Bobcats or Pistons -Who has the brighter future

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Who has the brighter Future

Bobcats
37
24%
Pistons
117
76%
 
Total votes: 154

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Re: Bobcats or Pistons -Who has the brighter future 

Post#121 » by Johnlac1 » Fri Apr 13, 2012 5:24 pm

shangrila wrote:
Johnlac1 wrote:I'm not a fan of either team, but after seeing both play a fair amount of times through League Pass, at this juncture, the Pistons are obviously more talented. But they're also better coached. With a better coach, the Bobcats might have won about five more games. Watching the Bobcat's stagnant offense is offensive. The Bobcats do have a lot of very young players with promise. Henderson, Mullens, and Walker all average double figures or close to it. Some of their other players are young and not without potential. Biyombo is only 19, but has had some impressive (though rare) outings. So let's say they either don't get Davis or their no. 1 refuses to play next year. The Bobcats have to go with the same players they have this year. How many games do they win? About 20-25. That's assuming that all their young players improve a minimal amount from now until next season which is in the realm of possibility. (I'm also assuming they get a better coach) With Davis, they might win 30-35 games. So how about the year after that with the present crew? Again without acquiring a top talent, they'll be mired near the bottom for an indefinite period of time. The Pistons have more talent and are a little better coached. Getting Davis and having a frontline with Davis and Monroe might be enough to get the Pistons in the playoffs. They'd still need another top flight player to contend for the title.

The Bobcats have a stagnant offence because their team sucks, not because of the coaching. Walker is the same low efficiency scorer he was in college, Biyombo blocks and rebounds and usually does little else, Henderson is a role player on a good team, Mullens isn't even ON a good team, etc, etc.

Blaming their record on coaching is a cop out. They suck. Everyone who thinks otherwise needs to take a real long look at that roster.

Do the Bobcats have a lot of good players? Obviously not. But they do have a lot of young players with potential. These same players have had some excellent games against decent teams. Recently Mullens had 31 pts 14 rbd game against the Bucks. Before that he had a few 20 and 10 games. After getting let go by the Thunder, quite a few "experts" said Mullens was worse than Scalabrini. He'd never do anything not even for a bad team. Now is Mullens a good player? No he isn't. He's still a poor defensive player but he is getting to be a decent rebounder and can score points. He's also blocked five shots in one game. But he, like the other Bobcat players are getting better. Will these young Bobcats become star players? Maybe not, but they're improving. And Silas is not a good coach. If they get Davis or even K-Gilchrist and a new coach, in two or three years they could be respectable. We shall see.
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Re: Bobcats or Pistons -Who has the brighter future 

Post#122 » by mrblunt » Fri Apr 13, 2012 5:29 pm

LOL I can't tell if these Bobcat fans in this thread are homers, trolls, or delusional.
One Guy did say Bismack was the next Dwight and posted a youtube highlight vid as evidence? The other guy thinks he's going to form a contender with Andre Drummond, Quincy Miller, and Shabazz Muahammed. I love the Bobcat's fans passion for their team though.
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Re: Bobcats or Pistons -Who has the brighter future 

Post#123 » by Navas » Fri Apr 13, 2012 5:29 pm

For some reason, I doubt Davis would help the Bobcats if they drafted him. Bobcats are probably the worst sports team I've ever seen live.
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Re: Bobcats or Pistons -Who has the brighter future 

Post#124 » by RTM » Fri Apr 13, 2012 5:30 pm

I think it's hilarious that the Poll for who has a better future is at 24% Bobcats and 76% Pistons when you consider there's a 25% the Bobcats get Anthony Davis and a 75% chance they don't.
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Re: Bobcats or Pistons -Who has the brighter future 

Post#125 » by RTM » Fri Apr 13, 2012 5:32 pm

doc.end wrote:
bstein14 wrote:Joe Dumars has proven he can build a winner.

I agree Darko was pretty good for Timberwolves. The Answer is great.


