"Maximum" Qualifying Offer

[Christine-In-AZ]

I've seen the term "Max Qualifying Offer" which implies all qualifying offers are not equal. I know there's a scale depending on where a player was drafted, but is it all formulaic?

My question is specifically in regards to the Bledsoe/Suns negotiations.

If the Suns and Bledsoe can not reach an agreement or a good sign and trade fit that works for Bledsoe, and Eric is prepared to accept the risk of signing the current 3.7 million QO at the end of September, can the Suns bump up the QO offer...at all?

Why would the Suns even want to do such a thing, some may ask?

It would be a message a gesture to Bledsoe that the Suns do want to be a strong player when he becomes a FA next summer. It would be a good faith offering. Despite the false rumors, Bledsoe does not hate the Suns, and the asking for the max is far more about career control than money. Both sides know it's just hard fought business. His agent knows the max is too high for anyone to pay currently. Forcing/Approving a sign and trade is control. Becoming an UFA is control...even if the result is resigning with the Suns next summer.

[DBoys]

I've seen the term "Max Qualifying Offer" which implies all qualifying offers are not equal. I know there's a scale depending on where a player was drafted, but is it all formulaic?

My question is specifically in regards to the Bledsoe/Suns negotiations.

If the Suns and Bledsoe can not reach an agreement or a good sign and trade fit that works for Bledsoe, and Eric is prepared to accept the risk of signing the current 3.7 million QO at the end of September, can the Suns bump up the QO offer...at all?

Why would the Suns even want to do such a thing, some may ask?

It would be a message a gesture to Bledsoe that the Suns do want to be a strong player when he becomes a FA next summer. It would be a good faith offering. Despite the false rumors, Bledsoe does not hate the Suns, and the asking for the max is far more about career control than money. Both sides know it's just hard fought business. His agent knows the max is too high for anyone to pay currently. Forcing/Approving a sign and trade is control. Becoming an UFA is control...even if the result is resigning with the Suns next summer.

A max QO is not like a normal QO. It is basically an offer of a full 5 year max deal with max raises, and in Bledsoe's case it would be an offer for almost $85M over 5 years. The Suns clearly aren't interested in offering him $85M.

[Christine-In-AZ]

I've seen the term "Max Qualifying Offer" which implies all qualifying offers are not equal. I know there's a scale depending on where a player was drafted, but is it all formulaic?

My question is specifically in regards to the Bledsoe/Suns negotiations.

If the Suns and Bledsoe can not reach an agreement or a good sign and trade fit that works for Bledsoe, and Eric is prepared to accept the risk of signing the current 3.7 million QO at the end of September, can the Suns bump up the QO offer...at all?

Why would the Suns even want to do such a thing, some may ask?

It would be a message a gesture to Bledsoe that the Suns do want to be a strong player when he becomes a FA next summer. It would be a good faith offering. Despite the false rumors, Bledsoe does not hate the Suns, and the asking for the max is far more about career control than money. Both sides know it's just hard fought business. His agent knows the max is too high for anyone to pay currently. Forcing/Approving a sign and trade is control. Becoming an UFA is control...even if the result is resigning with the Suns next summer.

A max QO is not like a normal QO. It is basically an offer of a full 5 year max deal with max raises, and in Bledsoe's case it would be an offer for almost $85M over 5 years. The Suns clearly aren't interested in offering him $85M.

So a "Max Qualifying Offer" is just another way of saying a max offer to a player for which you have Bird Rights. I don't understand the "qualifying" descriptor, but ok.

So the Suns currently standing Qualifying Offer to Bledsoe of 3.7 million is what it is and can't be increased. Do I have that right?

[DBoys]

A max QO is not just an offer, but
1 it is a QUALIFYING offer, which means it makes a player a RFA
2 it cannot be offered to a Bird rights player, but instead to a player who meets the criteria to be a RFA (see Coon's CBA FAQ)
3 is a different kind of QO than the regular one in that, if accepted, it keeps the player for 5 years rather than 1 ..with certain players, you might not want to even open the door to the possibility that they'd accept a one-year deal and then leave

As for PHX and Bledsoe, the QO is the QO. If they wanted to offer him a one-year deal for any other number, they could obviously do so, but they have nothing to gain by bidding against themselves.

[Christine-In-AZ]

A max QO is not just an offer, but
1 it is a QUALIFYING offer, which means it makes a player a RFA
2 it cannot be offered to a Bird rights player, but instead to a player who meets the criteria to be a RFA (see Coon's CBA FAQ)
3 is a different kind of QO than the regular one in that, if accepted, it keeps the player for 5 years rather than 1 ..with certain players, you might not want to even open the door to the possibility that they'd accept a one-year deal and then leave

As for PHX and Bledsoe, the QO is the QO. If they wanted to offer him a one-year deal for any other number, they could obviously do so, but they have nothing to gain by bidding against themselves.

Ok. The 3.7 million QO cannot be increased by the Suns per the CBA

In my original post, the idea was that the Suns would be trying to "make thing better" when the QO was about to be accepted...not a bidding against themselves. Something like...

"Eric, we the Suns appreciate your dedication and play of last season. We're disappointed that a contract solution could not be agreed to. To show you our appreciation and with hopes that you will consider playing in Phoenix when you become a FA next summer, we have upped the QO to 5 million dollars"

But that simply can't happen.

