Calipari: Good Coach or Good Recruiter?

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Calipari: Good Coach or Good Recruiter? 

Post#1 » by sportscrazy » Tue Apr 7, 2015 1:05 am

Is Coach Cal, just a good recruiter or is he a good coach, too. I don't know where I stand on this. He can get talent and is great at doing so, but can he coach X's and O's to the level of Izzo, Coach K, etc.?
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Re: Calipari: Good Coach or Good Recruiter? 

Post#2 » by miltk » Thu May 7, 2015 6:12 am

recruiter. his best teams had the #1 player in the draft...rose wall davis. a few yrs ago a gm said ky players were the worst prepared of any school in the ncaa. im sure, though, he had forgotten about unc. ky teams finish equal to the quality of the recruits.
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Re: Calipari: Good Coach or Good Recruiter? 

Post#3 » by Bodie Broadus » Sat May 9, 2015 4:08 pm

I have really come to respect Cal in the past few years. Hearing him on WFAN with Francesa was a real eye opener to me, takes away the villain status that he's been labeled with. That being said, he really isn't a very good X's and O's guy, but as a recruiter he's top notch obviously. I really think he screwed up with that massive recruiting class last year, the platoon system turned off a handful of top players and look where all the late commits went, elsewhere. Top 30 kids don't want to play 20 minutes a night, they want 30-35.
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Re: Calipari: Good Coach or Good Recruiter? 

Post#4 » by JB1089 » Tue Sep 1, 2015 9:14 pm

He's the GOAT when it comes to recruiting, but I think he's an underrated coach: Which is to say that he's good. The people that hate him like to talk as if he's a terrible basketball coach, but that's obviously not true. He assembles HS all star teams and gets them to consistently buy in to a team concept. This is most clearly seen on the defensive side of the ball, where all of his teams play HARD. He has to get credit for that.

Now, he is a good coach, not a great one. And seeing as how even great coaches will screw up from time to time, Calipari does as well. The offense he was running down the stretch of the Final 4 game against Wisconsin earlier this year? Eesh. I have no idea what was going through his head. It was like he froze.
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Re: Calipari: Good Coach or Good Recruiter? 

Post#5 » by ZGendron317 » Tue Sep 22, 2015 12:27 am

Great recruiter. There's no coaching for those teams. He is never going to be like Izzo (Coaching GOAT) or even Coach K when it comes to coaching.
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Re: Calipari: Good Coach or Good Recruiter? 

Post#6 » by I Am Awesome-O » Wed Sep 23, 2015 2:40 am

A great recruiter and even better cheater.
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Re: Calipari: Good Coach or Good Recruiter? 

Post#7 » by ZGendron317 » Wed Sep 23, 2015 2:07 pm

I Am Awesome-O wrote:A great recruiter and even better cheater.


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Re: Calipari: Good Coach or Good Recruiter? 

Post#8 » by soxfan2003 » Tue Sep 29, 2015 3:34 am

sportscrazy wrote:Is Coach Cal, just a good recruiter or is he a good coach, too. I don't know where I stand on this. He can get talent and is great at doing so, but can he coach X's and O's to the level of Izzo, Coach K, etc.?


I don't think he is the best coach at creating plays but he is well prepared and knows how to attack teams. He is rarely going to be surprised by what the opposing team does. At Umass, he often beat Temple even when Temple had the better players and before Umass had Camby who was the only legitimate NBA player Calipari ever had at Umass.

He may not be the best X0 coach in terms of drawing up the absolute best plays but I think he does very well in the 90% of the things that win games. At Umass, probably his second best player was a 2nd round NBA pick who way very over-matched in the NBA. Yet, he still won lots of games.

Besides recruiting and promoting his teams/players, his strength has been at getting teams to play together and buy into a team concept. Sometimes he has had players not do that but he has removed them from the team.
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Re: Calipari: Good Coach or Good Recruiter? 

Post#9 » by Fischella » Mon Oct 19, 2015 4:00 pm

He is an awful coach in terms of understanding the game, Xs and Os and helping his players to improve, the guys that are really good, they are just themselves, before and after Cal, and the average guys dont really show improvements.
He is a good coach in terms of motivation, getting the group together, etc, he is a players' coach, with all that implies.
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Re: Calipari: Good Coach or Good Recruiter? 

