Nash's Legacy

[Doctor MJ]

The first MVP was deserved. Shaq made a big fuss about not getting it, but Steve Nash was a decent choice for MVP that year.

The second MVP was undeserved. That year both Kobe and Lebron put up spectacular numbers. Even though the Suns were the superior team, considering the lack of talent surrounding Kobe and Lebron at that time, one of them should have won the award.

I basically agree with this, but will note that Nash wins that 2nd MVP precisely because people couldn't decide who to vote for. Nobody got the majority. When the MVP gets decided like that it seems pretty silly for anyone to complain that their guy was the one jobbed by Nash.

[MikeM]

He made a lot of players and coaches rich men.

[Jose_Matador]

Wow...some of you guys are making it sound like this guys a glorified scrub. Nash is already better than Stockton in his prime. Rarely do you see a player progress his NBA career like a fine bottle of wine.

[basketball royalty]

Legacy of a perennial loser and the worst back to back MVP winner ever?

History will look back and laugh. Laugh at the fact Nash got those MVPs over much more superior/dominant players like Kobe and Shaq.

This.

20 years from now, when fans are looking through their NBA history books, they'll see the following:

1. Shaq - Most dominant big man of his era with 4 rings - 1 MVP
2. Kobe - Best guard of his era, 4(+) rings, 1 MVP
3. KG - Best defensive big man, 1(+) ring, 1 MVP
4. Wade - Most explosive guard of his era, 1 ring - 0 MVP
.
.
.
Nash - Solid offensive point guard, couple All-Star appearances, 0 Finals appearances, & 2MVPS!?!????

Fans are going to be like, WTF??? LOL.

I suspect those MVPs will be viewed with a suspicious eye for a looooong time to come.

Pretty sure they will look back and marvel that he was able to do what he could so well that he won 2 MVPs over other greats like Shaq and Kobe. You also forgot TD on your list as best PF of all time with 4 championships and 2 (or 3) MVPs. He probably goes at the no.1 slot.

[Jase]

A freakishly ugly, P.C. clown that had zero commitment to defense and thus spent his career as a perennial loser despite playing with multiple All-Star teammates.

what a hater you are.. get your head outta your ass and appreciate what we are witnessing. Steve Nash has transcended the game of basketball in so many ways that we will be considered one of the all time the greats at his position.

No other Canadian will EVER be as good as him. He basically CREATED a brand new style of basketball (that is able to go deep into the playoffs). The 7 seconds or less is all Nash, not D`antoni. And this style is currently winning playoff basketball games.

If you ask me when the next time we see another a PG like Nash come along.. I`m going to have to say, not in a very very long time.

No joke. RealGM is great at exploiting people who shouldn't have kids.

[Jimmy76]

Nash will probably be looked at as a HOF point that never made it over the hump

probably something along the lines of a better stockton

[BarneyGumble]

All you "better than Stockton" people are truly sad. Not only did Stockton acheive greater team success, for over a longer period of time, and remained more durable....his stats are superior in his prime to Nash's in any year of Nash's career. You do realize the guy averaged 17.5 points and 14.5 assists one year in an era where the three point shot and pace were different from Nash's era, dont you?

Thats not to mention the 7 straight seasons of 1000 assists or more, 2 gold medals, the countless other records he holds (all-time assists and steals), and the fact that the man played some of the nastiest defense for a guy his size in history....

I guess 2 MVPs trump all of that? I love me some Nash....but he wouldnt even be worthy to hold Stockton's jock strap.

[Doctor MJ]

All you "better than Stockton" people are truly sad. Not only did Stockton acheive greater team success, for over a longer period of time, and remained more durable....his stats are superior in his prime to Nash's in any year of Nash's career. You do realize the guy averaged 17.5 points and 14.5 assists one year in an era where the three point shot and pace were different from Nash's era, dont you?

Thats not to mention the 7 straight seasons of 1000 assists or more, 2 gold medals, the countless other records he holds (all-time assists and steals), and the fact that the man played some of the nastiest defense for a guy his size in history....

I guess 2 MVPs trump all of that? I love me some Nash....but he wouldnt even be worthy to hold Stockton's jock strap.

Well, one thing, fair or not, Nash is a much bigger star than Stockton. Nash is his team's star, Stockton was the sidekick. So just speaking to his legacy, from a general populace perspective, that matters.

To just dip into the discussion between the two:

-Stockton getting further in the playoffs doesn't really matter unless you give him a lot more credit than a #2 guy normally gets. I don't think this makes sense because much of the support for Stockton comes from his huge stats in the late 80s and early 90s when he and Malone actually got pretty comparable respect, but the bulk of the team success came later when Stockton's production fell, Malone's primacy increased, and Malone was winning MVPs and Stockton wasn't getting any such attention.

-Stockton's longevity is become less and less of a big deal in this debate. Stockton played at All-NBA level for 11 years. Nash has been doing it for 9. Hard to see that being a huge factor for Stockton any more.

-Stockton's assist stats are very strongly inflated. This doesn't really say anything bad about him, it's just that you can't use his stats as huge factor in comparisons with great passers who put up 10+ assists per game themselves.

