First 2 weeks of season likely cancelled...

[SacKingZZZ]

They hire accountants to ensure they pay less taxes!!!! hahahaha, that was classic, thanks, I needed that one!

[EarlTheGoat]

This **** is gettin on my nerves already.

Just play **** basketball and shut up.-

[The_Ghost_of_JB]

With no meetings scheduled and a Monday deadline it is all but etched in stone the first two weeks will be cancelled. Stern is not going to be bent over like he was in 98/99 and the players do not seem like they are going to budge.

Most people are barely getting by and we have millionaires fighting with billionaires. Having no NBA season will put common people out of work and will kill so many local business were people go before and after the games. I am an NBA fan but I am just disgusted at this point at the greed.

[PPAW4Life]

Again my biggest problem with the Owners is they have not been negotiating in good faith from the start.

They made all the demands and most of them were outrageously one-sided.

And now they are going to give it all up just to get this 50-50 split?

I call bull.

The BRI split is really the only thing the Owners wanted in the first place.

They never really cared about small market teams having the same chance to be competitive for the championship.

Owners just want what they said they wanted in the first place.

"Guaranteed profits"

How many of these Owners do people think actually depend on their NBA teams for a living?

[tiderulz]

Again my biggest problem with the Owners is they have not been negotiating in good faith from the start.

They made all the demands and most of them were outrageously one-sided.

And now they are going to give it all up just to get this 50-50 split?

I call bull.

The BRI split is really the only thing the Owners wanted in the first place.

They never really cared about small market teams having the same chance to be competitive for the championship.

Owners just want what they said they wanted in the first place.

"Guaranteed profits"

How many of these Owners do people think actually depend on their NBA teams for a living?

but the players want guaranteed money too yes? so an owner has to risk losing money, but the player gets guaranteed money.

and some players and agents dont want to negotiate in good faith. They want to decertify, but they will still act like a union, just as the NFLPA did.

[PPAW4Life]

With no meetings scheduled and a Monday deadline it is all but etched in stone the first two weeks will be cancelled. Stern is not going to be bent over like he was in 98/99 and the players do not seem like they are going to budge.

Most people are barely getting by and we have millionaires fighting with billionaires. Having no NBA season will put common people out of work and will kill so many local business were people go before and after the games. I am an NBA fan but I am just disgusted at this point at the greed.

Do you think the Owners care about the "common people?"

They don't even care about their own players.

Players are the reason the Owners even get money to begin with.

It's the Owners job to find better deals on operating costs.

Do you really need your players to fly on the best private jets? Stay at the best hotels?

There are far less employees for the NBA teams compared to other sports the upkeep isn't outrageously hard.

If boneheaded execs don't sign players to stupid contracts they would be more flexible and able to get in better players to help their franchise win more and thus increasing profits.

The players are already sacrificing way too much for bringing the NBA back to heights it hasn't seen since the Jordan Era.

Owners are delusional if they think they can make the same amount of profits as the NFL.

[PPAW4Life]

Again my biggest problem with the Owners is they have not been negotiating in good faith from the start.

They made all the demands and most of them were outrageously one-sided.

And now they are going to give it all up just to get this 50-50 split?

I call bull.

The BRI split is really the only thing the Owners wanted in the first place.

They never really cared about small market teams having the same chance to be competitive for the championship.

Owners just want what they said they wanted in the first place.

"Guaranteed profits"

How many of these Owners do people think actually depend on their NBA teams for a living?

but the players want guaranteed money too yes? so an owner has to risk losing money, but the player gets guaranteed money.

and some players and agents dont want to negotiate in good faith. They want to decertify, but they will still act like a union, just as the NFLPA did.

Guaranteed contracts are apart of every sport.

And yes the owner has to risk losing money because that's what being an Owner entails.

[tiderulz]

Again my biggest problem with the Owners is they have not been negotiating in good faith from the start.

They made all the demands and most of them were outrageously one-sided.