People forget we're 4 years removed from 8 ECFs. That was not in spite of Joe D. Darko was a miss just about every GM would have made, and everything from trading Chauncey to signing BG/CV was completely horrible. But since then, Joe's quietly done a good job, I think.
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Bobcats or Pistons -Who has the brighter future 

Post#126 » by ComboGuardCity » Fri Apr 13, 2012 5:33 pm

KembaWalker wrote:
ComboGuardCity wrote:
doc.end wrote:[quote="Mikez1919"]
:lol: Dude Dwight was far better than Bismack as a rookie and for all we know Bismack is 23 years old. They're not even comparable. Bismack isn't even a good defender, he just blocks shots.

Potentially sig worthy.

what's sig worthy is saying one of the worst teams in NBA history has a bright future. When was the last time a team as bad as the cats was good within 5 years.


So you're basically admitting you only made this thread to troll? Or because you are really that insecure about your team that you need the validation of the RealGM general board. Or all of the above? lmao so pitiful[/quote]
oh the op is not supposed to have an opinion. I see. Notice my OP is unbiased. Grasping for straws with your ad homiem arguments.
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Re: Bobcats or Pistons -Who has the brighter future 

Post#127 » by Stun704 » Fri Apr 13, 2012 5:33 pm

RTM wrote:I think it's hilarious that the Poll for who has a better future is at 24% Bobcats and 76% Pistons when you consider there's a 25% the Bobcats get Anthony Davis and a 75% chance they don't.

law of averages, bobcats have greater then 25% chance to get the #1 pick if the draft hasn't been rigged in the past. only 2 teams have won the lottery in the past 10 years with theworst record. seeing as how it should be at-least 4 teams with the worst record to win, its about time for that to happen again.

Also most people are voting with the mindset OMFGWTF BOBCATS have WORST FUTUREBBQ
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Re: Bobcats or Pistons -Who has the brighter future 

Post#128 » by JasonStern » Fri Apr 13, 2012 5:37 pm

I voted bobcats. detroit definitely has the talent advantage as of right now, but rich cho is a solid gm. so long as jordan lets him do his job, I have confidence the bobcats will be decent in a few seasons. meanwhile, joe dumars hasn't done anything positive in half a decade.

both team's ability to draft is irrelevant. ignoring that morrison happened before jordan became a full owner and before cho was hired, dumars was responsible for the darko pick.
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Re: Bobcats or Pistons -Who has the brighter future 

Post#129 » by Stun704 » Fri Apr 13, 2012 5:39 pm

JasonStern wrote:I voted bobcats. detroit definitely has the talent advantage as of right now, but rich cho is a solid gm. so long as jordan lets him do his job, I have confidence the bobcats will be decent in a few seasons. meanwhile, joe dumars hasn't done anything positive in half a decade.

both team's ability to draft is irrelevant. ignoring that morrison happened before jordan became a full owner and before cho was hired, dumars was responsible for the darko pick.

thank you +1
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Re: Bobcats or Pistons -Who has the brighter future 

Post#130 » by MrBigShot » Fri Apr 13, 2012 5:47 pm

Well, first of all, to the guy who said "Ha...if after next years draft your teams best player is Greg Monroe, a 16 and 8 guy, at best..."

I invite you to reply to me and try to explain how someone who is averaging 16/10/2 is a 16/8 -at best- player? When you say, "at best" you had better be talking about a players peak. If you think someone who started off struggling to even score in double digits as of last year, and has now become a beast(18/11/3 per 36, by the way) in the midst of a lockout season where he received no help from the team during the summer, your sadly mistaken.

Eventually Greg Monroe will be a 20/10 guy, you can count on it. His minutes/FGA will eventually go up, as he starts to improve even more. He's only taking 12 shots per game. For comparison, Kemba Walker also takes about 12 shots per game.

