Re: Celtics, Bulls Engage In Jimmy Butler Trade Talks

Post #1 » by **RealGM Wiretap** » Sun Feb 19, 2017 7:09 pm

The possibility of the Boston Celtics trading for Jimmy Butler will loom over the trade deadline. According to Adrian Wojnarowski, the Celtics and Chicago Bulls have held talks.

"These teams have engaged on the potential of this trade," said Wojnarowski. "They have not gotten far down the road on it. There still needs to be some alignment within the Bulls' organization, from ownership to management that they want to make the decision to enter a full rebuild.

"These are two teams that have exactly what the other wants. Boston has been hoarding assets for years, for a couple of seasons, trying to get in a position to get a star player. The fact that the Celtics have a swap with Brooklyn this year that could potentially be a top-3 pick and they have Brooklyn's pick outright next year. Either of those picks, I don't think Chicago can get both of them, but that is the beginning point of a deal for the Bulls for Jimmy Butler."

The Celtics and Bulls also discussed a Butler trade at last year's draft.

Via Adrian Wojnarowski/The Vertical

DarthDiggler69 · Post #2 » by **DarthDiggler69** » Sun Feb 19, 2017 7:14 pm

Woj didnt say they engaged in new talks, he just rehashed and said it might start again

ProcessDoctor · Post #3 » by **ProcessDoctor** » Sun Feb 19, 2017 7:29 pm

Sounds like they have had very preliminary talks (based on Woj's actual quote).

That being said, if I'm Chicago, I think it's a good opportunity to rebuild. If you look at the rest of their roster, it's full of players < 25 y/o sans Wade/Rondo (past prime/misfit), Lopez, and Gibson (expiring). Basically, they are not in a position to contend within Butler's prime, and don't have the assets to do that. Trading him for this year's BKN pick and another prospect (i.e. Smart/Brown) would be a good move for them IMO.

Post #4 » by **Cactus Jack** » Sun Feb 19, 2017 7:33 pm

Nets pick + what?

jrob23 · Post #5 » by **jrob23** » Sun Feb 19, 2017 7:37 pm

typical WOJ with a click bait headline. There's always talks going on at all times during the season about all players with all teams. I can't see Danny trading Brown or BK17 and I'm sure CHI wants both so there won't be a deal. Why they'd go after yet another SF when they already have Crowder and Brown is beyond me unless he's panicking and feels the need to try and be more than pretenders right now.

ajones9219 · Post #6 » by **ajones9219** » Sun Feb 19, 2017 7:43 pm

jrob23 wrote:typical WOJ with a click bait headline. There's always talks going on at all times during the season about all players with all teams. I can't see Danny trading Brown or BK17 and I'm sure CHI wants both so there won't be a deal. Why they'd go after yet another SF when they already have Crowder and Brown is beyond me unless he's panicking and feels the need to try and be more than pretenders right now.

Butler would almost certainly start at the 2

Pukovnik · Post #7 » by **Pukovnik** » Sun Feb 19, 2017 7:45 pm

Danny Ainge is really not doing a good job with all these assets he has at his disposal. He got a huge gift fallen into his lap when Billy King and Mikhail Prokhorov wanted to try and win an instant championship so they gave up their picks, but its been three years since then and Ainge hasn't done anything with those picks. He wants guys like Butler and George without giving up those picks, he thinks Bulls and Pacers will accept Kelly Olynik and Cody Zeller for those superstars.

If Ainge is unable to make a deal, he should move on and give someone who knows what he is doing a chance. For example, BK17 pick and Jaylen Brown is almost fair deal for Butler, Celtics would need to give one more player and that would be fair. Butler is a superstar in this league, a terrific two way player who would make Celtics contenders. If Ainge chooses to keep BK17 pick, he will waste Al Horford's best years in Boston to wait for a young player to develop.

Post #8 » by **sully00** » Sun Feb 19, 2017 8:03 pm

Pukovnik wrote:Danny Ainge is really not doing a good job with all these assets he has at his disposal. He got a huge gift fallen into his lap when Billy King and Mikhail Prokhorov wanted to try and win an instant championship so they gave up their picks, but its been three years since then and Ainge hasn't done anything with those picks. He wants guys like Butler and George without giving up those picks, he thinks Bulls and Pacers will accept Kelly Olynik and Cody Zeller for those superstars.

If Ainge is unable to make a deal, he should move on and give someone who knows what he is doing a chance. For example, BK17 pick and Jaylen Brown is almost fair deal for Butler, Celtics would need to give one more player and that would be fair. Butler is a superstar in this league, a terrific two way player who would make Celtics contenders. If Ainge chooses to keep BK17 pick, he will waste Al Horford's best years in Boston to wait for a young player to develop.

Your kidding right? Ainge gets Crowder, IT, and Horford and has the #2 seed in the East and two of the 3 BRK picks are still in front of him. Waste Horford's best years? He has been on the team for 6 months.

