Are we witnessing Rondo's prime?

[CKRT]

What is with all these crazy stats. ORTG? wtf is that. What happened to the days where you would watch someone on the court and know they were bad m'fer. Now you got all these nerdy pocket protecting kids trying to push PER, win shares, and ORTG(still don't know what that is and don't want to know) down your throat. I don't need some stupid stat to tell me Rondo is playing out of his mind right now and is just going to get better and better.

Yeah! Lets rely on our faulty eye tests and biased minds to provide all the knowledge we need! Your kind of thinking is thankfully being weeded out. No need to keep being ignorant of what's actually happening on the court. I love the implication that the "stat geeks" don't watch games either. It's brilliant, really.


By the way, all those "nerdy pocket protecting kids" that came up with these statistics work in all the top NBA franchises.

[Dragic13]

What is with all these crazy stats. ORTG? wtf is that. What happened to the days where you would watch someone on the court and know they were bad m'fer. Now you got all these nerdy pocket protecting kids trying to push PER, win shares, and ORTG(still don't know what that is and don't want to know) down your throat. I don't need some stupid stat to tell me Rondo is playing out of his mind right now and is just going to get better and better.

Yeah! Lets rely on our faulty eye tests and biased minds to provide all the knowledge we need! Your kind of thinking is thankfully being weeded out. No need to keep being ignorant of what's actually happening on the court. I love the implication that the "stat geeks" don't watch games either. It's brilliant, really.


By the way, all those "nerdy pocket protecting kids" that came up with these statistics work in all the top NBA franchises.

I heard the best Scouting is done by people who only watch 1 game of each prospect and then make wild guesses without using stats.

[GratefulDead]

he will need to develop a consistent shot if he wants to enter his prime.

[kingkirk]

he will need to develop a consistent shot if he wants to enter his prime.

If he wants to go down as one of the great point guards of all time, then he does, but even now, without a dead eye jumper, he is a top 5 point guard in the game.

20 assists yesterday.

You don't see that much these days.

[CKRT]

he will need to develop a consistent shot if he wants to enter his prime.

If he wants to go down as one of the great point guards of all time, then he does, but even now, without a dead eye jumper, he is a top 5 point guard in the game.

20 assists yesterday.

You don't see that much these days.

You also don't see many guys getting assists for passing the ball to a guy who takes 4 dribbles and then scores.

[misterrunon]

he's the 2nd best PG, and i don't see him getting past CP3 if his shot/free throws are so bad, plus he is averaging only 10.9 PPG on his career. the only other point guard who i think is considered elite with low PPG average is kidd.

[EntropyPR]

What is with all these crazy stats. ORTG? wtf is that. What happened to the days where you would watch someone on the court and know they were bad m'fer. Now you got all these nerdy pocket protecting kids trying to push PER, win shares, and ORTG(still don't know what that is and don't want to know) down your throat. I don't need some stupid stat to tell me Rondo is playing out of his mind right now and is just going to get better and better.

This. Only time I care about stats its when it comes to Fantasy, other than that? Who really gives a flying ****.

[MrHidden]

he will need to develop a consistent shot if he wants to enter his prime.

If he wants to go down as one of the great point guards of all time, then he does, but even now, without a dead eye jumper, he is a top 5 point guard in the game.

20 assists yesterday.

You don't see that much these days.

You also don't see many guys getting assists for passing the ball to a guy who takes 4 dribbles and then scores.

+1
scorekeeper in boston is meh

[Fred Williamson]

since he's 26, 27yo? I'd say say so

Jason Kidd actually played defense

implying Rondo doesn't play defense? not sure if serious.

[bledredwine]

Players typically peak at age 27... Rondo's 26, so he might be even a bit better next year.

But yes, basically this is his prime. The prime of human genetics really. Ages 26-28.


I'm 27. I'm in my prime

[Andre3822]

He's one of the few players in the league that actually amazes me. Don't even care that he's a Celtic. He's amazing.

2008 nobody knew who he was. Then he played a fantastic game in the closeout game against LA. Next year KG goes out and he's arguably the best player.

Next year after that, he's almost definitely the best player. In 2011 he does it again, but gets injured in the 2nd round. 2012 he's the best player again.

Now he's upped his game even more.

He's to PG's what Lebron is to forwards. He scores, makes the plays, rebounds, and can guard 1-3. Wtf? And he's an a--hole. Which is what you want from your PG. One of the most competitive guys in the league.

