I think I figured out y Lebron's teams never quite made it..

Darain · Post #61 » by **Darain** » Mon Feb 14, 2011 11:05 pm

I remember a similar topic during the 9-8

tmac101 · Post #62 » by **tmac101** » Mon Feb 14, 2011 11:07 pm

CjayC wrote:I agree.

Often times I just sit and watch LeBron at the top of the key holding the ball wondering WTF is going on. I know there has to be more creative ways to use him than that. Holding the ball forever until he decides to either drive it himself or pass it off. He's a great passer, but he needs to make quicker decisions.

+1

Honestly. Its annoying. When Mo Wlliams went to cavs and Lebron started to play off the ball a bit more you could see the team had better ball movement and transition because Bron wasnt dominating the ball the entire time.

If Bron is supposed to be this "Point Forward" i don't understand why he doesn't immediately push the ball up the floor much like Turk, or Odom who play on offensive transition teams.

Post #63 » by **TheOUTLAW** » Mon Feb 14, 2011 11:10 pm

I think it would work fine if the Heat had someone that could play the post effectively.

JimMurray · Post #64 » by **JimMurray** » Mon Feb 14, 2011 11:14 pm

Starkiller wrote:
some_rand wrote:Lebron clearly just doesnt make his teammates better, he should let wade or chalmers handle the ball more.

Yes he does, let's not go that far.

Because Wade, Bosh and Mike Miller are clearly better than they were last year.....oh wait.

ptown08 · Post #65 » by **ptown08** » Mon Feb 14, 2011 11:15 pm

boozy wrote:i mean, lets be real though, besides wade and bosh, he really doesnt have much else on that team. mike miller is probably the 4th best player on that team, and hes been kinda out of it so far. the team he took to the finals was worse though, so well just have to wait and see.

yeah, he's playing with a bunch of scrubs.

Post #66 » by **TheOUTLAW** » Mon Feb 14, 2011 11:15 pm

I'm not sure if they're playing better, but I know that Wade and Bosh are winning alot more

JimMurray · Post #67 » by **JimMurray** » Mon Feb 14, 2011 11:19 pm

High0ctane21 wrote:Did you forget the green font? 99% of "star" players would be THRILLED to have "just Wade and Bosh". If you wanna look at it that way, beside Pippen and Rodman, Jordan didn't really have anything. Besides Shaq, Kobe didn't really have anything. When you take the gamble and go all in on 3 near max contract guys, you expect to have a crappy supporting cast. If this becomes the common theme if/when Lebron doesn't win a ring, I will view this forum as a pure joke. Do we need Lebron to play with 5 all-stars before we can put the blame on him?

So true. It was Shaq, Kobe, and a collection of role players. Maybe in 99-00 when they had Glen Rice did they have at least the equivalent of a dependable outside shooter. Other than that, they had to make due with Derek Fisher, Robert Horry, Rick Fox, Devean George, Slava Medvedenko, B Shaw, Travis Knight....and Mark Madsen.

How is that any different from the group Miami has right now?

wadesbandaid3 · Post #68 » by **wadesbandaid3** » Mon Feb 14, 2011 11:20 pm

TheOUTLAW wrote:I'm not sure if they're playing better, but I know that Wade and Bosh are winning alot more

yes, but thats because of the collective team talent. this thread is questioning the reasons that the heat offense doesnt function well against good defensive teams.

JimMurray · Post #69 » by **JimMurray** » Mon Feb 14, 2011 11:22 pm

ShowtimeFan wrote:
some_rand wrote:Lebron clearly just doesnt make his teammates better

LOL, yeah, that is why Clevland lost 26 in a row without him and had the best record in the NBA with him...

Players on Lebrons Cavs that are not on the 26 loss team:

Shaq, Z, Varajeo, West...and a system everyone was familiar with, at least to the extent that they actually knew the playbook.

Let's not freak out and say, LEBRON COULD LEAD THE 26 LOSS CAVS TO THE TOP SEED.

No.....he couldn't.

Benedict_Boozer · Post #70 » by **Benedict_Boozer** » Mon Feb 14, 2011 11:29 pm

Lebron does do the 1-4 P&R too much late in tight games. It is his comfort zone and a bread and butter staple of the Mike Brown offense. Coach will have to take him off the ball and force him to post up to change it, cause if he has the ball in his hands Lebron will P&R every time late in the game. Especially against BOS.