Ainge doesn't have to do a damn thing. He has draft picks cap space and a team and a coach guys want to play for.

gammajamma · Post #9 » by **gammajamma** » Sun Feb 19, 2017 8:09 pm

Pukovnik wrote:its been three years since then and Ainge hasn't done anything with those picks.

I strongly disagree. Ainge has done a terrific job so far and is one of the best gms in the league. What would you have wanted Ainge to do with those picks? He has been patient with them and because of that he has be rewarded as the picks values have gotten stronger with the nets situation getting worse.While being patient and keeping the picks(which are his best assets), He has built a roster that is currently the 2nd best team in the east and thanks to the picks they can either A) get an impact player to add to the core to try and compete with Golden State and Cleveland. or B) keep the current core and be competitive while developing a second unit on the bench that is made up of top prospects who can take over when the current core starts to decline and hope that the development of the second core makes you serious contenders. In 2015 he tried to trade the 2017 brooklyn pick as part of a package to move up and grab Justice Winslow at number 9 but Mj said no(thank god he did).

SMTBSI · Post #10 » by **SMTBSI** » Sun Feb 19, 2017 8:10 pm

sully00 wrote:
Pukovnik wrote:Danny Ainge is really not doing a good job with all these assets he has at his disposal. He got a huge gift fallen into his lap when Billy King and Mikhail Prokhorov wanted to try and win an instant championship so they gave up their picks, but its been three years since then and Ainge hasn't done anything with those picks. He wants guys like Butler and George without giving up those picks, he thinks Bulls and Pacers will accept Kelly Olynik and Cody Zeller for those superstars.

If Ainge is unable to make a deal, he should move on and give someone who knows what he is doing a chance. For example, BK17 pick and Jaylen Brown is almost fair deal for Butler, Celtics would need to give one more player and that would be fair. Butler is a superstar in this league, a terrific two way player who would make Celtics contenders. If Ainge chooses to keep BK17 pick, he will waste Al Horford's best years in Boston to wait for a young player to develop.

Your kidding right? Ainge gets Crowder, IT, and Horford and has the #2 seed in the East and two of the 3 BRK picks are still in front of him. Waste Horford's best years? He has been on the team for 6 months.

Ainge doesn't have to do a damn thing. He has draft picks cap space and a team and a coach guys want to play for.

It's really amazing that our rebuild is going so poorly. I'm very grateful for all the concern of these fans of other teams warning us that it's all going to come crashing down soon if we don't change course.

Here I was in a good mood because we're already 2nd in the East with most of the Brooklyn assets still ahead of us. Now I see that I've been painfully naive.

BorkLazer · Post #11 » by **BorkLazer** » Sun Feb 19, 2017 8:25 pm

jrob23 wrote:typical WOJ with a click bait headline. There's always talks going on at all times during the season about all players with all teams. I can't see Danny trading Brown or BK17 and I'm sure CHI wants both so there won't be a deal. Why they'd go after yet another SF when they already have Crowder and Brown is beyond me unless he's panicking and feels the need to try and be more than pretenders right now.

I thought the whole point of running a team was to win a title, so why wouldn't he be trying to become 'more than a pretender'? Why would any team be content with so-called 'pretender' status? How do you interpret this as 'panic' move?

The_Hater · Post #12 » by **The_Hater** » Sun Feb 19, 2017 8:55 pm

jrob23 wrote:typical WOJ with a click bait headline. There's always talks going on at all times during the season about all players with all teams. I can't see Danny trading Brown or BK17 and I'm sure CHI wants both so there won't be a deal. Why they'd go after yet another SF when they already have Crowder and Brown is beyond me unless he's panicking and feels the need to try and be more than pretenders right now.

Probably because Butler is much, much better than either Crowder or Brown. Butler immediately becomes the best player on the Celtics.

Kinda weird for a Celtics fan to be objecting to his GM trying to improve the team.

Stratmaster · Post #13 » by **Stratmaster** » Sun Feb 19, 2017 9:07 pm

Duplicate

Stratmaster · Post #14 » by **Stratmaster** » Sun Feb 19, 2017 9:09 pm

In related news, the sun rose in the East this morning, and is expected to set in the West. In breaking news, water is wet.

"Somehwere, someday, Jimmy Butler may get traded, and if that happens, it may be to the celtics". Thanks for the insight.

Is this really the best you got Mr. Woj? "Fake news"

Pukovnik · Post #15 » by **Pukovnik** » Sun Feb 19, 2017 9:43 pm

People, do you actually think Crowder, Brown, even Thomas can bring a championship to Boston? Its the regular season, they are maybe second in the East, but are they actually better than Washington or Toronto? I won't even mention the Cavs. The Wizards and the Raptors are better, IMHO, Wizards have couple of superstars in Wall and Beal who are probably in the top three best backcourts in the game, they have young guys like Porter, Oubre, they have experience in Gortat who is also a good defender. The Raptors have proved themselves last season with ECF appearance and now with Ibaka they are even stronger.

Do you actually believe Isaiah Thomas will be the same player in the playoffs like he is in the regular season? Well, think again. Horford, as well, he is not a superstar. The Celtics have a good chemistry, a balanced team, but they lack a true go to guy, a superstar.

