Why are people saying Cleveland is not a contender?

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Re: Why are people saying Cleveland is not a contender? 

Post#261 » by Hello Brooklyn » Sun Jul 13, 2014 5:24 pm

lightfoot wrote:We've seen this movie before. Cavs won't be a top seed in the East because it will take at least half a season for them to begin to gel as a team -- remember, they also have a new coach. If Rose is healthy then Chicago will have the #1 seed and will be the clear favorites to represent the East. I think Miami will be better than people expect, but I think Atlanta wins the Southeast division (with Washington right on their heels). Toronto obviously wins the Atlantic division.

So, barring injuries and such, the top 3 seeds will be Chicago, Atlanta, Toronto. The 1st round won't be a cakewalk for anyone -- teams that started slow (Cavs, Heat) will be in better form, the Pacers know how to win in the playoffs, and teams like Washington and Charlotte have some much-needed playoff experience now.

I think the East will be much more competitive this year, but none will have the firepower and experience to beat whatever team makes it through the West.

Can't wait until the season starts!


True, but I don't see a 2011 type Bulls team in the East that can win 60 games next year.
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Re: Why are people saying Cleveland is not a contender? 

Post#262 » by NapoleonII » Sun Jul 13, 2014 5:26 pm

LBJVirus218 wrote:Lebron in 2007 took a Cavs team consisting of Larry Hughes, Drew Gooden, Zydrunas Illgauskas, Sasha Pavlovic, Rookie Daniel Gibson, Anderson Varejao, and Donyell Marshall to the NBA Finals. They beat a Detroit team that would beat any team currently in eastern conference this year. I think 2007 is gonna repeat itself. Cavs vs Spurs finals with Spurs winning again...maybe not a sweep this time though.



Nah, I think the Cavs redeem themselves in 7 and Lebron actually does something that is GOAT worthy.
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Re: Why are people saying Cleveland is not a contender? 

Post#263 » by NDaATL » Sun Jul 13, 2014 11:38 pm

42uptop wrote:
NDaATL wrote:So, you think Bosh putting up 16 and 6 and Battier's 4 and 2 was a better fit in Miami than Varejao and Thompson would have been alongside LeBron in Miami?

Why do you think Miami was dead last in rebounding last year? It was by far their biggest weakness because Bosh stands on the perimeter, and Battier was lucky to stand.

Again, it's the fit with LeBron. Bosh is a great scorer, but when LeBron is on the team, the team will obviously elect to ISO with LeBron, not Bosh. Bosh was extremely underutilized and has always been a bad fit for the Heat. He contributes to the team's biggest weaknesses. Rebounding and interior defense.

It's the same situation when people were saying Heat were looking to add Melo. It wouldn't have helped them IMO because it doesn't address any of their weaknesses. They already have scorers.


Yes, Bosh and Battier were a much better fit last year than the Cavs rotation of terrible big men would have been.

If you are simply looking at the box score, then 16 and 6 is not impressive. Try actually watching the games.
Bosh had huge games when one of LeBron or Wade wasn't playing because he was heavily underutilized as the third banana. He is about to have a massive upswing in production. His rebounding will go up as well because he will be able to play inside more now that LeBron isn't there.

If Cleveland's double-double guys are terrible, than what does that make Battier? I think you are underestimating how bad he really was last year.

BTW, you have just proved my point. Bosh was heavily underutilized. Of course Bosh will score more now that LeBron is gone, it wasn't my point at all. Miami needed rebounding in the worst way and Bosh stood on the perimeter the entire game. If they need to stretch the floor they had Reshard Lewis on their team. A combo of Varejao and Thompson for THAT Heat team would have tremendously helped their rebounding, most likely into the top half of the league. Sure they would lose some scoring, but getting Battier off the floor is almost enough to negate that as the guy was literally a statue on the floor this season. He honestly may have been the worst player in the NBA last year that actually played significant (20+) minutes.

Steven A is even reporting that LeBron (although he likes Bosh) wasn't a fan of playing with him b/c it was a bad fit. They wanted him to sign with Houston if they kept the same roster. That money would've been much better used on someone who wants to do the dirty work and rebound. Because although Bosh is a great player, as i have said, he was a horrible fit in Miami and heavily contributed to their biggest weakness.

