NBA ChoK16 - the Rich Cho Thread

[BeesWax]

[tweet]https://twitter.com/rick_bonnell/status/581972407201697792[/tweet]
Frank Kaminsky it is!

Kaminsky confirmed.

Could be watching Johnson or Dekker as well.

[JDR720]

I would be fine if we get Johnson, i would flip out if we get Dekker he is mediocre at everything. like Nigel Hayes better

[BlackOutBuzz]

Is everyone just gonna pretend that Johnson wasn't the best prospect in that game?

[BeesWax]

I think Johnson is a we miss the playoffs and he slips while Dekker is a make the playoffs pick. Dekker will have a long career because he is smart and does everything at least decent. If his shot gets more consistent from 3 he could be a force. I like his game and he shows decent athletic ability.

[BeesWax]

Is everyone just gonna pretend that Johnson wasn't the best prospect in that game?

Best prospect but not best player.

[catch20two]

Cho got a hard-on for Kaminsky.

[Liver_Pooty]

Cho likes athletic players. Kaminsky is far from that. Anyone who says he is Cho's kind of guy is a fool.

[mrknowitall215]

I have a question that need to be answered by anyone that isn't harebrained...

What's stopping Cho from finding 2-3 players to supplant Kemba and make him a 3rd/4th option?

Since Kemba got drafted we've had over $20 million in cap space twice...

Since Kemba got drafted we've drafted 3 (or 4) players at a higher to equal draft position than him...

[yosemiteben]

I have a question that need to be answered by anyone that isn't harebrained...

Well who wouldn't want to engage with you when you frame it like that?

[mrknowitall215]

I have a question that need to be answered by anyone that isn't harebrained...

Well who wouldn't want to engage with you when you frame it like that?

If you're not capable of answering the question with any merit, then move on...

...because that's why I framed it like that

[mrknowitall215]

What's stopping Cho from finding 2-3 players to supplant Kemba and make him a 3rd/4th option?

Since Kemba got drafted we've had over $20 million in cap space twice...

Since Kemba got drafted we've drafted 3 (or 4) players at a higher to equal draft position than him...

[yosemiteben]

I have a question that need to be answered by anyone that isn't harebrained...

Well who wouldn't want to engage with you when you frame it like that?

If you're not capable of answering the question with any merit, then move on...

...because that's why I framed it like that

If you're not capable of having a good faith discussion without being overtly condescending, I can't imagine a lot of people will be interested in taking you up on your offer.

I would say Cho had pretty good bang for his buck in 2013-14.

[BeesWax]

I have a question that need to be answered by anyone that isn't harebrained...

Well who wouldn't want to engage with you when you frame it like that?

If you're not capable of answering the question with any merit, then move on...

...because that's why I framed it like that

I get it now. Your name is ironic like a 300 pound man being called Tiny.

I mean it is so easy to find HOF players because there are at least 7 in every draft. What an absolutely asinine question for anyone with a brain that asK. For you I guess maybe not so asinine.

[Hornet Mania]

What's stopping Cho from finding 2-3 players to supplant Kemba and make him a 3rd/4th option?

Since Kemba got drafted we've had over $20 million in cap space twice...

Since Kemba got drafted we've drafted 3 (or 4) players at a higher to equal draft position than him...

Kemba is pretty clearly the 2nd option when Al is around, or at least Cliff seems to prefer that, so that's 1/3. I don't necessarily think Al is a net positive, but if we're discussing strictly offense he counts. Cho also made as big a push to get Hayward, the Jazz just matched. If Al/Hayward were both on the roster I think Kemba would pretty clearly be our 3rd option today.

I think the reason we haven't drafted players that would have relegated Kemba to 3rd/4th in the offensive pecking order it that they mostly haven't been available. The one exception is the Beal/Lillard draft. No one knew Lillard was going to be that good, so it's a bit unfair to bring him up which leaves us with Beal. Beal would definitely be a better offensive player than Kemba, but we ended up going with MKG. In retrospect I'm 100% okay with that. Beal would be a far superior offensive player but we've all seen how our defense plummets when MKG is out, and I think MKG is a more valuable player overall. Beal also shares MKG's propensity for injuries, so it's not even like we profit from him hypothetically being available more often. Then we come to the Zeller draft, but in that case the universally accepted superior player was Noel who again is not a consistent offensive force. Mclemore was there too, but he sort of sucks on Sacto, very unlikely he would have usurped Kemba if he landed here. The Vonleh draft was meh for offensive players by the time we selected, maybe Saric would be a good one but we weren't going to wait two years to find out.

Trades are the one area I guess you could argue that Cho has not aggressively pursued a major offensive piece. I don't know of any major offensive players that have changed hands recently though aside from Dragic (would have been good, but the picks were too steep) and Love (we couldn't beat the Cavs offer anyway). Lesser players like Rondo/Knight/Thomas were moved but all those guys would be Kemba replacements, not move him to 3rd/4th option.