It is a surprise to hear that the Suns can (albeit unlikely) offer a 1 year "regular" contract. I thought it had to be 2 years. The best thing about this would be, it wouldn't have the QO's stipulations that Bledsoe would have to approve any trade and if he approved a deal, the team receiving Bledsoe would not get his Bird Rights.

[DBoys]

1 Because the Suns have the only deals on the table, and have given EB two to choose from, any other contract the Suns put on the table is indeed bidding against themselves.
2 I don't think that would be wise. I don't think the Suns will consider it, But, it's their money.
3 A grand gesture like you describe is water over the dam, once we get to the summer. He'll still look for the best deal, so it gains nothing.
4 There's nothing special about the QO, other than the fact it is a mandatory contract offer if the Suns want EBs ROFR rights.
5 If they wanted to, they can offer him a one year deal for any number up to the max. (Will they? Seriously doubt it, because they spend extra but don;t get him for more years like they prefer.)
6 "it wouldn't have the QO's stipulations that Bledsoe would have to approve any trade and if he approved a deal, the team receiving Bledsoe would not get his Bird Rights."...Yes, it would. That's not a QO rule. It's a "re-signing your own free agent to a one-year contract" rule.

[Christine-In-AZ]

1 Because the Suns have the only deals on the table, and have given EB two to choose from, any other contract the Suns put on the table is indeed bidding against themselves.
2 I don't think that would be wise. I don't think the Suns will consider it, But, it's their money.
3 A grand gesture like you describe is water over the dam, once we get to the summer. He'll still look for the best deal, so it gains nothing.
4 There's nothing special about the QO, other than the fact it is a mandatory contract offer if the Suns want EBs ROFR rights.
5 If they wanted to, they can offer him a one year deal for any number up to the max. (Will they? Seriously doubt it, because they spend extra but don;t get him for more years like they prefer.)
6 "it wouldn't have the QO's stipulations that Bledsoe would have to approve any trade and if he approved a deal, the team receiving Bledsoe would not get his Bird Rights."...Yes, it would. That's not a QO rule. It's a "re-signing your own free agent to a one-year contract" rule.

The Suns have offered Bledsoe 12m for this coming year. If he takes the QO the Suns will have saved 8.3 million for the same roster because of it.

It seams the Suns can, if they chose, "give" Eric a "bonus" if they want, if Eric decides to take the one year QO.

Maybe Bledsoe is as cold as a robot or some alien, but I doubt it. If the Suns and Bledsoe come to a place where he is literally ready to put pen to paper and agree to 3.7 million for one year yet the Suns stop him saying- "Wait! Here's another contract worth 1.3 million more this year...3.7 isn't right, you're worth more than that". It can't hurt in negotiations next summer. YES! Bledsoe will certainly take the best offer from a team he wants to play for...that "best offer" and "best team" might actually be Phoenix next summer. From your point of view "it gains nothing". Really? Nothing? There's no true accounting for exactly it would gain, but if the Suns and Bledsoe are left with this 3.7m QO and I'm the Suns GM I'm stepping up and giving Eric a money bump. He's not even considering a Suns offer next July without it...and the cost is small. The gesture would be outside-of-the-box NBA move and I'm guessing would garner the Suns an iota or two of respect with the players around the league. May not tip the scales for ERic, but down the road?

I was just looking for verification that a "despite after all we've been through, Eric " possible magnanimous financial gesture is legal. I think it is.

Hopefully all this is QO talk is moot by October 1 and he's re-upped as a Sun or a SnT has been found.

[DBoys]

Obviously most of this is opinion, and we each see it like we see it.

* Yes a one year deal is legal. But I think the odds of one (other than the QO) are almost exactly 0.

* FYI we've seen other NBA "gestures" and they didn't matter, such as Boozer in CLE and Parsons in HOU. What mattered was the money offered in the deal.

* IMO if PHX wants him, and has a few extra millions to play with, the smart way to use it would be to up their offer next summer, when they can already offer him the biggest deal but might not.

[giberish]

One time this happened before was David Lee in NYK.

He was a RFA in 2009. The Knicks didn't want to sign him to a long-term deal due to LeBron dreams but did prefer to keep him for a year (they didn't have their own pick in 2010 so they didn't want a major tank). They agreed to a 1-year deal for significant money (I think in the $6M to $10M range, way more than his QO as a #30 pick).

It's a little different as the Knicks didn't really plan on resigning him. Even after not getting LeBron they went with Amare and dealt Lee to GS for Anthony Randolph and salary filler.

[MarkDeeks]

Maximum qualifying offers are a bit rubbish. I explained them a bit here:

http://www.hoop365.com/nba/max-deal-the ... th-irving/

About half way down, in brackets.

[nodeal]

Max qualifying offer's are basically for super stars who want out. It guarantees the team gets the player for another 3 years vs 2 years. The player has to actually be worth the max. Bledsoe wishes phx offered the max QO.

PHX knows bledsoe has to choose between their offer and a cheap 1 yr QO. If they offer a better 1 yr deal out of good faith, he'll be less likely to sign their 4-5 year deal at a value rate. If he wont take their value rate this yr he probably wont take it next yr even coming off a good faith 1 yr deal. A simple S&T seems like it would be best for everyone. PHX just needs to lower their asking price from love to not love.