What is the deal with McDyess?

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What is the deal with McDyess? 

Post#1 » by Mr. Sun » Fri Nov 7, 2008 12:16 pm

I was under the impression when a player gets traded he must report within like 48 hours; not drag his feet, whine or make demands. Under the CBA the league can suspend a player who refuses to report to their team to play, right?
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Re: What is the deal with McDyess? 

Post#2 » by killbuckner » Fri Nov 7, 2008 2:27 pm

Isn't it better for Denver if McDyess doesn't report and retires? They wouldn't have to pay him and he wouldn't count towards the tax.
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Re: What is the deal with McDyess? 

Post#3 » by golfer2 » Tue Nov 11, 2008 1:39 pm

What would have happened if Denver had refused to waive McDyess and if he had refused to report?
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Re: What is the deal with McDyess? 

Post#4 » by killbuckner » Tue Nov 11, 2008 7:04 pm

he would have been suspended by the team without pay.
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Re: What is the deal with McDyess? 

Post#5 » by golfer2 » Tue Nov 11, 2008 8:24 pm

killbuckner wrote:he would have been suspended by the team without pay.


So now Denver pays Dice his full salary for 2008/09 ($6,813,050) and 2009/10 ($6,813,050) - or was there a buyout? And Dice can sign with Boston or Cleveland or Detroit (after 30 days) or ??? and get even more $$$ - Dice is sort of milking the system, eh.

I realize that Denver does get some $$$ set-off, but it still sort of stinks that Dice doesn't have to honor the contract he signed.
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Re: What is the deal with McDyess? 

Post#6 » by killbuckner » Wed Nov 12, 2008 1:21 pm

McDyess did agree to a buyout and left a significant amount of money on the table. He would have had to live up to the contract (unless he basically wanted to retire) if Denver hadn't offered to buy him out.
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Re: What is the deal with McDyess? 

Post#7 » by Dunkenstein » Thu Nov 13, 2008 6:46 am

golfer2 wrote:
killbuckner wrote:he would have been suspended by the team without pay.


So now Denver pays Dice his full salary for 2008/09 ($6,813,050) and 2009/10 ($6,813,050) - or was there a buyout? And Dice can sign with Boston or Cleveland or Detroit (after 30 days) or ??? and get even more $$$ - Dice is sort of milking the system, eh.

I realize that Denver does get some $$$ set-off, but it still sort of stinks that Dice doesn't have to honor the contract he signed.

Don't worry about Dice taking advantage of Denver. Denver is paying him less than half of what he was contracted to receive over the two remaining years. Plus Denver is now down to about $1M over the luxury tax threshold which they can easily deal with by trading away Hunter or Atkins, cash and a pick to Memphis or else a team with a TPE big enough to cover one of their salaries.
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Re: What is the deal with McDyess? 

Post#8 » by Nutty Nats Fan » Sat Nov 15, 2008 10:39 pm

I have a question about Dice. Figured I'd leave it in this thread.

With Dice being paid about 3 million this season and 3 million the next by Denver, if a team signs Dice to a one year deal this year for 1 million, Denver would only owe him 2 million for this season then?

I know he wouldn't be paid for a full season by the other team, but just assume full season so the math doesn't get complex lol.
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Re: What is the deal with McDyess? 

Post#9 » by Dunkenstein » Sun Nov 16, 2008 8:00 am

Nutty Nats Fan wrote:With Dice being paid about 3 million this season and 3 million the next by Denver, if a team signs Dice to a one year deal this year for 1 million, Denver would only owe him 2 million for this season then?

No, the Nuggets will still owe him $3M for this season and $3M for next. Anything that he is paid by another team or teams is over and above what the Nuggets owe him.
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Re: What is the deal with McDyess? 

Post#10 » by Nutty Nats Fan » Sun Nov 16, 2008 8:42 am

Okay, so that's the NFL then I was thinking of? Thanks.

Oh well. Dice is making out like a bandit then.
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Re: What is the deal with McDyess? 

Post#11 » by golfer2 » Sun Nov 16, 2008 6:50 pm

Dunkenstein wrote:
Nutty Nats Fan wrote:With Dice being paid about 3 million this season and 3 million the next by Denver, if a team signs Dice to a one year deal this year for 1 million, Denver would only owe him 2 million for this season then?

No, the Nuggets will still owe him $3M for this season and $3M for next. Anything that he is paid by another team or teams is over and above what the Nuggets owe him.


From:

http://members.cox.net/lmcoon/salarycap.htm#Q55

"If another team signs a released player who had a guaranteed contract (as long as the player has cleared waivers -- see question number 54), the player's original team is allowed to reduce the amount of money they still owe the player (and lower their team salary) by a commensurate amount (this is called the right of set-off). This is true if the player signs with any professional team -- it doesn't even have to be an NBA team. The amount the original team gets to set off is limited to one-half the difference between the player's new salary and the minimum salary for a one-year veteran (if the player is a rookie, then the rookie minimum is used instead)."
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Re: What is the deal with McDyess? 