Post#10 » by Diamondman07 » Thu Jun 30, 2016 5:01 pm

Good coach, great recruiter
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Re: Calipari: Good Coach or Good Recruiter? 

Post#11 » by oceanlife » Thu Jul 28, 2016 3:39 am

Phenomenal recruiter. Good coach, but X's and O's don't matter as much when you have the talent he routinely puts out.

I admire him for not guilt tripping his players into staying instead of going pro. For example: I remember watching Maryland basketball late 90's early 2000's and Gary Williams convinced potential lottery picks like Terrance Morris to stay in school. This was in no way in the players best interest (Morris ended up a second rounder two years later). Gary Williams just wanted to win games and made no secret of that fact.

It helped Gary Williams short term, but he was never able to build up a great reputation of getting kids into the NBA so he never got great recruiting classes.

Enter Calipari. He doesn't like calling his players student athletes, he pushed his players to declare for the draft when he thought they were ready. He built up a reputation with prospects for A) Being upfront with players and B) putting his players first. I even heard it said he cares more about getting kids drafted than winning championships.

Good article on him:

http://www.nydailynews.com/opinion/john-calipari-ncaa-honest-man-article-1.1055394

But a much more compelling case could be made that Calipari is a wolf in a land of foxes. Why? Because he’s honest about the realities of a very corrupt collegiate system that uses terms like “amateurism” as a cover for an operation that generates billions on the backs of unpaid teenagers.

The NCAA’s 14-year Final Four contract with CBS alone is worth $10.8 billion.

The Calipari way relies on recruiting star high schoolers to make a run at a championship before, at age 19 or 20, taking their talents to the NBA. He makes no claim that he is coaching “student-athletes” — a terminology that, much to the NCAA’s chagrin, he refuses to use.

He calls his a “players-first program” and has written that “when the season is over, when our TEAM is done playing, my job is to help them make the best decisions, with the best information I can give them, for them and their families. I’m not trying to convince them to come back if that’s not in their best interest. Likewise, I’m never trying to shove anybody out the door.”
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Re: Calipari: Good Coach or Good Recruiter? 

Post#12 » by Justwar » Mon Nov 7, 2016 4:34 pm

I am pretty sure if you ignore how good of a coach he was at UMass you miss his genius. 96 Kentucky was probably the most loaded team of all time, like 11 pros and he very closely came to beat us twice. For example in 2011, he took a juco in Josh Harrelson with marginal talent and put in sideline pick and roll mid season abandoning the dribble drive saving what was a down year at that point to a final 4 team. Another example is Karl towns, who in hs only shot 3s. He got him to UK and forced him to work on his post game. Yes he's showing in the nba his range now but without his post skill he developed throughout the year he would of never been the player he is.
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Re: Calipari: Good Coach or Good Recruiter? 

Post#13 » by Duke4life831 » Fri Nov 11, 2016 8:04 pm

He's the all time best recruiter without a doubt. He's also a very good defensive coach, the way he does get these top end guys to buy into defense is impressive.

Now the negatives, he's an awful in game coach, you don't see adjustments from him and continually you can see him getting out coached. Also offensively he has a lot to be desired. If Cal was getting just solid recruiting classes, he wouldn't be talked about as an elite coach which is why I think a NBA team paying big bucks for him would be a huge mistake. But with that said recruiting is part of coaching at the college level, so he is definitely an elite college coach.
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Re: Calipari: Good Coach or Good Recruiter? 

Post#14 » by Justwar » Sat Nov 12, 2016 4:47 pm

Duke4life831 wrote:He's the all time best recruiter without a doubt. He's also a very good defensive coach, the way he does get these top end guys to buy into defense is impressive.

Now the negatives, he's an awful in game coach, you don't see adjustments from him and continually you can see him getting out coached. Also offensively he has a lot to be desired. If Cal was getting just solid recruiting classes, he wouldn't be talked about as an elite coach which is why I think a NBA team paying big bucks for him would be a huge mistake. But with that said recruiting is part of coaching at the college level, so he is definitely an elite college coach.

You mean the adjustment in 2011 to drop the dribble drive to go to the sideline pick and roll that took a decent team to a final 4 team? Last year when poythress didn't recover health wise he inserted little used Derek willis who flourished till a ankle injury hit him at tournament time. And to say its only talent your ignoring his very talented Lou roe, Camby UMass teams that weren't high star players.
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Re: Calipari: Good Coach or Good Recruiter? 