And now they are going to give it all up just to get this 50-50 split?

I call bull.

The BRI split is really the only thing the Owners wanted in the first place.

They never really cared about small market teams having the same chance to be competitive for the championship.

Owners just want what they said they wanted in the first place.

"Guaranteed profits"

How many of these Owners do people think actually depend on their NBA teams for a living?

but the players want guaranteed money too yes? so an owner has to risk losing money, but the player gets guaranteed money.

and some players and agents dont want to negotiate in good faith. They want to decertify, but they will still act like a union, just as the NFLPA did.

Guaranteed contracts are apart of every sport.

And yes the owner has to risk losing money because that's what being an Owner entails.

sooo, the owner takes a risk of losing money, the player takes no risk at all, and the player should get more than a 50/50 split. yeah, if i was an owner, i wouldnt allow that either.

Oh, and guaranteed contracts are NOT a part of every sport.

[ShabazzMuhammad]

soft ... they could cancel the whole season for all I care. I just hope the NBA will pay some kind of dividend to the players, not all of them are greedy condescending douchebags.

KG's knees could use a year off anyways.

[PPAW4Life]

sooo, the owner takes a risk of losing money, the player takes no risk at all, and the player should get more than a 50/50 split. yeah, if i was an owner, i wouldnt allow that either.

Oh, and guaranteed contracts are NOT a part of every sport.

Yes that's how the real world works.

You are a business owner.

There's no god damn guarantee you will make a profit.

You hire employees who work for you and they make a salary.

It's completely different.

The players make a salary that is guaranteed because it's in the contract.

This isn't hard to understand.

And if you can't hack it...don't be an Owner.

Buy an NFL team instead.

And yes EVERY sport.

[sfernald]

Why do the owners deserve 50%? I'm not watching the Knicks to see Jim Dolan stroke the mid range and dunk basketballs.

Not that I am on the owner side but your logic is completely insistent with every commodity we have in our society. Do you watch a movie because Will Smith in it or do you really care about the screenwriter who wrote his lines? Yet as the highest paid actor someone like Will Smith is only offered way less than 50% of the actual grossed of a film. The point being, NBA games is a product, that product is being delivered to you with a lot of helps from a lot of people. Granted players have the most direct impact to your ultimate enjoyment, much like Men In Black was awesome 'cause Will Smith was in it, but they alone does not encompass the entire ecosystem that creates the overall product.

I love posts like this. Great analogy.

[PPAW4Life]

Why do the owners deserve 50%? I'm not watching the Knicks to see Jim Dolan stroke the mid range and dunk basketballs.

Not that I am on the owner side but your logic is completely insistent with every commodity we have in our society. Do you watch a movie because Will Smith in it or do you really care about the screenwriter who wrote his lines? Yet as the highest paid actor someone like Will Smith is only offered way less than 50% of the actual grossed of a film. The point being, NBA games is a product, that product is being delivered to you with a lot of helps from a lot of people. Granted players have the most direct impact to your ultimate enjoyment, much like Men In Black was awesome 'cause Will Smith was in it, but they alone does not encompass the entire ecosystem that creates the overall product.

I love posts like this. Great analogy.

That's all great...but people still mainly pay to watch Will Smith movies because of Will Smith.

Other people play a hand in making the movie and delivering it but they also get paid accordingly.

[LLcoleJ]

That's all great...but people still mainly pay to watch Will Smith movies because of Will Smith.

true

Other people play a hand in making the movie and delivering it but they also get paid accordingly.

Jsut like Will Smith get's paid accordingly. It's the movie studios that front the 100 million dollar projects in hopes of making an good ROI and paying Will his money.

Now, guys like Will Smith have some options here.

He could use his own money to budget and produce the film, while using his name to get his investment back. That certainly could work, but it's risky.

Or he could ask for a % of the movies profit to get paid.

Neither of these options are realistic for the players in the NBA.