Ainge has been patient with the picks, good for him, but as of now, those picks haven't bring anything to the Celtics. The point I'm trying to make is, Ainge is overrated. Even in 2007 when he brought Ray Allen and Kevin Garnett....Kevin McHale, his good friend and back then a GM of the Wolves sent Garnett to the Celtics as a favor, as for Allen, the Sonics were in a rebuilt mode and the only thing they wanted to do was to get rid of Allen. And now with Brooklyn picks, no sane GM would ever make that deal, but the Nets did it because Prokhorov was impatient, he made that promise of a "championship within a 5 year window", now the Nets are suffering because of it.

I'm saying, and I'm no hater of the Celtics, I'm just saying I wouldn't be surprised at all if the Celts fail to win the first round.

Pukovnik · Post #16 » by **Pukovnik** » Sun Feb 19, 2017 9:45 pm

Stratmaster wrote:In related news, the sun rose in the East this morning, and is expected to set in the West. In breaking news, water is wet.

"Somehwere, someday, Jimmy Butler may get traded, and if that happens, it may be to the celtics". Thanks for the insight.

Is this really the best you got Mr. Woj? "Fake news"

That term "fake news".....how is this fake news? People really need to think with their own heads, do you even know what the fake news are?

Scott42444 · Post #17 » by **Scott42444** » Sun Feb 19, 2017 10:01 pm

So if the Bulls aren't able to get BOTH of the Brooklyn picks from Boston, what would be the point of the trade? You give up a Top 20 player, who is a great fit for a team ready to compete now AND has a few years of team control at a great price and the Bulls get a Top 3 draft pick and a couple guys from the Celtics (non-stars). If the Bulls hit a home run and get a stud...he becomes, what? A Top 15 or 20 player? That's a lateral move that puts all the risk on the Bulls. If both those picks aren't included, it makes ZERO sense. The point would be that the Celtics trade the POSSIBILITY of 2 All-Stars down the road for a sure fire all-star now about to enter his prime. Not a chance to maybe replace a guy with the same thing, but ONLY MAYBE.

KamikazeK · Post #18 » by **KamikazeK** » Sun Feb 19, 2017 10:07 pm

Scott42444 wrote:So if the Bulls aren't able to get BOTH of the Brooklyn picks from Boston, what would be the point of the trade? You give up a Top 20 player, who is a great fit for a team ready to compete now AND has a few years of team control at a great price and the Bulls get a Top 3 draft pick and a couple guys from the Celtics (non-stars). If the Bulls hit a home run and get a stud...he becomes, what? A Top 15 or 20 player? That's a lateral move that puts all the risk on the Bulls. If both those picks aren't included, it makes ZERO sense. The point would be that the Celtics trade the POSSIBILITY of 2 All-Stars down the road for a sure fire all-star now about to enter his prime. Not a chance to maybe replace a guy with the same thing, but ONLY MAYBE.

The difference is age. Your new rookie gives you plenty of time to build a team compared to Butler.

gammajamma · Post #19 » by **gammajamma** » Sun Feb 19, 2017 10:14 pm

Pukovnik wrote:The point I'm trying to make is, Ainge is overrated.

I'm not trying to be rude but I don't think you are doing a very good job of proving that. I guess I don't see what you have to support your claim to suggest that Ainge is overrated. Think of it this way, back in 2013 the night of the Brooklyn trade was made if I told you the celtics would be back in the top of the eastern conference in less than 4 years and Rajon rondo would be gone. You would call me crazy. Think of how many teams have spent the last decade stuck in the lottery trying to rebuild. Ainge has built a team that is not a title contender yet but a very damn good team that still has 2 lottery maybe top 5 picks coming its way AND capspace to bring in a max free agent. How many times in the history has a team made the playoffs and had a top pick in the upcoming draft? I can think of the 86 Celtics with Bias and the 03 Pistons with Darko. Ainge has the potential to do that 3 years in a row.

BillSimmonsESPN · Post #20 » by **BillSimmonsESPN** » Sun Feb 19, 2017 10:23 pm

Pukovnik wrote:
I'm saying, and I'm no hater of the Celtics, I'm just saying I wouldn't be surprised at all if the Celts fail to win the first round.

I would be. The current seven seed is Chicago, who, legitimately may implode tomorrow. Detroit is (currently) #8. If they keep up this pace, odds are they stay in two or jump to one with the loss of Kevin Love. I like them in 5 or fewer against both those teams.'
I too am one that loves a superstar, but I can see that the Celtics have a solid team. They are deep, they are skilled and they have an excellent coach. We focus on IT and Horford, but Bradley is having a career year, Smart is developing well and the role players are playing their roles. Trades aside, if all things stay even, I would be mindblown to see the Celts lose in the first round. The Pacers match up would be... hard, but who on the Pacers will stop Isaiah? Even then, with the way the East is trending, I can't imagine they find themselves against the Pacers. The one other team that could beat them in the first round may be Milwaukee, but I only say such things because I love Giannis.