Draymond Green Produced Like NBA's 2nd Best Player When Playing Center

[RealGM Wiretap]

Draymond Green is receiving some consideration for All-NBA Center First Team.

Green played a significant percentage of his minutes at center for the Golden State Warriors this season.

Per 36 minutes, Green averaged 19.8 points, 11.3 rebounds, 7.8 assists, 1.4 steals, 2.3 blocks, 2.8 turnovers and a True Shooting Percentage of .689 at the center position.

The Warriors also were 26.6 points per 48 minutes better than their opponents with Green at center.

Green was second in the NBA in Positional Daily RAPM when at center in the entire NBA, trailing on Stephen Curry.

Via Seth Partnow/Nylon Calculus

[12footrim]

Imagine if they actually started him there . For all the good they do sometimes these coaches have to be dragged along kicking and screaming as the game evolves.

[fefe22]

Green is not a center.
He is just one of the 5 players on the floor when the Warriors play positionless basketball, and he is the one defending the opposing centers.
He does not play center on offense at all.
You could actually make a better case calling him a PG, since Curry is clearly a SG on offense...

[HotelVitale]

Green is not a center. He is just one of the 5 players on the floor when the Warriors play positionless basketball, and he is the one defending the opposing centers. He does not play center on offense at all. You could actually make a better case calling him a PG, since Curry is clearly a SG on offense...

That's weird logic. 'He can't be considered a center because his team doesn't have positions.' If the best team in the league (and maybe ever) doesn't have clear positions, it makes a lot more sense to critique/bend the position model of the all-NBA team than it does to bar Green from it. It seems much more true that the model doesn't apply here than that Green is worse than 'real centers.'

That's also a giant slippery slope: if Green, who's listed as the starting 5 and who almost always defends the opponent's 5, doesn't look/play enough like a center to be one, then what's the criteria for a 'real' C or SG or PF, and who sets it? Is there a height limit, a minimum amount of time spent in the paint, a restriction on catching/initiating on the perimeter too many times?

[12footrim]

Green is not a center.
He is just one of the 5 players on the floor when the Warriors play positionless basketball, and he is the one defending the opposing centers.
He does not play center on offense at all.
You could actually make a better case calling him a PG, since Curry is clearly a SG on offense...

If you guard the other teams center, you are a the center or call it whatever you want. Every team in the modern NBA would take the most skilled players on offense. What makes that possible though is being able to guard the position on Defense effectively and rebound at a high enough level. Center is probably the one you really can't just hide anyone at because you sill usually will need someone to anchor the defense and to protect the rim and rebound to be successful.

[GQ Hot Dog]

Imagine if they actually started him there . For all the good they do sometimes these coaches have to be dragged along kicking and screaming as the game evolves.

When Green plays center is when the Warriors are playing at their absolutely most rabid pace which they can't do the whole game in an 82 game season, it takes too much energy. If they're not playing at that pace, Dray would be at a disadvantage against other centers. When they play at a high tempo it often forces the other teams starting center off the floor. The lineup of death isn't something the Warriors can do all game long(except maybe in the finals).

[Lakers4Life310]

Draymond is not a Center. First the NBA making the All Star Game with all Forwards and No Centers. What a Joke. Now they basically want to give Draymond the Center spot. Spot it. Cousins, Deandre, Karl Anthony deserve to win it cause they're a CENTER position. Draymond is deadly of course at Center but he's a forward plain and simple.

[bdp31770]

Bogut played more minutes at center, though Im not sure why it blows people's minds that Green is so effective at center. He's almost the same height, wingspan, and weight as Ben Wallace.

[step3profit]

Draymond is not a Center. First the NBA making the All Star Game with all Forwards and No Centers. What a Joke. Now they basically want to give Draymond the Center spot. Spot it. Cousins, Deandre, Karl Anthony deserve to win it cause they're a CENTER position. Draymond is deadly of course at Center but he's a forward plain and simple.

If it walks like a duck, and it quacks like a duck... it's a duck.

