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I don’t buy this narrative that Kuz regularly “looks off” Deni. Does Kuz sometimes take ill-advised shots? Absolutely. Should he look more often to get Deni and other teammates involved? No doubt.

But I’ve also seen numerous instances where it was a nice pass from Kuz that set Deni up for an easy hoop and where it was Kuz encouraging Deni to be more aggressive offensively.

penbeast0 wrote:

nate33 wrote:

CntOutSmrtCrazy wrote:Nate, seems like you willing to defend that only Kuzma can handle high usage to the end of the earth.

Agreed, the defense has sucked though over that stretch as it has for the whole season.

I just call 'em like a I see 'em.

Deni is without a doubt my favorite Wizard. Since his breakout at the end of December, he has been the best player on the team. But I still think Deni is an opportunistic scorer, not a guy who imposes his will against a set defense. He just doesn't get the same defensive attention from opponents that Kuzma does. I don't think he could replace what Kuzma does on offense, at least not yet.

The issue isn't whether Avdija can replace Kuzma's scoring, it's whether the team as a whole can. Even if Deni can't handle another 10 shots a night, he can handle one or two more, Tyus one or two more, Bagley/Bilal/Kispert can each shoot a little more and if they are just league average efficiency, Kuzma is a bit under league average efficiency so it's unlikely the team loses a lot of scoring efficiency.

We do lose the secondary playmaking, but hopefully anyone eating Kuzma's minutes plays better defense than Kuzma has been playing, particularly the Kuzma at center experiment, so as a team it would probably be like when we moved Poole out of the starting lineup. No, Bilal doesn't create shots for himself at Poole's volume but considering the amount of those shots that were missing, our starting lineup hasn't suffered offensively.

This^.

DCZards wrote:I don’t buy this narrative that Kuz regularly “looks off” Deni. Does Kuz sometimes take ill-advised shots? Absolutely. Should he look more often to get Deni and other teammates involved? No doubt.

But I’ve also seen numerous instances where it was a nice pass from Kuz that set Deni up for an easy hoop and where it was Kuz encouraging Deni to be more aggressive offensively.

Calling major BS here. You can't honestly watch games on a consistent basis and make this claim. Kuzma undoubtly looks off dudes all the time. Considering Deni is our best player (yep I'm here to claim that), it goes to reason he looks him off. Both the numbers and the eyes tell me this.

Again I love how the Kuzma apologist always want to point to how what Kuzma is doing to help Deni, but never the other way around. And another again, Kuzma is a -6.6 this season On-Off. Deni a +4.9. Deni sets up Kuzma plenty too considering how much less the ball is in his hands as compared to Kuzma.

A lot of really interesting arguments to always bolster a guys that doesn't play a lick of defense, chucks, then barks like he's serious about basketball.

If Deni had this game last year we would be celebrating. Now it's just another game. He's come a long way.

tontoz wrote:If Deni had this game last year we would be celebrating. Now it's just another game. He's come a long way.

Watch on YouTube

Yeah, I thought the same thing.

I looked at the box score and saw 17 points, 9 rebounds and 5 assists in 32 minutes and thought: "Meh, a .555 TS%. That's not really that great of a game".

And then I thought: "Wow, he is so good now that I nitpick a complete, well-rounded game because his efficiency was just slightly below par."

nate33 wrote:

tontoz wrote:If Deni had this game last year we would be celebrating. Now it's just another game. He's come a long way.

Watch on YouTube

Yeah, I thought the same thing.

I looked at the box score and saw 17 points, 9 rebounds and 5 assists in 32 minutes and thought: "Meh, a .555 TS%. That's not really that great of a game".

And then I thought: "Wow, he is so good now that I nitpick a complete, well-rounded game because his efficiency was just slightly below par."

i have him and Haliburton on my fantasy team. The past 2 months...Deni has really elevated my team...while Haliburton has set it back

Another extremely productive game from Deni against Toronto that feels ho-hum because it's so expected:

22 points, 13 rebounds, 5 assists, 3/8 from 3-point range.

It's been a long time since we've had a home grown player who is consistently good on a night-to-night basis. We finally have one.

