Race to the MVP pt. II

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TheGarden
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Re: Race to the MVP pt. II 

Post#341 » by TheGarden » Fri Dec 14, 2012 5:49 am

EscapoTHB wrote:How is Jason Kidd not the met valuable player on the knicks? I mean disregarding stats he seems to bevthe guy who has changed how they play the most.

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mainly because the things Kidd has done are more like being worthy coach of the year than MVP. Kidd has changed the culture but remember since last year when Woodson's taken over Carmelo has been on another level, then to the Olympics, then the start of the season

Kidd is vital, very important but MVP of this team and of the league so far is Carmelo Anthony, period
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Re: Race to the MVP pt. II 

Post#342 » by smha201 » Fri Dec 14, 2012 5:50 am

Still laughing at some people thinking Melo is going to forget how to play basketball mid-season. Keep dreaming, you marks!
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Re: Race to the MVP pt. II 

Post#343 » by adjacent2bench » Fri Dec 14, 2012 5:52 am

smha201 wrote:Still laughing at some people thinking Melo is going to forget how to play basketball mid-season. Keep dreaming, you marks!



He's been playing like this since April. The Knicks in general have been playing like this since April.
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Re: Race to the MVP pt. II 

Post#344 » by smha201 » Fri Dec 14, 2012 6:41 am

StephNYKurry wrote:I ain't arguing with stat geeks no more. This isn't about who the best player is, because Lebron wins that every year and twice on Sundays. It's about being the most valuable player to your basketball team, and so far this season, Carmelo has been the most valuable player to his team. Felton, Kidd, Novak, and Brew are all COMPLETELY different players if Melo isn't there, but because of Melo and his impact, those guys are playing great.

My perfect example of a game where the stats didn't bear out Melo's impact is the Spurs game. Didn't shoot as well, but his presence was still felt on every possession. Pop even said as much postgame.

Once again, this ain't about who the best player is of who's having a better year.


This is because you understand what Most Valuable Player means. One cannot expect the legion of neanderthals on the GB to comprehend a concept even this basic.

Oh, and Melo's having the better year while we're at it, too. He is the league's MVP on the most successful team in the conference - tough luck for LeBron.
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Re: Race to the MVP pt. II 

Post#345 » by OptimusOne6 » Fri Dec 14, 2012 7:03 am

Every time I read this thread, I always see TheGarden arguing Melo is better than Durant.

Dude, you are literally alone on this one, I'm pretty sure most Knicks fans don't even agree with you that Melo is better than Durant. Durant and Lebron are the clear cut #1 and #2 players in the league. Quit wasting your time trying to change everyone's mind because you aren't doing anything.
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Re: Race to the MVP pt. II 

Post#346 » by TheGarden » Fri Dec 14, 2012 7:10 am

OptimusOne6 wrote:Every time I read this thread, I always see TheGarden arguing Melo is better than Durant.

Dude, you are literally alone on this one, I'm pretty sure most Knicks fans don't even agree with you that Melo is better than Durant. Durant and Lebron are the clear cut #1 and #2 players in the league. Quit wasting your time trying to change everyone's mind because you aren't doing anything.


I dont care if I'm alone my opinion is just that an opinion. I honestly think Carmelo is a better player there's nothing wrong with that. Some people argue Durant is better than LeBron so why cant I argue Carmelo is better than Durant.

I'm not trying to change minds but you guys will start to show Melo some respect stop knocking his performances and start giving him and the Knicks some credit. Every player has flaws but when you guys act like LeBron and Durant are flawless it makes you look like stat junkies who cant analyze the game of basketball thats one thing purists have over stat junkies we see things for what they truly are and not what guys calculate them out to be

its like a philosopher and a mathematician. A mathematician can go tell you 2x2=5 and all you have to do is pull out a calculator and prove him wrong thats your equivalent to basketball reference and synergy but a to prove a philosopher wrong you have to understand the subject and how everything effects the outcomes of the subject thats why you can have good debates around here with those who understand the game of basketball and you argue with those who need statistics to have a good debate
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Re: Race to the MVP pt. II 

Post#347 » by Voice_of_Reason » Fri Dec 14, 2012 7:26 am

The only major difference between this season and what Melo has done for his entire career is get hot from deep. He's jacking up a career high in 3's and hitting at a career high. That's why I'm still not sold on this new Carmelo and NYK as bona fide title contenders yet.
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Re: Race to the MVP pt. II 

Post#348 » by smha201 » Fri Dec 14, 2012 7:36 am

OptimusOne6 wrote:Every time I read this thread, I always see TheGarden arguing Melo is better than Durant.

Dude, you are literally alone on this one, I'm pretty sure most Knicks fans don't even agree with you that Melo is better than Durant. Durant and Lebron are the clear cut #1 and #2 players in the league. Quit wasting your time trying to change everyone's mind because you aren't doing anything.