-Last there's the matter that Nash's run of supersuccessful offenses is a lot more impressive than Stockton's, and Nash was a much bigger threat to score lots of points as needed than Stockton.

[sp6r=underrated]

The first MVP was deserved. Shaq made a big fuss about not getting it, but Steve Nash was a decent choice for MVP that year.

The second MVP was undeserved. That year both Kobe and Lebron put up spectacular numbers. Even though the Suns were the superior team, considering the lack of talent surrounding Kobe and Lebron at that time, one of them should have won the award.

I basically agree with this, but will note that Nash wins that 2nd MVP precisely because people couldn't decide who to vote for. Nobody got the majority. When the MVP gets decided like that it seems pretty silly for anyone to complain that their guy was the one jobbed by Nash.

2006 as you said was a year of no consensus. You had two prominent players injured or on going nowhere teams, and you had four great season besides Nash (Dirk, Kobe, Lebron, Wade). It was a very strange year. I don't think it is at all clear that Lebron or Kobe were better. If you look at PS, with Nash's performance I don't know why people get outraged about it.

I also always say people should look up vote totals for the MVP award. Nash actually got slightly more votes in 2007 than in 2006.

[Bucksfans1and2]

So Nash will never make the NBA finals....does that fall on him?

He has been one of the greatest guards of his generation, but how much is his legacy affected by the fact that he never had any significant post season success?

Do you factor in the fact that he has had incredibly bad luck in the playoffs (injuries 03' in WCF, Joe Johnson injury in 05' in WCF, conspiracy in 07', TD's shot in 08'). Or do you bring him down a notch down to the level of players like Pete Maravich?

hes a pg that plays no d...

Just like Magic and Stockton so what is your point?

You are aware Stockton's steals record might never be broken right? He wasn't a lock down defender by any stretch but he wasn't awful.

[JellosJigglin]

Nash will probably be looked at as a HOF point that never made it over the hump

probably something along the lines of a better stockton

Lmao a better stockton? No. Stockton was a hard-nosed defender. Nash only plays 50% of the court. He's not even half a stockton at this point.

[Jimmy76]

Nash will probably be looked at as a HOF point that never made it over the hump

probably something along the lines of a better stockton

Lmao a better stockton? No. Stockton was a hard-nosed defender. Nash only plays 50% of the court. He's not even half a stockton at this point.

stockton was second to malone

amare is second to nash

thats the difference

[Sabas11]

Just like Magic and Stockton so what is your point?

You are aware Stockton's steals record might never be broken right? He wasn't a lock down defender by any stretch but he wasn't awful.

I am aware of the record, thank you. Just as you are aware that getting steals does not necessarily equal being a good defender. People see the steals numbers and automatically think Stockton was a great defender, which he wasnt. He was average and benifited greatly from lax rules in terms of handchecking during his playing days.
I would still take him over Nash on defense without hesitation though.

[stevieg987]

His legacy will be that of a champion.

[Kerrsed]

OP is a Troll.

[ahonui06]

Wow...some of you guys are making it sound like this guys a glorified scrub. Nash is already better than Stockton in his prime. Rarely do you see a player progress his NBA career like a fine bottle of wine.

Did you really just say Steve Nash is better than prime John Stockton? You do realize Stockton is the all-time leader in assists and steals and that Stockton could play defense, right?

[Raps in 4]

One of the GOAT point guards, anyone hating doesn't watch basketball. If he loses, he'll be losing the the stacked Lakers, just like he lost to he stacked Spurs and Mavs in past years. The team is nothing without him, which is the greatest testament to his greatness.

[Mr. Natural]

Steve Nash's MVPs were not deserved?

At the very LEAST, the 2005 award should not be in question. Who should it have gone to?

Kobe bryant, who missed the playoffs completely? No.
Tim Duncan, who only played 66 games? No.
Lebron James, who missed the playoffs completely? No.
Shaquille O'neal, who played fewer games and won fewer games in a weaker conference? Close, but no cigar.

Get real.

The first MVP was deserved. Shaq made a big fuss about not getting it, but Steve Nash was a decent choice for MVP that year.

The second MVP was undeserved. That year both Kobe and Lebron put up spectacular numbers. Even though the Suns were the superior team, considering the lack of talent surrounding Kobe and Lebron at that time, one of them should have won the award.

If I remember correctly, everyone complained that Nash didn't deserve the first MVP because he wasn't even the best player on his team. The next year, Amare was injured yet the Suns continued to dominate with Nash playing and had a horrible record the games Nash missed. Therefore, he proved that he was truly the MVP.

[Silver Bullet]

Wow...some of you guys are making it sound like this guys a glorified scrub. Nash is already better than Stockton in his prime. Rarely do you see a player progress his NBA career like a fine bottle of wine.

Did you really just say Steve Nash is better than prime John Stockton? You do realize Stockton is the all-time leader in assists and steals and that Stockton could play defense, right?

Anybody who thinks Stockton is anywhere near Nash needs to get his head examined.

[OzzyAZ]

inb4 tsherkin