In Deni's last 35 games, he is averaging 16.7 points, 8.3 rebounds and 3.6 assists on a TS% of .608. These aren't per 36 numbers. They are his actual averages (in 31.3 minutes a game).

In that stretch, he has only failed to score double-digits 5 times, (and in two of them, he had 9 points). In that same stretch, he pulled down fewer than 5 rebounds just 5 times. Consistency.

He has been even more consistent and productive in his last 15 games. He is averaging 19.3 points, 9.8 rebounds and 3.4 assists over his last 15 games, scoring at least 14 points in 14 them, and grabbing 7 or more boards in 12 of them.

nate33 wrote:Another extremely productive game from Deni against Toronto that feels ho-hum because it's so expected:

22 points, 13 rebounds, 5 assists, 3/8 from 3-point range.

It's been a long time since we've had a home grown player who is consistently good on a night-to-night basis. We finally have one.

And... I (and I'm Deni's "stan" ) didn't vote him as player of the game as in my opinion he should do better than 0/5 in 4th and missing both FT which should seal the game. I also think it is actually proof of his progress this year

Hard to believe this is the same guy we watched last season.

I credit Keefe a lot for this breakout.
I get kinda angry thinking of a theoretical roster of: Tyus, Kuz, Deni and Porzingis under Keefe. Feels like a real balanced and strong team IMO that could have been..

All credit goes to Deni, imo. You could kinda see this coming late last season. I particularly refer folks to the game he had on March 28, 2023 against Boston. And not just the numbers but the confidence.

I said before the start of the season that Deni was my breakout candidate for this season.

2Fluffy4U wrote:I credit Keefe a lot for this breakout.

I'm not so sure about that. Deni flipped a switch on December 29th. That was the start of his 35-game run where he averaged 19/9/5 per 36 minutes.

Keefe took over on January 25th, 13 games into that 35-game run. There really hasn't been much difference in his play under Keefe except in minutes played. In the 13 games under Wes, he got 28.6 minutes a night. In his 22 games under Keefe, he averaged 32.5 minutes. So basically, Deni has played the same under Keefe except for a 10% increase in statistical production thanks to a 10% increase in minutes.

Frankly, I'm not seeing all that much difference between Wes and Keefe for the team overall. Let's not forget that we had that 16-game losing streak under Keefe.

Needs to be more consistent at the line, been shooting 65% post-All Star.

nate33 wrote:

2Fluffy4U wrote:I credit Keefe a lot for this breakout.

I'm not so sure about that. Deni flipped a switch on December 29th. That was the start of his 35-game run where he averaged 19/9/5 per 36 minutes.

Keefe took over on January 25th, 13 games into that 35-game run. There really hasn't been much difference in his play under Keefe except in minutes played. In the 13 games under Wes, he got 28.6 minutes a night. In his 22 games under Keefe, he averaged 32.5 minutes. So basically, Deni has played the same under Keefe except for a 10% increase in statistical production thanks to a 10% increase in minutes.

Frankly, I'm not seeing all that much difference between Wes and Keefe for the team overall. Let's not forget that we had that 16-game losing streak under Keefe.

I agree that not much change is witnessed via stats searching..
But looking at more suttle changes -
1. Rotations under Keefe are less robotic / pre-determined.
2. He actually knows when and how to take a timeout.
3. He actually acknoweldged Deni calls for challenges (major confidence boost).
4. He promoted a better ball movement offense.
5. He holds players accountable in a mature way IMO.
6. He did not sub Deni immediatly after great plays like Wes used to do almost every other game.

All of the above IMO help promote the confidence Deni needed to feel better on court

In order to make another leap next year, Deni will need to learn to stay aggressive and confident even if other players getting their buckets.

I noticed about him something mental. When other players having a high scoring night, he takes a back sit. If Deni ever wants to be a key part of a successful team, he can't afford himself to fall asleep and be passive when he's not the leading scorer. Even if the ball doesn't go your way, put yourself in positions to be available to receive the ball, show a body language of someone who wants to take part. His last 15 minutes yesterday (4'th quarter + OT) have really disappointed me. Too games ago he started 0-3 from 3 but finished with 3-8. This game he took half threes, only 10 FGA on 38 minutes and didn't really let himself get to any rhythm.

Pistol King wrote:In order to make another leap next year, Deni will need to learn to stay aggressive and confident even if other players getting their buckets.