So all in all I think Cho has done what he could, the draft just hasn't been full of offensive anchors the past few years. It's not like he passed on a Harden/Westbrook/Love-caliber offensive player to go after MKG, Zeller or Vonleh. The Lance signing really bit us in the ass too. I think Cliff (and maybe Cho too, but reports have claimed Cliff and MJ were on board and Cho was against Lance, no way to know the real story) saw Lance as good 2nd option, or at worst co-second option with Kemba. Just didn't turn out that way at all. Honestly I think Cho is a decent GM he just got boned by the drafts we were selecting high. If we got 2nd/4th picks in the drafts OKC took part in while rebuilding and OKC got 2nd/4th/3rd picks in the last three drafts everyone would be talking about how Cho killed it and Presti sucks. The draft is all about luck, not only in projecting players but also which prospects happen to be entering the league at that moment.

[mrknowitall215]

Well who wouldn't want to engage with you when you frame it like that?

If you're not capable of answering the question with any merit, then move on...

...because that's why I framed it like that

If you're not capable of having a good faith discussion without being overtly condescending, I can't imagine a lot of people will be interested in taking you up on your offer.

I would say Cho had pretty good bang for his buck in 2013-14.

If you're not harebrained, and have a informative answer, you wouldn't be offended by the way I started the question. All of my back-and-forth converses on here are in good faith. It's the condescending ones that make having a logical debate far from worthwhile, and that's why I did that to get them out of the way from the gate. I see 'jdm3' must feel like he fit into that category. I was always told that "if a shot hit you then it sure wasn't meant to miss you"

[mrknowitall215]

I think the reason we haven't drafted players that would have relegated Kemba to 3rd/4th in the offensive pecking order it that they mostly haven't been available. The one exception is the Beal/Lillard draft. No one knew Lillard was going to be that good, so it's a bit unfair to bring him up which leaves us with Beal. Beal would definitely be a better offensive player than Kemba, but we ended up going with MKG. In retrospect I'm 100% okay with that. Beal would be a far superior offensive player but we've all seen how our defense plummets when MKG is out, and I think MKG is a more valuable player overall. Beal also shares MKG's propensity for injuries, so it's not even like we profit from him hypothetically being available more often. Then we come to the Zeller draft, but in that case the universally accepted superior player was Noel who again is not a consistent offensive force. Mclemore was there too, but he sort of sucks on Sacto, very unlikely he would have usurped Kemba if he landed here. The Vonleh draft was meh for offensive players by the time we selected, maybe Saric would be a good one but we weren't going to wait two years to find out.

Trades are the one area I guess you could argue that Cho has not aggressively pursued a major offensive piece. I don't know of any major offensive players that have changed hands recently though aside from Dragic (would have been good, but the picks were too steep) and Love (we couldn't beat the Cavs offer anyway). Lesser players like Rondo/Knight/Thomas were moved but all those guys would be Kemba replacements, not move him to 3rd/4th option.

So all in all I think Cho has done what he could, the draft just hasn't been full of offensive anchors the past few years. It's not like he passed on a Harden/Westbrook/Love-caliber offensive player to go after MKG, Zeller or Vonleh. The Lance signing really bit us in the ass too. I think Cliff (and maybe Cho too, but reports have claimed Cliff and MJ were on board and Cho was against Lance, no way to know the real story) saw Lance as good 2nd option, or at worst co-second option with Kemba. Just didn't turn out that way at all. Honestly I think Cho is a decent GM he just got boned by the drafts we were selecting high. If we got 2nd/4th picks in the drafts OKC took part in while rebuilding and OKC got 2nd/4th/3rd picks in the last three drafts everyone would be talking about how Cho killed it and Presti sucks. The draft is all about luck, not only in projecting players but also which prospects happen to be entering the league at that moment.

Thanks. So, in summary you're saying that the player(s) to supplant Kemba offensively and put him in his alleged rightful spot as a 3rd/4th option have not been available to us as of yet in 4 years. I would disagree with that notion in a sense, but I can respect that opinion because you mapped out your thoughts well and why that's your belief

[catch20two]

What's stopping Cho from finding 2-3 players to supplant Kemba and make him a 3rd/4th option?

Since Kemba got drafted we've had over $20 million in cap space twice...

Since Kemba got drafted we've drafted 3 (or 4) players at a higher to equal draft position than him...

Because Cho either don't have the x-ray eye for untapped talent or he's not risky enough to try which go hand in hand. Good question because the fingers are getting pointed all over the place but not at the right person which is Cho. If you don't like this team, well this is his masterpiece. Like basically everything in life this team is only gonna be as good as the sum of its parts. I never understand why Cho get such a pass. You don't like Clifford? Wasn't he a Cho hire? At least he was when it was convenient for people to say so when people thought Clifford was a genius last year including me.