[erudite23]

LOL @ how stupid some people in this thread are.


The sense of entitlement that has come along with these spoiled ass players is out of this world. Basically the only argument that could possibly hold any water for the players is that the owners are not doing a good enough job of keeping operating costs down. Since none of us has one **** clue whether that is true or not, its not really worth arguing.

Other than that, its a joke that the players expect the league to lose money just because....well, that what we've already been doing!! That makes it fair!!

[SteveSeas]

The Will Smith & film analogy doesn't really work.

Will Smith and his fellow actors would need to earn 50% of the whole film industry's revenue...not just from one singular flick.

Also, Will Smith could choose to make 4 or 5 movies a year and bank maybe 80-100 million per film maybe more.

NBA players are paid a "fixed"/"guaranteed" yearly salary with possible bumps or kickers if they win some awards or what not, but they can't change teams and earn another yearly salary from another team if they so choose.

[tiderulz]

sooo, the owner takes a risk of losing money, the player takes no risk at all, and the player should get more than a 50/50 split. yeah, if i was an owner, i wouldnt allow that either.

Oh, and guaranteed contracts are NOT a part of every sport.

Yes that's how the real world works.

You are a business owner.

There's no god damn guarantee you will make a profit.

You hire employees who work for you and they make a salary.

It's completely different.

The players make a salary that is guaranteed because it's in the contract.

This isn't hard to understand.

And if you can't hack it...don't be an Owner.

Buy an NFL team instead.

And yes EVERY sport.

normal employees dont take part of profit, they take a salary alone, with possible bonuses depending on the industry. And Football does not have guaranteed contracts.

[erudite23]

sooo, the owner takes a risk of losing money, the player takes no risk at all, and the player should get more than a 50/50 split. yeah, if i was an owner, i wouldnt allow that either.

Oh, and guaranteed contracts are NOT a part of every sport.

Yes that's how the real world works.

You are a business owner.

There's no god damn guarantee you will make a profit.

You hire employees who work for you and they make a salary.

It's completely different.

The players make a salary that is guaranteed because it's in the contract.

This isn't hard to understand.

And if you can't hack it...don't be an Owner.

Buy an NFL team instead.

And yes EVERY sport.

You don't know a damn thing about business or the sports world. In the business world, "Cash Is King." If you have it, you have the power, because in general it is the single biggest commodity there is. The NBA owners have fronted the cash to make this whole house of cards stable, but somehow they don't deserve to profit from their investment? Excuse me?

The reality here is that there are only a few teams that are profitable, and it's ONLY because of the market in which they operate. Take 09-10, for example, where the Knicks--a 29 win team--were easily the most profitable team in the league despite being a train wreck for most of the season. Meanwhile SA--which everyone uses as the model for a successfully run franchise--was one of the best teams in the league and ended up LOSING money.

That's the system that has been created. Much of it can be addressed by increased revenue sharing. Sure. That will make it so that teams like the Bobcats or Nets aren't losing $30-$40m. But a team like SA, which is roughly in the middle of the pack for revenue generated, will likely not benefit much--if at all--from revenue sharing, meaning even WITH that in place, a highly successful team with tons of momentum built from recent dominance, that is run with cohesion and stability, that rarely makes a bad personnel decision (and when they do it is very minor) IS GOING TO LOSE MONEY in the current system, and would likely do so--or at best break even--even where there a better revenue sharing system in place.

That is not fair. You can get up on your soap box and cry about where things have been and how the players have moved X amount or Z amount, but the reality is that we have built a system in which your ability to make a profit is almost entirely dependent upon the market in which you operate. Why? Because players are taking all of the profits that the league is generating over and above their operating expenses.