We've seen some flashes from Brandon Knight, but I really have no idea how much he will improve. Gerald Henderson and Byron Mullens are good rotation players, but not starters on a championship team imo. Bismack Biyombo has a lot of potential, but he has a lot of work to do to get there. Rodney Stuckey had a very long stretch of 20/5/5 after the all star break. This is probably as good as he can be, now he just needs to sustain it over a full season.

So, in closing...Pistons currently, and it doesn't even become a discussion unless Bobcats draft Anthony Davis.

P.S. To the dude that said "Earl Monroe", Bismack has Dwight Potential and Kemba Walker>Stuckey...please don't bother replying to this.
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Re: Bobcats or Pistons -Who has the brighter future 

Post#131 » by spectre_ » Fri Apr 13, 2012 5:54 pm

:rofl: at all these people arguing whose **** stinks the worst.

I guess I can at least hang my hat on it not being a Bobcats' fan who was so insecure as to start this debacle.
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Re: Bobcats or Pistons -Who has the brighter future 

Post#132 » by Eoghan » Fri Apr 13, 2012 5:57 pm

doc.end wrote:I love how for vast majority of RealGM posters future means the very next season.

THANK YOU. I read this whole crapfest of a thread waiting for someone to see the most salient flaw in the OP and what do you know, a Bobcats' fan got it. :bowdown:

The OP is incredibly vague, as future can mean anywhere from tomorrow to the year 3030 and beyond.

So, with that being said:

Immediate future (1-2 seasons): Pistons. This is obvious thanks to Monroe, Knight, and a roster of veterans and a FO committed to winning.

Distant future (3-5 seasons): Bobcats. By year 3 the answer will be much more transparent. The Bobcats will have 2-3 years of high potential, solid draft picks under their belt and good complementary FAs if Cho is as good as his rep. Detroit, barring they don't throw in the towel after a bad start next year, will be the quintessential treadmill team most likely.

I'm not gonna get into any statistics wankery or say any team's players are better than others b/c let's face it, it's horribly subjective anyway so don't bother.
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Re: Bobcats or Pistons -Who has the brighter future 

Post#133 » by Stun704 » Fri Apr 13, 2012 6:01 pm

MrBigShot wrote:Well, first of all, to the guy who said "Ha...if after next years draft your teams best player is Greg Monroe, a 16 and 8 guy, at best..."

I invite you to reply to me and try to explain how someone who is averaging 16/10/2 is a 16/8 -at best- player? When you say, "at best" you had better be talking about a players peak. If you think someone who started off struggling to even score in double digits as of last year, and has now become a beast(18/11/3 per 36, by the way) in the midst of a lockout season where he received no help from the team during the summer, your sadly mistaken.

Eventually Greg Monroe will be a 20/10 guy, you can count on it. His minutes/FGA will eventually go up, as he starts to improve even more. He's only taking 12 shots per game. For comparison, Kemba Walker also takes about 12 shots per game.

We've seen some flashes from Brandon Knight, but I really have no idea how much he will improve. Gerald Henderson and Byron Mullens are good rotation players, but not starters on a championship team imo. Bismack Biyombo has a lot of potential, but he has a lot of work to do to get there. Rodney Stuckey had a very long stretch of 20/5/5 after the all star break. This is probably as good as he can be, now he just needs to sustain it over a full season.

So, in closing...Pistons currently, and it doesn't even become a discussion unless Bobcats draft Anthony Davis.

P.S. To the dude that said "Earl Monroe", Bismack has Dwight Potential and Kemba Walker>Stuckey...please don't bother replying to this.

Monroe = AL Jefferson 2.0

Yeah knight has shown flashes, but Kemba has had a triple double as a rookie :roll:
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Re: Bobcats or Pistons -Who has the brighter future 

Post#134 » by RTM » Fri Apr 13, 2012 6:01 pm

BrotherDave wrote:Immediate future (1-2 seasons): Pistons. This is obvious thanks to Monroe, Knight, and a roster of veterans and a FO committed to winning.