[Hornet Mania]

I think the reason we haven't drafted players that would have relegated Kemba to 3rd/4th in the offensive pecking order it that they mostly haven't been available. The one exception is the Beal/Lillard draft. No one knew Lillard was going to be that good, so it's a bit unfair to bring him up which leaves us with Beal. Beal would definitely be a better offensive player than Kemba, but we ended up going with MKG. In retrospect I'm 100% okay with that. Beal would be a far superior offensive player but we've all seen how our defense plummets when MKG is out, and I think MKG is a more valuable player overall. Beal also shares MKG's propensity for injuries, so it's not even like we profit from him hypothetically being available more often. Then we come to the Zeller draft, but in that case the universally accepted superior player was Noel who again is not a consistent offensive force. Mclemore was there too, but he sort of sucks on Sacto, very unlikely he would have usurped Kemba if he landed here. The Vonleh draft was meh for offensive players by the time we selected, maybe Saric would be a good one but we weren't going to wait two years to find out.

Trades are the one area I guess you could argue that Cho has not aggressively pursued a major offensive piece. I don't know of any major offensive players that have changed hands recently though aside from Dragic (would have been good, but the picks were too steep) and Love (we couldn't beat the Cavs offer anyway). Lesser players like Rondo/Knight/Thomas were moved but all those guys would be Kemba replacements, not move him to 3rd/4th option.

So all in all I think Cho has done what he could, the draft just hasn't been full of offensive anchors the past few years. It's not like he passed on a Harden/Westbrook/Love-caliber offensive player to go after MKG, Zeller or Vonleh. The Lance signing really bit us in the ass too. I think Cliff (and maybe Cho too, but reports have claimed Cliff and MJ were on board and Cho was against Lance, no way to know the real story) saw Lance as good 2nd option, or at worst co-second option with Kemba. Just didn't turn out that way at all. Honestly I think Cho is a decent GM he just got boned by the drafts we were selecting high. If we got 2nd/4th picks in the drafts OKC took part in while rebuilding and OKC got 2nd/4th/3rd picks in the last three drafts everyone would be talking about how Cho killed it and Presti sucks. The draft is all about luck, not only in projecting players but also which prospects happen to be entering the league at that moment.

Thanks. So, in summary you're saying that the player(s) to supplant Kemba offensively and put him in his alleged rightful spot as a 3rd/4th option have not been available to us as of yet in 4 years. I would disagree with that notion in a sense, but I can respect that opinion because you mapped out your thoughts well and why that's your belief

I know if sounds lame, but yeah that's basically it. We're not a free agent destination and the last few drafts haven't been loaded with offensive difference-makers. I think to have avoided this situation we would have either needed better luck with players available in the draft classes during our super-awful period or to swing some sort of major trade. Pro sports are incredibly unfair sometimes. Browns have basically never had a good QB, the Colts go from Manning to Luck with only one down year between, just the way it goes. I think that's really the driving force behind the Hinkie strategy, just keep sucking until you get your Davis/Durant/Lebron because otherwise you're just spinning tires, and when you see a team like Charlotte that has risen from the cellar but STILL leans on Kemba as a 1st option at times it starts to make you wonder if he's right.

[Elden Payton]

If you're not capable of answering the question with any merit, then move on...

...because that's why I framed it like that

If you're not capable of having a good faith discussion without being overtly condescending, I can't imagine a lot of people will be interested in taking you up on your offer.

I would say Cho had pretty good bang for his buck in 2013-14.

If you're not harebrained, and have a informative answer, you wouldn't be offended by the way I started the question. All of my back-and-forth converses on here are in good faith. It's the condescending ones that make having a logical debate far from worthwhile, and that's why I did that to get them out of the way from the gate. I see 'jdm3' must feel like he fit into that category. I was always told that "if a shot hit you then it sure wasn't meant to miss you"

This whole post is "harebrained"

The only one being condescending is you.

[mrknowitall215]

If you're not capable of having a good faith discussion without being overtly condescending, I can't imagine a lot of people will be interested in taking you up on your offer.

I would say Cho had pretty good bang for his buck in 2013-14.

If you're not harebrained, and have a informative answer, you wouldn't be offended by the way I started the question. All of my back-and-forth converses on here are in good faith. It's the condescending ones that make having a logical debate far from worthwhile, and that's why I did that to get them out of the way from the gate. I see 'jdm3' must feel like he fit into that category. I was always told that "if a shot hit you then it sure wasn't meant to miss you"

This whole post is "harebrained"

The only one being condescending is you.

Shut up...