People wonder why there are so many "pro-owner" posters around. Well, let me tell you: there aren't. There are a bunch of thoughtful, rational, critical thinking human beings who are capable of looking at the current way of doing things and deducing that it is not fair. But more importantly, ITS NOT GOOD FOR THE LEAGUE. That's ALL I care about. I'm sick of hearing about my team considering bad basketball moves in order to achieve financial relief. I'm sick of wading through a ridiculous swamp of non-basketball stuff any time a potential transaction is being discussed. I want my team, and other teams like it, to be able to get ahead based solely on their ability to build a winning team, and not have to be concerned with the depth of our pockets. And once we get there, I don't want to have to worry about our best player jumping ship because he can find a way to circumvent the cap and team up with another star in a bigger market.

In other words, as a fan, I want all the OTHER stuff to GO. THE. ****. AWAY. so I can concentrate on getting good players who play well together and watching them compete against other teams.


Its not too much to ask, imo. That's what the NFL has, and it is THE reason why its blown by the other leagues on its way to becoming the most lucrative sports league in the world.


As a fan, you can't honestly tell me you don't want that. And regardless of who will profit the most, its the player's agenda that is getting in the way of me getting that. So f*** the owners and f*** the players. I want to what's best for me.

And if the owners get what they want, it will serve MY purpose more. And that's who deserves to win. Us. The fans.

Sorry to interrupt your vicarious lives.

[The Rebel]

Yes that's how the real world works.

You are a business owner.

There's no god damn guarantee you will make a profit.

You hire employees who work for you and they make a salary.

It's completely different.

The players make a salary that is guaranteed because it's in the contract.

This isn't hard to understand.

And if you can't hack it...don't be an Owner.

Buy an NFL team instead.

And yes EVERY sport.

You don't know a damn thing about business or the sports world. In the business world, "Cash Is King." If you have it, you have the power, because in general it is the single biggest commodity there is. The NBA owners have fronted the cash to make this whole house of cards stable, but somehow they don't deserve to profit from their investment? Excuse me?

The reality here is that there are only a few teams that are profitable, and it's ONLY because of the market in which they operate. Take 09-10, for example, where the Knicks--a 29 win team--were easily the most profitable team in the league despite being a train wreck for most of the season. Meanwhile SA--which everyone uses as the model for a successfully run franchise--was one of the best teams in the league and ended up LOSING money.

That's the system that has been created. Much of it can be addressed by increased revenue sharing. Sure. That will make it so that teams like the Bobcats or Nets aren't losing $30-$40m. But a team like SA, which is roughly in the middle of the pack for revenue generated, will likely not benefit much--if at all--from revenue sharing, meaning even WITH that in place, a highly successful team with tons of momentum built from recent dominance, that is run with cohesion and stability, that rarely makes a bad personnel decision (and when they do it is very minor) IS GOING TO LOSE MONEY in the current system, and would likely do so--or at best break even--even where there a better revenue sharing system in place.

That is not fair. You can get up on your soap box and cry about where things have been and how the players have moved X amount or Z amount, but the reality is that we have built a system in which your ability to make a profit is almost entirely dependent upon the market in which you operate. Why? Because players are taking all of the profits that the league is generating over and above their operating expenses.


People wonder why there are so many "pro-owner" posters around. Well, let me tell you: there aren't. There are a bunch of thoughtful, rational, critical thinking human beings who are capable of looking at the current way of doing things and deducing that it is not fair. But more importantly, ITS NOT GOOD FOR THE LEAGUE. That's ALL I care about. I'm sick of hearing about my team considering bad basketball moves in order to achieve financial relief. I'm sick of wading through a ridiculous swamp of non-basketball stuff any time a potential transaction is being discussed. I want my team, and other teams like it, to be able to get ahead based solely on their ability to build a winning team, and not have to be concerned with the depth of our pockets. And once we get there, I don't want to have to worry about our best player jumping ship because he can find a way to circumvent the cap and team up with another star in a bigger market.

In other words, as a fan, I want all the OTHER stuff to GO. THE. ****. AWAY. so I can concentrate on getting good players who play well together and watching them compete against other teams.