Wade is not free from blame here though, he has played 3 atrocious games now against BOS. He has had injury issues, is off the ball more, etc. but from a production standpoint he has not shown up in any of the games. If he even has an average game MIA probably wins all 3. He really needs to be dominating his match-up with Ray Allen.

wadesbandaid3 · Post #71 » by **wadesbandaid3** » Mon Feb 14, 2011 11:32 pm

Benedict_Boozer wrote:Lebron does do the 1-4 P&R too much late in tight games. It is his comfort zone and a bread and butter staple of the Mike Brown offense. Coach will have to take him off the ball and force him to post up to change it, cause if he has the ball in his hands Lebron will P&R every time late in the game. Especially against BOS.

Wade is not free from blame here though, he has played 3 atrocious games now against BOS. He has had injury issues, is off the ball more, etc. but from a production standpoint he has not shown up in any of the games. If he even has an average game MIA probably wins all 3. He really needs to be dominating his match-up with Ray Allen.

vey true, but against boston Lebron almost exclusively goes 1-4 which throws wade off. but wade needs to adjust and remember how to shoot the jumper.

SmallBallPlsDie · Post #72 » by **SmallBallPlsDie** » Tue Feb 15, 2011 12:37 am

People bringing up Cavs losing streak and worst record are way too easy to shut down. Cavs last year had a much better record than Miami this year at this point of the season. So I guess you think Mo Williams and Jamison>>>>Wade and Bosh?

/argument

now back to the Lebron offense and people saying he needs to make his move quicker. I think that a huge part of him making his move late is to ensure he gets the assist. Call me a hater, whatever, I think he loves stats.

Like somebody's sig said: Lebron figured out how to stat-pad, Kobe figured out how to win, Jordan figured out how to stat pad and win.

3ballbomber · Post #73 » by **3ballbomber** » Tue Feb 15, 2011 12:40 am

wadesbandaid3 wrote:Lebron's failing is his ball dominance.

that's it in a nut shell.

Harry_Seaward · Post #74 » by **Harry_Seaward** » Tue Feb 15, 2011 12:41 am

It's truly less about this season but more about down the road the next 5 years or so this team could be scary.

They need a competent big and a PG not having that is what will hold this team back, not LeBron.

osamu · Post #75 » by **osamu** » Tue Feb 15, 2011 12:51 am

Op is right there is no need for Lebron to play this way on the heat, it didn't work on the Cavs. Wade is not the same player anymore either. His midrange jumper is gone, and he was so reluctant to make a play yesterday. I think Wade needs to feel like its his team so he could be more productive. The offense should run through wade and bosh. Lebron should pick his spots, because he's that good.

Darain · Post #76 » by **Darain** » Tue Feb 15, 2011 12:56 am

JimMurray wrote:
ShowtimeFan wrote:
some_rand wrote:Lebron clearly just doesnt make his teammates better

LOL, yeah, that is why Clevland lost 26 in a row without him and had the best record in the NBA with him...

Players on Lebrons Cavs that are not on the 26 loss team:

Shaq, Z, Varajeo, West...and a system everyone was familiar with, at least to the extent that they actually knew the playbook.

Let's not freak out and say, LEBRON COULD LEAD THE 26 LOSS CAVS TO THE TOP SEED.

No.....he couldn't.

Yes he could...Well maybe not the top seed but 4-5th at the least

The only thing the Cavs need is Lebron

SUN · Post #77 » by **SUN** » Tue Feb 15, 2011 1:04 am

boozy wrote:i mean, lets be real though, besides wade and bosh, he really doesnt have much else on that team. mike miller is probably the 4th best player on that team, and hes been kinda out of it so far. the team he took to the finals was worse though, so well just have to wait and see.

VicG · Post #78 » by **VicG** » Tue Feb 15, 2011 1:08 am

OP, did you watch Wade yesterday? He was atrocious. His decision making was just terrible in the half court. LeBron was probably the only guy Spoelstra trusted to run their sets.

That said, maybe the reason the Heat's offence didn't look that effective is because Boston is damn good. Both games in Boston have been pretty close and this one was one missed FT away from possibly going to OT.

I think you're overreacting a bit.

wang000hk · Post #79 » by **wang000hk** » Tue Feb 15, 2011 2:50 am

boozy wrote:who is the 4th option? eddie house? juwan howard? eric dampier maybe, but he hasnt done anything.

You dont need a good 4th option when you have Wade and Bosh as your teammates.
Miller will be that 4 th option if you want.

OneTime86 · Post #80 » by **OneTime86** » Tue Feb 15, 2011 3:06 am

boozy wrote:i mean, lets be real though, besides wade and bosh, he really doesnt have much else on that team. mike miller is probably the 4th best player on that team, and hes been kinda out of it so far. the team he took to the finals was worse though, so well just have to wait and see.

Oh wow. He has a top 2 player at his position in Wade and a top 5 player at his position in Bosh. You don't need superstars at every position to win. When you have talent like the Heat do, role players fill in needs just fine.