Andrew Wiggins - can he force his way to the Raptors?

[Brigante]

Jim Jackson refused to play for the Hornets after they traded David Wesley for him. After weeks of being fined and still not showing up, the Hornets eventually caved and traded him to the Suns. Wiggins should let it be known that he would refuse to play for anyone but the raptors and tell them if they draft him he will sit the entire year out and they will lose the pick. Of course most teams would call his bluff....but if he really wants to play for the Raptors bad enough and was willing to sacrifice money, he would end up on the Raptors.

[Scoot McGroot]

Jim Jackson refused to play for the Hornets after they traded David Wesley for him. After weeks of being fined and still not showing up, the Hornets eventually caved and traded him to the Suns. Wiggins should let it be known that he would refuse to play for anyone but the raptors and tell them if they draft him he will sit the entire year out and they will lose the pick. Of course most teams would call his bluff....but if he really wants to play for the Raptors bad enough and was willing to sacrifice money, he would end up on the Raptors.

If he sits out a year, his rights would still be owned by the team that drafted him.

The highest paying years for players are on the mid to backend of their career. For every year they give up making NBA money, they lose a year on the backend of their career of salary. He'll still have to play out his rookie contract and his rights will still be controlled by his drafting team.

It's all possibilities, but it's the highest and it pat of unlikely chances. It'd be a first, and it'd even be an extreme first case to happen.

[Brigante]

Jim Jackson refused to play for the Hornets after they traded David Wesley for him. After weeks of being fined and still not showing up, the Hornets eventually caved and traded him to the Suns. Wiggins should let it be known that he would refuse to play for anyone but the raptors and tell them if they draft him he will sit the entire year out and they will lose the pick. Of course most teams would call his bluff....but if he really wants to play for the Raptors bad enough and was willing to sacrifice money, he would end up on the Raptors.

If he sits out a year, his rights would still be owned by the team that drafted him.

The highest paying years for players are on the mid to backend of their career. For every year they give up making NBA money, they lose a year on the backend of their career of salary. He'll still have to play out his rookie contract and his rights will still be controlled by his drafting team.

It's all possibilities, but it's the highest and it pat of unlikely chances. It'd be a first, and it'd even be an extreme first case to happen.

Speaking of Jim Jackson, he almost did exactly that his rookie year. The Mavericks didn't want to pay him what he was asking. He wanted 4th pick money but they said they wouldn't give that kind of money to a 6'6 player. He held out until about 28 games or something left in the season and the Mavericks caved and payed him his money. I thought at least at that time he could re-enter the draft again if they never signed him, with the Mavericks having zero rights to him. Has it changed?

[Scoot McGroot]

Jim Jackson refused to play for the Hornets after they traded David Wesley for him. After weeks of being fined and still not showing up, the Hornets eventually caved and traded him to the Suns. Wiggins should let it be known that he would refuse to play for anyone but the raptors and tell them if they draft him he will sit the entire year out and they will lose the pick. Of course most teams would call his bluff....but if he really wants to play for the Raptors bad enough and was willing to sacrifice money, he would end up on the Raptors.

If he sits out a year, his rights would still be owned by the team that drafted him.

The highest paying years for players are on the mid to backend of their career. For every year they give up making NBA money, they lose a year on the backend of their career of salary. He'll still have to play out his rookie contract and his rights will still be controlled by his drafting team.

It's all possibilities, but it's the highest and it pat of unlikely chances. It'd be a first, and it'd even be an extreme first case to happen.

Speaking of Jim Jackson, he almost did exactly that his rookie year. The Mavericks didn't want to pay him what he was asking. He wanted 4th pick money but they said they wouldn't give that kind of money to a 6'6 player. He held out until about 28 games or something left in the season and the Mavericks caved and payed him his money. I thought at least at that time he could re-enter the draft again if they never signed him, with the Mavericks having zero rights to him. Has it changed?

Yup. That was about 3 CBA's ago.

[Brigante]

Speaking of Jim Jackson, he almost did exactly that his rookie year. The Mavericks didn't want to pay him what he was asking. He wanted 4th pick money but they said they wouldn't give that kind of money to a 6'6 player. He held out until about 28 games or something left in the season and the Mavericks caved and payed him his money. I thought at least at that time he could re-enter the draft again if they never signed him, with the Mavericks having zero rights to him. Has it changed?

Yup. That was about 3 CBA's ago.

Okay then, yep Wiggins will go to whatever the hell team he gets drafted by!

I like the rule the old way better though.

[gswhoops]

This was an amazing read

But long story short, no, there's no even vaguely realistic way Wiggins ends up in Toronto unless they win the lotto.

[DEEP3CL]

The only way to enter the NBA is by first going through an NBA Entry Draft.

Pretty messed up, when you think about it.

No it's not. I get Wiggins wants to probably play in his hometown. But he's not going to end up there unless the Raptors put out a garbage team full of 3rd string guys that won't win.

The only conceivable way he could end up there is if the team who has the pick tries to milk Toronto dry of it's picks for years down the line. Basically every other year they surrender a pick to said team.

[Durins Baynes]

Things have changed since guys like Kobe forced his way to the Lakers. These days the players have no options, because teams are more aware of their own power, and keep the long game in mind. The massively increased scouting and new CBA design also help a lot too.

[ranger001]

If he sits out a year, his rights would still be owned by the team that drafted him.

Is this only if he signs a basketball contract with another non-NBA team or does it apply regardless of what he does?

[bondom34]

If he sits out a year, his rights would still be owned by the team that drafted him.

Is this only if he signs a basketball contract with another non-NBA team or does it apply regardless of what he does?