Its not too much to ask, imo. That's what the NFL has, and it is THE reason why its blown by the other leagues on its way to becoming the most lucrative sports league in the world.


As a fan, you can't honestly tell me you don't want that. And regardless of who will profit the most, its the player's agenda that is getting in the way of me getting that. So f*** the owners and f*** the players. I want to what's best for me.

And if the owners get what they want, it will serve MY purpose more. And that's who deserves to win. Us. The fans.

Sorry to interrupt your vicarious lives.

Well said, and I agree.

[Wizenheimer]

You don't know a damn thing about business or the sports world. In the business world, "Cash Is King." If you have it, you have the power, because in general it is the single biggest commodity there is. The NBA owners have fronted the cash to make this whole house of cards stable, but somehow they don't deserve to profit from their investment? Excuse me?

The reality here is that there are only a few teams that are profitable, and it's ONLY because of the market in which they operate. Take 09-10, for example, where the Knicks--a 29 win team--were easily the most profitable team in the league despite being a train wreck for most of the season. Meanwhile SA--which everyone uses as the model for a successfully run franchise--was one of the best teams in the league and ended up LOSING money.

That's the system that has been created. Much of it can be addressed by increased revenue sharing. Sure. That will make it so that teams like the Bobcats or Nets aren't losing $30-$40m. But a team like SA, which is roughly in the middle of the pack for revenue generated, will likely not benefit much--if at all--from revenue sharing, meaning even WITH that in place, a highly successful team with tons of momentum built from recent dominance, that is run with cohesion and stability, that rarely makes a bad personnel decision (and when they do it is very minor) IS GOING TO LOSE MONEY in the current system, and would likely do so--or at best break even--even where there a better revenue sharing system in place.

That is not fair. You can get up on your soap box and cry about where things have been and how the players have moved X amount or Z amount, but the reality is that we have built a system in which your ability to make a profit is almost entirely dependent upon the market in which you operate. Why? Because players are taking all of the profits that the league is generating over and above their operating expenses.


People wonder why there are so many "pro-owner" posters around. Well, let me tell you: there aren't. There are a bunch of thoughtful, rational, critical thinking human beings who are capable of looking at the current way of doing things and deducing that it is not fair. But more importantly, ITS NOT GOOD FOR THE LEAGUE. That's ALL I care about. I'm sick of hearing about my team considering bad basketball moves in order to achieve financial relief. I'm sick of wading through a ridiculous swamp of non-basketball stuff any time a potential transaction is being discussed. I want my team, and other teams like it, to be able to get ahead based solely on their ability to build a winning team, and not have to be concerned with the depth of our pockets. And once we get there, I don't want to have to worry about our best player jumping ship because he can find a way to circumvent the cap and team up with another star in a bigger market.

In other words, as a fan, I want all the OTHER stuff to GO. THE. ****. AWAY. so I can concentrate on getting good players who play well together and watching them compete against other teams.


Its not too much to ask, imo. That's what the NFL has, and it is THE reason why its blown by the other leagues on its way to becoming the most lucrative sports league in the world.


As a fan, you can't honestly tell me you don't want that. And regardless of who will profit the most, its the player's agenda that is getting in the way of me getting that. So f*** the owners and f*** the players. I want to what's best for me.

And if the owners get what they want, it will serve MY purpose more. And that's who deserves to win. Us. The fans.

Sorry to interrupt your vicarious lives.

now that's a rant to be proud of

[WeAreVenom]

Some good news?

Stole this from ProSportsDaily:

Originally Posted by blackknicks4601 View Post
hey guys just heard stephen a smith and jared jefferies from the New York Knicks on 1050 espn radio with ryan ruccio..both have stated that their will be a full NBA season ...jefferies spoke to mutilple contacts last night says deal is very close and it would be foolish to not be agreed upon before Monday jefferies also stated that they expect meeting friday of low level commitees with a full committee on sunday to finalize deal...stay tuned....