Offer Sheets and Trades

Curmudgeon · Post #1 » by **Curmudgeon** » Sat Feb 22, 2014 3:22 pm

Can a team trade a restricted free agent who has signed an offer sheet from another team? The team doesn't want to match, and would rather get something than nothing. I realize that the window is now only 3 days. Assume the player will consent to everything.

There is probably a rule against this, but I can't find it. I understand that a team can't give or receive extra compensation for matching or not matching (i.e. "I'll give you a draft pick if you don't match"), but the trade scenario seems different, where the player's new team could step into the shoes of the old one.

answerthink · Post #2 » by **answerthink** » Sat Feb 22, 2014 3:24 pm

No. There is a rule against it.

Curmudgeon · Post #3 » by **Curmudgeon** » Sat Feb 22, 2014 5:23 pm

answerthink wrote:No. There is a rule against it.

Thanks, can you point me to it?

answerthink · Post #4 » by **answerthink** » Sat Feb 22, 2014 5:41 pm

Art XI, Sec 5(i), or http://www.cbafaq.com/salarycap.htm#Q90

DBoys · Post #5 » by **DBoys** » Sat Feb 22, 2014 5:58 pm

Art XI Sec 5 (i) and (j) show that offer sheet and S&T are mutually exclusive
i - Once an offer sheet is signed for player to play with team X, player cannot be S&T'ed to a Team Y (who then matches those terms)
j - However, the offer sheet CAN can be unraveled, if all 3 parties to the offer sheet (player, old team, and Team X) agree to kill the offer sheet.
>> That would then allow a S&T to a different team from the offer sheet, with a brand new deal via S&T worked out where there is no offer sheet and player signs with old team in a S&T to Team Y.

answerthink · Post #6 » by **answerthink** » Sat Feb 22, 2014 6:08 pm

The question being asked has a direct answer. Art XI, Sec 5(i) provides that answer.

An offer sheet can be unraveled with consent of all three parties, as you say. But it is not applicable to this scenario. The team which executed the offer sheet would have no reason to comply. There can be no compensation given to a team in return for their submitting or not submitting an offer sheet, or for matching or not matching an offer to a restricted free agent.

DBoys · Post #7 » by **DBoys** » Sat Feb 22, 2014 6:16 pm

answerthink wrote:The question being asked has a direct answer. Art XI, Sec 5(i) provides that answer.

An offer sheet can be unraveled with consent of all three parties, as you say. But it is not applicable to this scenario. The team which executed the offer sheet would have no reason to comply. There can be no compensation given to a team in return for their submitting or not submitting an offer sheet, or for matching or not matching an offer to a restricted free agent.

I understand that. I was not trying to imply your answer was less than correct, which is why I summarized the same thing as you did before adding anything else. I was simply adding more information, in case the OP was wondering about alternate theoretical possibilities rather than simply looking for a narrow answer to the specific question asked.

Curmudgeon · Post #8 » by **Curmudgeon** » Sat Feb 22, 2014 8:01 pm

Many thanks for the responses. I guess I see the logic that if a restricted FA is traded, it's a sign and trade. He would have to first accept his QO and consent, since without the QO the receiving team wouldn't know the cap value of the incoming player.

What about this situation: a team with a restricted free agent knows an offer sheet is coming, but also knows that it hasn't been signed. Can the RFA be traded?

I suppose most offer sheets provide that they cannot be disclosed until signed. But suppose the RFA tells a teammate who is under no nondisclosure obligation, who then informs the team. The RFA has violated his obligation but not the team-- and what penalty would the player suffer as a practical matter?

DBoys · Post #9 » by **DBoys** » Sat Feb 22, 2014 8:04 pm

You can't trade a player if you don't have them under contract. Ever. Once he's signed an offer sheet, he is under contract to either old team or new team.

You can trade draft rights, of course, if player has never signed with an NBA team.

Curmudgeon · Post #10 » by **Curmudgeon** » Sat Feb 22, 2014 8:16 pm

DBoys wrote:You can't trade a player if you don't have them under contract. Ever. Once he's signed an offer sheet, he is under contract to either old team or new team.

You can trade draft rights, of course, if player has never signed with an NBA team.

Well, an RFA is sort of in limbo. He's not technically "under contract," but his team does have contractual rights (to match an offer and to extend a QO). Plus, even if the player fails to accept the QO by October 1, he's still restricted. He can sit out or negotiate a new deal with his current team, but he can't play elsewhere. That sounds like someone under contract to me.

DBoys · Post #11 » by **DBoys** » Sat Feb 22, 2014 9:13 pm

Regardless, restricted (as well as "may become restricted") are not contracts. And the operating NBA principle is that, once that 1st contract with some NBA team is signed, a player can't be assigned to another team via trade if he's not under contract.

And "he can't play elsewhere" isn't true. He just can't sign to play with another NBA team. But he's a free agent to sign elsewhere if he wishes, which is not true if you have an NBA contract.

giberish · Post #12 » by **giberish** » Sat Feb 22, 2014 10:04 pm

You can't trade an RFA except as a sign and trade, and the player has to agree with it to make it happen (they can't be forced to sign against their will).

One thing that can and does happen is that while you can't work out a sign and trade deal once a player signs an offer sheet (it's either match or let go for his old team), if a player agrees to a deal during the July moratorium, the two teams can then work out a sign and trade deal (because nothing was official).