Post#12 » by Dunkenstein » Mon Nov 17, 2008 12:41 am

In a buy-out situation, where the player takes less than the amount contractually owed him, the right of set-off is most always waived by the team.
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Re: What is the deal with McDyess? 

Post#13 » by LarryCoon » Mon Nov 17, 2008 9:26 pm

Further to what Dunkenstein wrote, while set-off works as described in my FAQ (which golfer2 quoted), teams are allowed to waive those rights (it's a clause that goes in the contract). As Dunk wrote, it's usually waived in a buyout situation, and usually NOT waived in a standard waiver scenario.
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Re: What is the deal with McDyess? 

Post#14 » by golfer2 » Mon Nov 17, 2008 10:55 pm

LarryCoon wrote:Further to what Dunkenstein wrote, while set-off works as described in my FAQ (which golfer2 quoted), teams are allowed to waive those rights (it's a clause that goes in the contract). As Dunk wrote, it's usually waived in a buyout situation, and usually NOT waived in a standard waiver scenario.


Thanks Larry and Dunk - learn something new every day

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Re: What is the deal with McDyess? 

Post#15 » by Nutty Nats Fan » Thu Nov 20, 2008 7:05 pm

Interesting. So in the buyout, there would most likely be a clause about having the set-off waived. Thanks for the further info.
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Re: What is the deal with McDyess? 

Post#16 » by Uncle Mxy » Sat Mar 21, 2009 11:21 pm

So, do the Pistons have Bird Rights for McDyess?
Marc Stein at ESPN seems to think so.
http://sports.espn.go.com/nba/dailydime ... -090321-22
The assumption, of course, is that McDyess will be compensated for his selflessness in the summer, when he returns to free agency, with Detroit regaining McDyess' Larry Bird rights when he re-signed with them on Dec. 9. The Pistons thus possess the ability to give him a raise without restrictions even if they use up their projected $17 million in cap room this summer on other free agents.

But I would think that getting bought out by another team would end that. He was signed as a FA by Detroit from Denver (even if he didn't play a game for Denver), so it seems like that'd reset the Bird Rights clock. Right?
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Re: What is the deal with McDyess? 

Post#17 » by casey » Sun Mar 22, 2009 3:12 am

Pretty sure Stein doesn't have a clue what he's talking about.
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Re: What is the deal with McDyess? 

Post#18 » by FGump » Sun Mar 22, 2009 11:30 pm

Stein whiffed TWICE on his cap-related assu ptions in that one paragraph.

First, he is wrong in saying Detroit has any Bird rights on McDyess. AD's Bird clock was reset when Denver bought him out. He will be a Non-Qualifying Veteran Free Agent and there will be neither full Bird rights nor early Bird rights on him this summer.

Second, he is wrong in his assertion that a team far under the cap can use up all its cap space on other players, then sign that player with Bird rights using that exception. There is a cap hold for a multiple of the prior salary that exhausts some of the team's cap if they want to retain those Bird rights. Since the Pistons don't have any Bird rights on AD, this won't come into play anyhow. But the point is, they'll have to save cap space for him if they want to sign him to a deal bigger than the minimum.
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Re: What is the deal with McDyess? 

Post#19 » by LarryCoon » Tue Mar 31, 2009 4:08 am

Marc checked with me AFTER rather than BEFORE he wrote that article. Let that teach him a lesson...

FGump -- actually, the Denver waiver didn't reset the Bird clock. Being waived from a contract prior to the last one before becoming a free agent doesn't count against Bird rights. As a more extreme example, a team can sign a free agent one year, and waive him in training camp. They can sign him the next summer and waive him in training camp again. They can sign him again the summer after that, and if he plays the full year, then they have full Bird rights.

What reset McDyess' Bird rights was when he signed with Detroit again, since he changed teams as a free agent in a year other than the first year. They don't gain Bird rights even though: 1) He will have completed his final contract, and 2) He signed contracts exclusively with what will become his Prior Team.

I've been burned before by what I thought was a plain & straightforward reading of the CBA that turned out to have a different interpretation than I thought, so I checked with the league to be sure. They confirmed that it works out the way that I described above.
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Re: What is the deal with McDyess? 

Post#20 » by Dunkenstein » Tue Mar 31, 2009 5:21 am

LarryCoon wrote:FGump -- actually, the Denver waiver didn't reset the Bird clock.

I think we're getting into semantics here. Being waived by Denver may not have reset the Bird clock, but it sure stopped it. Once McD was waived by Denver there was no scenario that would enable his Bird clock to be restarted. When he then signed with Detroit, a new Bird clock was started.

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