Distant future (3-5 seasons): Bobcats. By year 3 the answer will be much more transparent. The Bobcats will have 2-3 years of high potential, solid draft picks under their belt and good complementary FAs if Cho is as good as his rep. Detroit, barring they don't throw in the towel after a bad start next year, will be the quintessential treadmill team most likely.


This is equally subjective and incredibly vague as well. If you want to make the argument that the future is uncertain and can't be determined right now, you can't turn around and do just that by saying the Cats are on the right path and the Pistons are doomed for mediocrity at best.
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Re: Bobcats or Pistons -Who has the brighter future 

Post#135 » by MrBigShot » Fri Apr 13, 2012 6:05 pm

RTM wrote:
BrotherDave wrote:Immediate future (1-2 seasons): Pistons. This is obvious thanks to Monroe, Knight, and a roster of veterans and a FO committed to winning.

Distant future (3-5 seasons): Bobcats. By year 3 the answer will be much more transparent. The Bobcats will have 2-3 years of high potential, solid draft picks under their belt and good complementary FAs if Cho is as good as his rep. Detroit, barring they don't throw in the towel after a bad start next year, will be the quintessential treadmill team most likely.


This is equally subjective and incredibly vague as well. If you want to make the argument that the future is uncertain and can't be determined right now, you can't turn around and do just that by saying the Cats are on the right path and the Pistons are doomed for mediocrity at best.


Yeah...unless he/anyone else happens to know which players will declare for the draft during what year, and what lottery pick positions the bobcats/pistons will have over the next few years, which nobody does.
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Re: Bobcats or Pistons -Who has the brighter future 

Post#136 » by thesack12 » Fri Apr 13, 2012 6:06 pm

As a Pistons' fan, I find this debate to be pretty unproductive. Of course both teams' fan bases have the tendency to over-rate their own players, back their squad, and get defensive when others say bad things about their team.

Besides, we are talking about two bad teams here. Neither of which has much true promise. Both of these teams are quite a ways from becoming legit contenders, especially seeing as they are both in the Eastern Conference. Is either fan base really going to get giddy about making the playoffs only to get throttled in the 1st round by Miami or Chicago? Both teams have a lot of work to do to even achieve that.
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Re: Bobcats or Pistons -Who has the brighter future 

Post#137 » by daschysta » Fri Apr 13, 2012 6:06 pm

Stun704 wrote:
MrBigShot wrote:Well, first of all, to the guy who said "Ha...if after next years draft your teams best player is Greg Monroe, a 16 and 8 guy, at best..."

I invite you to reply to me and try to explain how someone who is averaging 16/10/2 is a 16/8 -at best- player? When you say, "at best" you had better be talking about a players peak. If you think someone who started off struggling to even score in double digits as of last year, and has now become a beast(18/11/3 per 36, by the way) in the midst of a lockout season where he received no help from the team during the summer, your sadly mistaken.

Eventually Greg Monroe will be a 20/10 guy, you can count on it. His minutes/FGA will eventually go up, as he starts to improve even more. He's only taking 12 shots per game. For comparison, Kemba Walker also takes about 12 shots per game.

We've seen some flashes from Brandon Knight, but I really have no idea how much he will improve. Gerald Henderson and Byron Mullens are good rotation players, but not starters on a championship team imo. Bismack Biyombo has a lot of potential, but he has a lot of work to do to get there. Rodney Stuckey had a very long stretch of 20/5/5 after the all star break. This is probably as good as he can be, now he just needs to sustain it over a full season.

So, in closing...Pistons currently, and it doesn't even become a discussion unless Bobcats draft Anthony Davis.

P.S. To the dude that said "Earl Monroe", Bismack has Dwight Potential and Kemba Walker>Stuckey...please don't bother replying to this.