Post#15 » by xxSnEaKyPxx » Sun Nov 20, 2016 6:09 am

He's an awful coach. I wouldn't even call him an average coach. Every year, he has far and away the most talented team in college basketball and every year, they play far below expectations. The only time he won, was when his team was just too OP for him to muck up.

Plus, I don't buy into the fact that he is "just" a good recruiter. I'm sorry, there are a lot of teams out there with plenty of history as well, and most of those teams are getting into the one and done players too. Even before he went to Kentucky he got Rose to go to Memphis. How many times have ya'll seen the #1 recruit sign with a college like Memphis? I just don't buy it and never will.
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Re: Calipari: Good Coach or Good Recruiter? 

Post#16 » by Justwar » Mon Nov 21, 2016 6:42 am

Talent wise yeah 2010 UK was great but didn't have any experience in the system at all. 2011 was the year the ncaa didn't allow Enes Kanter to play but now are letting any international to play even if foreign teams setup stipends. We had a overachiever type team. 2012 of course we were good. 2013 we were ok but Ryan harrows being home sick then noel tearing his acl left us with a mid major graduate transfer pg and a then project Willie cauley stein. 2014 we were very solid but we lost to a good uconn team that won it all (that lost to a u of L team that we beat, they beat uconn by 30) however we lost Willie cauley stein to a ankle injury and they picked and rolled us to death. 2015 early in the year we lost our best defender at the time Alex poythress who at the time was only allowing opposing sfs a field goal percentage of 13 percent through I believe 8 games and the pressure of being undefeated killed them. 2016 we never got a recovered poythress and struggled to get easy baskets and rebounds. The thing about the ncaa tournament it's about luck, if uk plays a couple of those tournaments over again I think they win but that's why it's single elimination. Best team doesn't always win.
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Re: Calipari: Good Coach or Good Recruiter? 

Post#17 » by Justwar » Tue Nov 29, 2016 12:28 am

For the folks who say he's a bad coach, vocal Kentucky hater Dan dakich even just said Cal is a great coach.

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Re: Calipari: Good Coach or Good Recruiter? 

Post#18 » by madmaxmedia » Tue Nov 29, 2016 8:32 pm

Both.

He has made some very insightful comments on college basketball and college in general, as well as his program and what he believes his responsibilities are towards his players.
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Re: Calipari: Good Coach or Good Recruiter? 

Post#19 » by DirtyDez » Wed Dec 21, 2016 5:59 am

xxSnEaKyPxx wrote:He's an awful coach. I wouldn't even call him an average coach. Every year, he has far and away the most talented team in college basketball and every year, they play far below expectations. The only time he won, was when his team was just too OP for him to muck up.

Plus, I don't buy into the fact that he is "just" a good recruiter. I'm sorry, there are a lot of teams out there with plenty of history as well, and most of those teams are getting into the one and done players too. Even before he went to Kentucky he got Rose to go to Memphis. How many times have ya'll seen the #1 recruit sign with a college like Memphis? I just don't buy it and never will.


Recruiting rankings on paper =/= most talented team on the court. Especially when they're mostly 18 year old kids...

He took two teams to the F4 that probably shouldn't have made it (the Knight & Randle teams). He's not a great coach but he's certainly not horrible like some of the hot takes suggest.
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Re: Calipari: Good Coach or Good Recruiter? 

Post#20 » by villematic32 » Wed Jan 11, 2017 5:38 am

sportscrazy wrote:Is Coach Cal, just a good recruiter or is he a good coach, too. I don't know where I stand on this. He can get talent and is great at doing so, but can he coach X's and O's to the level of Izzo, Coach K, etc.?


Great recruiter, good coach. Even better at preparing young men to become great professionals. At the end of the day, I don't think he will ever be a Coach K, Coach Izzo, Bill Self, Dean Smith, Roy Williams, etc.. or even Rick Pitino but he will always be the best at what he's currently best at ... molding great high school players to good/great Pros.

Not every great Duke, Carolina, Kansas player becomes a great pro, but if he's doing well at Kentucky, you can almost be sure they're going to be pretty good in the league. (In most cases)

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