I noticed about him something mental. When other players having a high scoring night, he takes a back sit. If Deni ever wants to be a key part of a successful team, he can't afford himself to fall asleep and be passive when he's not the leading scorer. Even if the ball doesn't go your way, put yourself in positions to be available to receive the ball, show a body language of someone who wants to take part. His last 15 minutes yesterday (4'th quarter + OT) have really disappointed me. Too games ago he started 0-3 from 3 but finished with 3-8. This game he took half threes, only 10 FGA on 38 minutes and didn't really let himself get to any rhythm.

I disagree.

What I like best about Deni is that he tries to provide exactly what the team needs on a given night rather than just getting up shots in an effort to keep his scoring average up. Deni had 17 points, 12 boards, 3 assists and a steal last night. He deferred to Poole and Bagley who were both really cooking, and instead got on the glass, moved the ball, and took the shots that came to him. Let's not act like that's a bad game. That's a very good game.

Yeah I am fine with the way Deni is playing. With more experience he should cut down on the turnovers.

nate33 wrote:What I like best about Deni is that he tries to provide exactly what the team needs on a given night rather than just getting up shots in an effort to keep his scoring average up. Deni had 17 points, 12 boards, 3 assists and a steal last night. He deferred to Poole and Bagley who were both really cooking, and instead got on the glass, moved the ball, and took the shots that came to him. Let's not act like that's a bad game. That's a very good game.

I didn't mean he should have hunted shots. What I meant is he should have been much more active and showing himself available to receive the ball on offense. He totally disappeared in the 4th quarter + overtime. Can't call that a very good game when you get 0 points from one of your best players (if not the best one). Deni being assertive in these minutes could be the difference between getting a win here vs getting a loss. Use your quickness and driving ability. take off some pressure off Poole and Kuzma. Cam Thomas is on fire and guarding you, make him work defensively. The moment I saw the entire last 15 minutes were about Kuzma and Poole trading buckets* when everybody else standing still, I knew it's gonna be really hard to get a win here.

*in the last quarter + OT Kuzma and Poole have combined 18 FGAs, the rest of the team have combined 8 FGAs.

I also zooming out from the team for a second and talking about the next thing on the mental wise he would need to improve individually to take another leap next year. IMO his potential is too good offensively to act like a Draymond Green type player that could do nothing offensively for long stretches and focuses only on defense and getting boards for about 15 minutes. Especially when there is no Curry and Klay here. To be a true two way player, he can't afford disappearing. And to grow to be that two way player, he cant afford not even trying.

Pistol King wrote:

nate33 wrote:What I like best about Deni is that he tries to provide exactly what the team needs on a given night rather than just getting up shots in an effort to keep his scoring average up. Deni had 17 points, 12 boards, 3 assists and a steal last night. He deferred to Poole and Bagley who were both really cooking, and instead got on the glass, moved the ball, and took the shots that came to him. Let's not act like that's a bad game. That's a very good game.

I didn't mean he should have hunted shots. What I meant is he should have been much more active and showing himself available to receive the ball on offense. He totally disappeared in the 4th quarter + overtime. Can't call that a very good game when you get 0 points from one of your best players (if not the best one). Deni being assertive in these minutes could be the difference between getting a win here vs getting a loss. Use your quickness and driving ability. take off some pressure off Poole and Kuzma. Cam Thomas is on fire and guarding you, make him work defensively. The moment I saw the entire last 15 minutes were about Kuzma and Poole trading buckets* when everybody else standing still, I knew it's gonna be really hard to get a win here.

*in the last quarter + OT Kuzma and Poole have combined 18 FGAs, the rest of the team have combined 8 FGAs.

I also zooming out from the team for a second and talking about the next thing on the mental wise he would need to improve individually to take another leap next year. IMO his potential is too good offensively to act like a Draymond Green type player that could do nothing offensively for long stretches and focuses only on defense and getting boards for about 15 minutes. Especially when there is no Curry and Klay here. To be a true two way player, he can't afford disappearing. And to grow to be that two way player, he cant afford not even trying.

I agree with both of you. The best part of Deni is he isn't Kuzma or Poole. The worst part of Deni is that he defers to lesser players.