Can't say enough good things.

This just makes me clap, great post!

[tsherkin]

20 assists yesterday.

You don't see that much these days.

From a PC Board thread, thought this would be of interest:

When you look at this video of today's game, you can begin to see why people are skeptical of Rondo's raw assist numbers:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=pl ... ViRGSJZFcE

Now, only one of them is really a badly (a few are questionable, but everyone gets questionable assists) credited assist (1:11 is a joke to get an assist on), and he did have some nice passes in there (the alley-oops are quite good), but it's hardly like Rondo created 20 good looks for his teammates. A lot of these are passes to contested jump-shooters where Rondo hardly did anything at all. A few more are very simple pick and pop plays, and a couple more are simple post-entry passes where KG had to make a move afterwards. And then there are the good alley oops on pick and rolls and a few good passes where he shows good court vision to make a pass other people might not have seen. But people see "20 assists" and think that it means something it doesn't, and I think there's good reason to be skeptical of raw assist numbers in general.


EDIT: For comparison, this is a 17 assist game Steve Nash had last year. He's more active in creating the shots and the looks created tend to be better (lots of layups near the rim):

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UpXLUm2wakI


Now obviously randomly picking two high assist games isn't necessarily a representative sample, but when you hear people question Rondo's value or praise say, Nash's, even as a playmaker, this kind of stuff is what they're talking about, even beyond the whole shooting thing.

[FingerRoll]

If you are unhappy with the NBA's definition of an assist you should write them a letter asking them to conform it more towards Nash's style of passing. I would also urge you to sign it "RealGM global mod" - they like when basketball experts like you write to them regarding potential rule changes.

[mr_sunshine]

he will need to develop a consistent shot if he wants to enter his prime.

If he wants to go down as one of the great point guards of all time, then he does, but even now, without a dead eye jumper, he is a top 5 point guard in the game.

20 assists yesterday.

You don't see that much these days.

You also don't see many guys getting assists for passing the ball to a guy who takes 4 dribbles and then scores.

I know bro! Nash's assists were so amazing! He dribbled around forever and threw lobs to Amare and The Matrix or kicked out to dead eye 3 point shooters for easy assists. Like I mean the Celtics personnel, offensively, are clearly on a level with the guys Nash played with!

[semi-sentient]

I'd say that he's in his prime based on age and years in the league. It's good to see that he's back to scoring efficiently because that's the one thing that kept him at the bottom of my top 5 PG's list.

He's still not better than CP3 or Nash. Both guys are way, WAY more efficient as scorers and do a better job of creating easy shots than does Rondo. He's probably surpassed Deron at this point though who hasn't been the same since he left the Jazz, and Parker thus far is having a pretty off year.

So in short, he's finally a top 3 PG in the league.

[GreenBloodedC]

Man, I never imagined that assists would even be questioned. And if some assists were badly given, it's not like it's a special treatment on Rondo. It applies to everyone in the league, it's unlike the superstar fouls.

[tsherkin]

Man, I never imagined that assists would even be questioned. And if some assists were badly given, it's not like it's a special treatment on Rondo. It applies to everyone in the league, it's unlike the superstar fouls.

I think that questioning the definition of an assist in the NBA is not at all Rondo-specific, but a remark on how looking at raw assist totals and APG averages represent really thin, lazy and uninformative analysis of a performance or a player. More than anything for Rondo himself, it's his comparative lack of involvement in plays rthat comes up. He does a lot of waiting for a polished set offense to create a shot, more so than do his peers.

Between that and the fact that he's a vastly inferior scoring threat, it does much to level the playing field.

[smith2373]

I'd say that he's in his prime based on age and years in the league. It's good to see that he's back to scoring efficiently because that's the one thing that kept him at the bottom of my top 5 PG's list.

He's still not better than CP3 or Nash. Both guys are way, WAY more efficient as scorers and do a better job of creating easy shots than does Rondo. He's probably surpassed Deron at this point though who hasn't been the same since he left the Jazz, and Parker thus far is having a pretty off year.

So in short, he's finally a top 3 PG in the league.

Yeah Nash isn't better than Deron, Rondo, Rose, Westbrook or even Parker.

[smith2373]

Baiting

[GeneralNbaFan]

To be honest, there are 2 versions of Rondo...

Regular season Rondo is a top 15 player

Playoffs Rondo is a top 5-10 player