[12footrim]

Imagine if they actually started him there . For all the good they do sometimes these coaches have to be dragged along kicking and screaming as the game evolves.

When Green plays center is when the Warriors are playing at their absolutely most rabid pace which they can't do the whole game in an 82 game season, it takes too much energy. If they're not playing at that pace, Dray would be at a disadvantage against other centers. When they play at a high tempo it often forces the other teams starting center off the floor. The lineup of death isn't something the Warriors can do all game long(except maybe in the finals).

Yeah, yeah. Wilt Chamberlin used to play 48 minutes a game at insane pace all 82 games in canvas sneakers with 1960's sports science. At 36 years old and 300lbs he was still playing 44 minutes a game like that. All the top players of that era were.

I don't buy it. If anything if they started their best team they would just blow teams out earlier and could sit their players more. Instead they would rather dick around until some of these games got hairy late and then would deploy this death lineup when their players are already fatigued. Probably cost them a game or two as well.

The reason that line up plays "rabid" pace is because they've let the game get to close or they are behind from screwing around and not playing it earlier. Dont' give me that other center would exploit him, dude handled Marc Gasol even AD and others fine or as good as any other option anytime he's guarded them.

For as progressive as Kerr is on the forfront of the evolution of the game he's even still resistant to go all in even when what's clearly the future and best way is slapping him him the face. He'd still rather trot out Anderson Varejoe big chunks of the game to drag his ass along when they could be even greater.

[kobe_vs_jordan]

Draymond is not a Center. First the NBA making the All Star Game with all Forwards and No Centers. What a Joke. Now they basically want to give Draymond the Center spot. Spot it. Cousins, Deandre, Karl Anthony deserve to win it cause they're a CENTER position. Draymond is deadly of course at Center but he's a forward plain and simple.

If it walks like a duck, and it quacks like a duck... it's a duck.

He plays about 5 minutes a game a center.

[haste10176]

Green is not a center.
He is just one of the 5 players on the floor when the Warriors play positionless basketball, and he is the one defending the opposing centers.
He does not play center on offense at all.
You could actually make a better case calling him a PG, since Curry is clearly a SG on offense...

Thats the dumbest statement I have ever seen on this site....

[haste10176]

Draymond is not a Center. First the NBA making the All Star Game with all Forwards and No Centers. What a Joke. Now they basically want to give Draymond the Center spot. Spot it. Cousins, Deandre, Karl Anthony deserve to win it cause they're a CENTER position. Draymond is deadly of course at Center but he's a forward plain and simple.

If it walks like a duck, and it quacks like a duck... it's a duck.

He plays about 5 minutes a game a center.

In the NBA finals last season he played a lot more minutes at centre clearly he can hold the position and probably better than the aforementioned.

[spree2kawhi]

Bogut played more minutes at center, though Im not sure why it blows people's minds that Green is so effective at center. He's almost the same height, wingspan, and weight as Ben Wallace.

Zach Randolph looked slimmer than him...

[Twinkie defense]

Green is not a center.
He is just one of the 5 players on the floor when the Warriors play positionless basketball, and he is the one defending the opposing centers.
He does not play center on offense at all.
You could actually make a better case calling him a PG, since Curry is clearly a SG on offense...

I prefer referring to players as point guards, wings, and bigs, not as one of five constrained positional players, but typically you determine a player's position by what position he guards (not by whether on offense he plays in the post or on the perimeter). It is perfectly fair to refer to Draymond as either a power forward or center... or even, point forward.

[andyjinkim]

I think it's pretty simple. The award should be based on the position that the player plays THE MOST, in other words their PRIMARY position..which is not Center for Draymond.

[br7knicks]

Green is not a center. He is just one of the 5 players on the floor when the Warriors play positionless basketball, and he is the one defending the opposing centers. He does not play center on offense at all. You could actually make a better case calling him a PG, since Curry is clearly a SG on offense...

