond that, I'm drawing a blank.

Basically, I look at Kyrie the way I do Melo today and Vince Carter 10 years ago. Big star, big name, might even be a solid player in international competition. But unless the light bulb clicks (like I believe it did for VC), they'll be sitting at home for the most important games.



[Note: Yes, I realize that Kyrie & Waiters are likely to be playing into the ECF and maybe the NBA finals. But that won't be because of those two guys, it will be because of LeBron & Love. Kyrie would pretty much have to totally remake his game for me to believe that he was more contributor than participant in that scenario.]
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Re: Shots Fired: Waiters Says He and Irving Best Backcourt 

Post#57 » by hands11 » Thu Oct 2, 2014 2:19 pm

Kyrie will be a big participant in them being good this year.

Of LeBron, Kyrie and Love, its Love who will rely most on the other two since they will be running the offense.

You will see plenty of Kryie in the lead running things.

I expect his assist to go up to around 8 a game.
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Re: Shots Fired: Waiters Says He and Irving Best Backcourt 

Post#58 » by JWizmentality » Thu Oct 2, 2014 3:13 pm

SaiCLE wrote:Cavs fan, I come in peace.

I'm a huge fan of both wall/beal and Irving/waiters. So here me out please. Waiters has always been my favorite player mainly because he's never afraid to speak his mind and he always back it up on the court(especially when lance Stephenson called him out and Dion almost single handedly won the game for the cavs)

The reason I'm saying this is because waiters is always painted in a negative light for a bunch of b.s. that was made up by the media. He never got into it with kyrie. The media baited Dion into responding to Beal comments. Wall took it way too far imo. He comes off as bitter for some reason.

Either way the bickering from both wiz and cavs fans are annoying as hell which is I why I prefer to stay on rcf. Good luck to your season guys.

Btw, Isaiah Thomas will forever be a sixth man. Kyrie is on another level stop the nonsense


Wall took it too far? GTFO with that mess. All Waiters needed to do was answer, "No we are the best backcourt" That would be it. No beef. That's how anybody would respond...but he took it a step further which prompted Wall's response. So sorry, you may think it's unwarranted but Waiters has the "douche" label for a reason.

We'll see you **** in the regular season. Leave it on the court.
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Re: Shots Fired: Waiters Says He and Irving Best Backcourt 

Post#59 » by WallWithTheDime » Thu Oct 2, 2014 4:20 pm

If Waiters want's to bring up videos


[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hG0tYtsk0Rw[/youtube]


If you want to bring up MVP performances from Irving at All Star games,

I'd like to see him get 22 assists in one game as a rookie or second year player dishing it out to those young players. Irving won MVPS meaningless game such as all star games and FIBA, which I think if given the starting position wall would have excelled

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WuPYPrh92kc[/youtube]


and if you want to go a little playoffs to start with Beal then

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8eHG2w2JT84[/youtube]
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Re: Shots Fired: Waiters Says He and Irving Best Backcourt 

Post#60 » by Kanyewest » Thu Oct 2, 2014 4:28 pm

Wall/Beal are better but I saw this Waiters video today- Waiters has a lot of potential but clearly from the stats, he doesn't play as good as this during the regular season

[youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=31t8_KsKBw0[/youtube]

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