Monroe = AL Jefferson 2.0

Yeah knight has shown flashes, but Kemba has had a triple double as a rookie :roll:



Monroe passes the ball far better as a 21 year old than Jefferson ever has in his career, plus he's not a sieve defensively like Al-Jeff, not good, but average, Jeff is a bad defender. If Al-Jeff was a good passer and passable defender he'd be near elite, he has one of the best post games in the NBA, a better passing/defending Al-Jeff isn't an insult at all.
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Re: Bobcats or Pistons -Who has the brighter future 

Post#138 » by Jmonty580 » Fri Apr 13, 2012 6:17 pm

All depends on who these teams get. The right player could make it all click for either side.

Walker is waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay more talented then people in this thread give him credit for. he's adjusting and you give him another year or 2 and he's going to really show his promise. Expect him to be working out HARD this summer to improve his game.

Biyombo has potential, obviously isnt the player Monroe is right now.

Knight has alot of potential, still has alot of work to do on his game though obviously.

Gerald henderson is often overlooekd. This kid is just getting better and better, no reason for that to stop.

Other than those 5 players there is nothing else to really talk about. Adding Davis, MKG, Drummond, these guys can make a huge difference to the way things work on these teams. I dont think either team becomes a playoff team next year but there is no reason to believe they cant start improving internally with player growth and still keep collecting talent being mid to late lottery teams until they can make the playoffs.
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Re: Bobcats or Pistons -Who has the brighter future 

Post#139 » by sfballa13 » Fri Apr 13, 2012 6:18 pm

I used to root for the Bobcats back when they had crash and okafor

but this thread and some of their fans are ridic

Monroe = Al Jefferson 2.0?

Maybe in your dreams


Monroe is top 4 in PER for Centers in the league in his SOPHOMORE YEAR

Knight is starting against legit competition and leading our team to victories

Kemba cant even get playing time over Henderson and meanwhile Henderson is leading his team to a league worse record

What guard do you have on your team signed to a reasonable 3 year deal (8.5 a year) that puts up numbers like Stuckey? That's what I thought

Dumars has made stupid moves but all of our bad contracts (tay,cv-who will be amnestied anyways, bg) will all expire when it comes time to resign Monroe and Knight and Stuckey.

Your team has made some terribly bone headed moves in the front office thanks to Jordan and his team

Now with Cho hopefully you guys fix the problems

But to come on here and say Kemba+Biyombo+Henderson+Mullens >>>>>> Monroe + Knight +Stuckey is stupid and ignorant.

Your team can NOT beat any team. They are fighting to avoid the worse win-lose percentage in NBA league history. Meanwhile Knight as a rookie, Monroe as a soph, and Stuckey are a few games out of the 8th seed while your team is the bottom of the league.

Sorry thanks for playing come again
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Re: Bobcats or Pistons -Who has the brighter future 

Post#140 » by Johnlac1 » Fri Apr 13, 2012 6:20 pm

mrblunt wrote:LOL I can't tell if these Bobcat fans in this thread are homers, trolls, or delusional.
One Guy did say Bismack was the next Dwight and posted a youtube highlight vid as evidence? The other guy thinks he's going to form a contender with Andre Drummond, Quincy Miller, and Shabazz Muahammed. I love the Bobcat's fans passion for their team though.

For one thing, I'm not a Bobcats fans, I'm a Bucks fan. Number two, I never said I thought the Bobcats would definitely be a contender. They're going to have add one or two extra good players and the present players are going to have to improve. It's true, currently they're an awful team. But a lot of their players are very young. Biyombo is only 19 and would only be a freshman if in college. But I'd have very happy if he'd played for my Badgers this year. We would have won the big Ten and gone further in the tournament. I remember when Olajuwon was a raw freshman for the Cougars. I had some friends who thought they were experts declare he'd never amount to anything. Guess what happened? Now, I'm not saying Biyombo wil ever come near Olajuwon, but he does have a lot potential and appears to have a great work ethic. Once again, time will tell.

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