That's weird logic. 'He can't be considered a center because his team doesn't have positions.' If the best team in the league (and maybe ever) doesn't have clear positions, it makes a lot more sense to critique/bend the position model of the all-NBA team than it does to bar Green from it. It seems much more true that the model doesn't apply here than that Green is worse than 'real centers.'

That's also a giant slippery slope: if Green, who's listed as the starting 5 and who almost always defends the opponent's 5, doesn't look/play enough like a center to be one, then what's the criteria for a 'real' C or SG or PF, and who sets it? Is there a height limit, a minimum amount of time spent in the paint, a restriction on catching/initiating on the perimeter too many times?

Exactly. That was an asinine thing of fefe to say. Green clearly plays at center. Just because he's not a traditional one doesn't mean he can't take on the label.

He plays minutes at center. That makes him a center.

[Lakers4Life310]

Green is not a center. He is just one of the 5 players on the floor when the Warriors play positionless basketball, and he is the one defending the opposing centers. He does not play center on offense at all. You could actually make a better case calling him a PG, since Curry is clearly a SG on offense...

That's weird logic. 'He can't be considered a center because his team doesn't have positions.' If the best team in the league (and maybe ever) doesn't have clear positions, it makes a lot more sense to critique/bend the position model of the all-NBA team than it does to bar Green from it. It seems much more true that the model doesn't apply here than that Green is worse than 'real centers.'

That's also a giant slippery slope: if Green, who's listed as the starting 5 and who almost always defends the opponent's 5, doesn't look/play enough like a center to be one, then what's the criteria for a 'real' C or SG or PF, and who sets it? Is there a height limit, a minimum amount of time spent in the paint, a restriction on catching/initiating on the perimeter too many times?

Exactly. That was an asinine thing of fefe to say. Green clearly plays at center. Just because he's not a traditional one doesn't mean he can't take on the label.

He plays minutes at center. That makes him a center.

Stop it! It's like saying Giannis is a POINT GUARD. He's NOT, he just happens to have the ball in his hands a lot more than Michael Carter and Michael Carter is guarding the Point Guard. Draymond doesnt' start the game off as Center, Bogut does. All star Ballot, he's a forward and not a Center.

[fefe22]

but typically you determine a player's position by what position he guards (not by whether on offense he plays in the post or on the perimeter)

Well, not me...
If Giannis play PG on offense, but defends forwards on the other end, I still call him the PG.
Switching on defense does not change your position.

There are 5 slots on the floor, and TYPICALLY you put 2 guards, 2 forwards and 1 center in those 5 slots.
But that you can always chose to do differently, and use an offense with no centers (or 2 centers if you wish), and that is what the Warriors do when they go small.
Green defends opposing centers, but he does not play center on offense for sure.

I'm not against naming Green first team all NBA.
I'm also not against not having a Center on that team.
I am against calling Green a center.

It is not his size. Ben Wallace was the same size indeed, and he was a center. Green is not.

[Twinkie defense]

but typically you determine a player's position by what position he guards (not by whether on offense he plays in the post or on the perimeter)

Well, not me...
If Giannis play PG on offense, but defends forwards on the other end, I still call him the PG.
Switching on defense does not change your position.

There are 5 slots on the floor, and TYPICALLY you put 2 guards, 2 forwards and 1 center in those 5 slots.
But that you can always chose to do differently, and use an offense with no centers (or 2 centers if you wish), and that is what the Warriors do when they go small.
Green defends opposing centers, but he does not play center on offense for sure.

If Giannis is guarding forwards he's a forward - specifically, point forward. And he's not "switching" on defense, he's guarding his assigned man... I mean, if some team decides to put a guard on Bogut because he doesn't shoot, and Bogut guards the opposing team's big man, that doesn't mean Bogut is really a guard and he's switching to guard the other team's big, right? And how perfect is that, as the very first point forward was the Bucks' own Marques Johnson, back in the day.

TYPICALLY lineups were very regimented. Rather than getting hung up on whether Tim Duncan is a PF or a center, let's just call them what they are - point guards, wings, and bigs. Draymond is a big who splits time between playing center and playing power forward.