Regardless, the team that drafts him has his rights when he comes to the NBA, I know OKC just got a guy in the Kevin Martin deal that's overseas and is like 30 years old, so Minny still had his rights.

[ranger001]

If he sits out a year, his rights would still be owned by the team that drafted him.

Is this only if he signs a basketball contract with another non-NBA team or does it apply regardless of what he does?

Regardless, the team that drafts him has his rights when he comes to the NBA, I know OKC just got a guy in the Kevin Martin deal that's overseas and is like 30 years old, so Minny still had his rights.

Being overseas and on a contract is different than not being on a contract though. Or that is what Larry Coon's FAQ seems to say.

http://www.cbafaq.com/salarycap.htm#Q50
If the player is already under contract to, or signs a contract with a non-NBA team, the team retains the player's draft rights for one year after the player's obligation to the non-NBA team ends. Essentially, the clock stops as long as the player plays pro ball outside the NBA.

[bondom34]

Is this only if he signs a basketball contract with another non-NBA team or does it apply regardless of what he does?

Regardless, the team that drafts him has his rights when he comes to the NBA, I know OKC just got a guy in the Kevin Martin deal that's overseas and is like 30 years old, so Minny still had his rights.

Being overseas and on a contract is different than not being on a contract though. Or that is what Larry Coon's FAQ seems to say.

http://www.cbafaq.com/salarycap.htm#Q50
If the player is already under contract to, or signs a contract with a non-NBA team, the team retains the player's draft rights for one year after the player's obligation to the non-NBA team ends. Essentially, the clock stops as long as the player plays pro ball outside the NBA.

True, but (same question, 3rd bullet point:
If the player was eligible to play in college before he was drafted but does not go on to play college basketball, then the team retains the player's draft rights until the draft the player would have entered had he not declared early. For example, if a team drafts a college sophomore in 2012 and he does not return to college and play intercollegiate basketball, they retain his draft rights until the 2014 draft.

So he would still (assuming he's one and done) be retained for 3 years by the team. So he's setting back his free agency by 3 years minimum which as said by others, isn't impossible, but it's career suicide in how it would be viewed and the fact that he's giving up a huge FA deal for spite.

[ranger001]

Yeah I see if its going to take 3 years anyway then better to sign the rookie deal then do the Varejao thing.

[Scoot McGroot]

If he sits out a year, his rights would still be owned by the team that drafted him.

Is this only if he signs a basketball contract with another non-NBA team or does it apply regardless of what he does?

Yeah, as listed below, it appears they would hold his rights until 2017, at the earliest. After that, if he kept signing ANY professional deals elsewhere (international, NBDL, etc), the team that drafted him would keep his rights for another year. But, the question is, if he waits out his "college clock", and then sits a full year with no professional deal anywhere, would he have to re-enter the entry draft one more time as the rules state? Or would he immediately be a free agent.

So, he could enter this draft, wait out his "college clock", sit out one year of professional ball, and then possibly be declared a free agent in the NBA. Thus, he would be a free agent in about the summer of 2018, at the earliest?

Now, wouldn't it make sense to just play in the NBA for 4 years, then sign his QO, and be eligible for his first free agent deal outside of restricted free agency around 2019? He'll get a big money contract about the same time, but he'll have made about $30m over 5 years, instead of international money for 4 years, and then one completely unemployed year.


Or, I could be completely, 100% misguided in my random musing on this case. It's been known to happen before.

[JJOSU22]

Everyone is so high on Wiggins, but I think Okafor and Turner the following year are the players I'd be after.

[Xerxes_Tetra]

Here's the most viable scenario. Raptors don't win the lottery. Another team does. Wiggins demands to play for the Raptors and floats that he might play in Europe for a few seasons. He'll sign a monstrous endorsement deal so money won't be a problem regardless where he plays. Raptors put together a package to make that happen. A team picking first in this draft CANNOT come up empty handed. Raptors package their 2014 pick and other assets and a deal is made. Its certainly happened before:

http://ballislife.com/flashback-1999-dr ... at-2-pick/

[DBoys]

Here's the most viable scenario. Raptors don't win the lottery. Another team does. Wiggins demands to play for the Raptors and floats that he might play in Europe for a few seasons. He'll sign a monstrous endorsement deal so money won't be a problem regardless where he plays. Raptors put together a package to make that happen. A team picking first in this draft CANNOT come up empty handed. Raptors package their 2014 pick and other assets and a deal is made. Its certainly happened before:

http://ballislife.com/flashback-1999-dr ... at-2-pick/

Nah.

[Durins Baynes]

Won't happen. The team with his rights will call his bluff, and Wiggins will be the only one risking anything (injury in Europe, while delaying his big pay day in the US another year every one he stays away). Plus any team with the #1 pick probably doesn't mind being bad an extra year to get another young prospect. Teams have learnt since Kobe pulled this stunt- you always hang on to the guy and he'll have to come around. Rubio's people tried it too, and the Wolves just laughed and told him they'd wait.

[Scoot McGroot]

Here's the most viable scenario. Raptors don't win the lottery. Another team does. Wiggins demands to play for the Raptors and floats that he might play in Europe for a few seasons. He'll sign a monstrous endorsement deal so money won't be a problem regardless where he plays. Raptors put together a package to make that happen. A team picking first in this draft CANNOT come up empty handed. Raptors package their 2014 pick and other assets and a deal is made. Its certainly happened before:

http://ballislife.com/flashback-1999-dr ... at-2-pick/

Very different CBA's.


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[Xerxes_Tetra]

Wiretap just posted a story that Wiggins will likely sign a $140-180 million endorsement deal for 10 years. As I said, he'll be set the day he announces for the draft. If Yi Jianlian can force a team to trade him Andrew Wiggins can absolutely force a team to trade him.