I'll toss my hat into the ring, too. Melo is better than Durant. In some ways he is better than LeBron, too - as a pure scorer and in terms of killer instinct and clutch ability. Don't give a f*** if that bothers you or anyone else.
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Re: Race to the MVP pt. II 

Post#349 » by TheGarden » Fri Dec 14, 2012 8:10 am

Voice_of_Reason wrote:The only major difference between this season and what Melo has done for his entire career is get hot from deep. He's jacking up a career high in 3's and hitting at a career high. That's why I'm still not sold on this new Carmelo and NYK as bona fide title contenders yet.


their open shots, great shots off of great ball movement its sustainable because we mix it up and keep defenses at bay pick n roll and 3's all over or we go Felton/Chandler pick n roll and let them work, iso Melo, iso JR or we run sets
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Re: Race to the MVP pt. II 

Post#350 » by regGQ » Fri Dec 14, 2012 11:41 am

I'm taking Melo over Durant this season, sorry.
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Re: Race to the MVP pt. II 

Post#351 » by KDgoat » Fri Dec 14, 2012 1:11 pm

Durant
Melo

But the difference is o so minor. 30 points in 22 minutes against the Lakers? Damn. He's efficient, not ballhogging, playing defense. Melo is playing his best year yet, but Durant is doing exactly the same. Can't wait for their next head-to-head.
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Re: Race to the MVP pt. II 

Post#352 » by TheGarden » Fri Dec 14, 2012 2:13 pm

KDgoat wrote:Durant
Melo

But the difference is o so minor. 30 points in 22 minutes against the Lakers? Damn. He's efficient, not ballhogging, playing defense. Melo is playing his best year yet, but Durant is doing exactly the same. Can't wait for their next head-to-head.


Agreed Durant then Carmelo right now both are amazing to watch
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Re: Race to the MVP pt. II 

Post#353 » by osamu » Fri Dec 14, 2012 2:48 pm

I can't wait till playoffs. Then all this Melo better than Lebron/KD is put to rest. Better than Lebron and past the 1st round once?! But apparently this is his year...
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Re: Race to the MVP pt. II 

Post#354 » by omerome » Fri Dec 14, 2012 2:57 pm

osamu wrote:I can't wait till playoffs. Then all this Melo better than Lebron/KD is put to rest. Better than Lebron and past the 1st round once?! But apparently this is his year...

Why is this about who's better?

That's not what the MVP is about. It's about who is more valuable; there is a difference.
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Re: Race to the MVP pt. II 

Post#355 » by TheGarden » Fri Dec 14, 2012 3:10 pm

osamu wrote:I can't wait till playoffs. Then all this Melo better than Lebron/KD is put to rest. Better than Lebron and past the 1st round once?! But apparently this is his year...


nothing matters but this year so why bring up the past I swear its like arguing with my girl, she'll bring up mad old **** unrelated to the argument just so I look stupid

example

me: Carmelo is a top 3 MVP candidate
realgm: his career TS% is low, he's only been out the 1st round once, advanced stats blah blah

at home

me: I forgot your milkshake my bad
girl: too busy in bitches faces at the mall last week thats why you forgot

:-?

really guys come on
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Re: Race to the MVP pt. II 

Post#356 » by Allan Houston » Fri Dec 14, 2012 3:16 pm

I seriously don't know how some people think "he won't keep playing like this" is a legitimate argument. Do you people debate with 9 year olds?
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Re: Race to the MVP pt. II 

Post#357 » by KDgoat » Fri Dec 14, 2012 3:25 pm

Allan Houston wrote:I seriously don't know how some people think "he won't keep playing like this" is a legitimate argument. Do you people debate with 9 year olds?


It is as much a legitimate argument as your argument thinking he will keep on playing like this. The past is always the best predictor of the future (and the only one in my opinion), and Melo his best 3P% over the course of an entire season is 42% from 2 years ago. Apart from that he hasn't been over 37% at all, and only reached that 37% twice.

He's shooting 45.5% now. Can he sustain it? Of course he can. Will he sustain it? I doubt it. In any case, he's less likely to continue shooting at this spectacular rate than he is to sustain or even improve it.

Apart from his 3P% (and his increased 3P shot attempts), his statistics look a lot like something he has done in the past. The eye test however show he's playing differently from before. Despite his career high usage rate, he's playing more off the ball (ironically), letting someone else dictate the flow of the offense, and I personally think he's playing better D (even though his defensive rating has been better last year).

The sample is still small, and in sports it's always too small to consider statistics as sufficiently valid imo. Nevertheless, it's interesting to keep track of.
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Re: Race to the MVP pt. II 

Post#358 » by Brickz7 » Fri Dec 14, 2012 4:53 pm

Im also one of the people who feel Carmelo is Better than Durant..To keep it brief and simple..he is a better scorer than durant..scores in every way shape in form. Durant = no/very limted post game..(even charles barkley said this multiple times last night) on the other end there both are avg defenders. Both are ok passers but melo see's more double teams than durant
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Re: Race to the MVP pt. II 

Post#359 » by Albert23 » Fri Dec 14, 2012 5:36 pm

I don't think either LeBron or Melo will keep shooting 45% from 3, it's just not that likely.

But I see posts saying Melo is better than Durant, in what regard exactly? Melo gets half a point per game more but is decimated in rebounds per game, assists, and FG%.
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Re: Race to the MVP pt. II 

Post#360 » by HurricaneKid » Fri Dec 14, 2012 5:39 pm

Brickz7 wrote:Im also one of the people who feel Carmelo is Better than Durant..To keep it brief and simple..he is a better scorer than durant..scores in every way shape in form. Durant = no/very limted post game..(even charles barkley said this multiple times last night) on the other end there both are avg defenders. Both are ok passers but melo see's more double teams than durant


No. You would think if you typed this many things you would accidentally get SOMETHING right. But nope. Not a single thing.
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