Bosh even admitted he doesn't want to play inside anymore and he publically made that statement about a month ago.
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Re: Why are people saying Cleveland is not a contender? 

Post#264 » by PZiv » Mon Jul 14, 2014 12:06 am

They are 50 win team on the east and a pretender. Lebron out and they are 30win team on the LEAST.
Chicago takes it this year.
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Re: Why are people saying Cleveland is not a contender? 

Post#265 » by kinein » Mon Jul 14, 2014 6:53 am

NDaATL wrote:Do people not realize how good LeBron James is? Or are they just reading too much into his SI statement about it taking a while, I don't understand it. LeBron had to say what he said in his excerpt, not to promise anything and I get that.

But, Wade is a shell of himself and only played 40 some odd games last year. Bosh has become a soft jumpshooter and is the 2014 version of the Joe Johnson contract. Cleveland is better all around the board than Miami. The only thing Cleveland is missing is 3pt shooters which I'm sure they will not have any trouble adding.

Varajao + Thompson > Bosh + UD or Battier
LeBron = LeBron
Irving > Wade

I don't get it. They are easily a contender. Maybe they don't beat the Spurs but I don't see anyone in the East taking them, and if a team other than SA makes the finals it's a coinflip IMO.


No one on the cavs brings everything else to the game like Wade and Bosh and the rest of the Heat roster did. Irving has yet to play a season 82 games straight - he is a liability and is not known to make everyone else better around him like LeBron does.

Irving was only keeping the throne of Cleveland warm for LeBron. Its going to be upon the shoulders of LeBron to whip everyone into shape to play team-ball around him, even Irving.
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Re: Why are people saying Cleveland is not a contender? 

Post#266 » by Rock Hardy » Mon Jul 14, 2014 7:10 am

It's best to wait until preseason to draw conclusions. We haven't seen them play a single possession together. We've seen better, more experienced rosters struggle recently. Last year's Nets and the Lakers before looked a great fit on paper, and more talented, with tons of experience. They both struggled. LeBron needs spacing to be good best. Let's also see how he adjusts his game as well.
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Re: Why are people saying Cleveland is not a contender? 

Post#267 » by 42uptop » Sat Nov 22, 2014 3:32 am

NDaATL wrote:Do people not realize how good LeBron James is? Or are they just reading too much into his SI statement about it taking a while, I don't understand it. LeBron had to say what he said in his excerpt, not to promise anything and I get that.

But, Wade is a shell of himself and only played 40 some odd games last year. Bosh has become a soft jumpshooter and is the 2014 version of the Joe Johnson contract. Cleveland is better all around the board than Miami. The only thing Cleveland is missing is 3pt shooters which I'm sure they will not have any trouble adding.

Varajao + Thompson > Bosh + UD or Battier
LeBron = LeBron
Irving > Wade

I don't get it. They are easily a contender. Maybe they don't beat the Spurs but I don't see anyone in the East taking them, and if a team other than SA makes the finals it's a coinflip IMO.


Sooooooo....... have you changed your mind on any of these statements?
I speak the truth.
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Re: Why are people saying Cleveland is not a contender? 

Post#268 » by makaveli_99 » Sat Nov 22, 2014 3:35 am

42uptop wrote:
NDaATL wrote:Do people not realize how good LeBron James is? Or are they just reading too much into his SI statement about it taking a while, I don't understand it. LeBron had to say what he said in his excerpt, not to promise anything and I get that.

But, Wade is a shell of himself and only played 40 some odd games last year. Bosh has become a soft jumpshooter and is the 2014 version of the Joe Johnson contract. Cleveland is better all around the board than Miami. The only thing Cleveland is missing is 3pt shooters which I'm sure they will not have any trouble adding.

Varajao + Thompson > Bosh + UD or Battier
LeBron = LeBron
Irving > Wade

I don't get it. They are easily a contender. Maybe they don't beat the Spurs but I don't see anyone in the East taking them, and if a team other than SA makes the finals it's a coinflip IMO.


Sooooooo....... have you changed your mind on any of these statements?


wade >>>>> irving
mia lbj >>> cle lbj (cle lbj can't finish anything at the rim)
love can't guard a chair

waiters is jr smith 2.0
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Re: Why are people saying Cleveland is not a contender? 

Post#269 » by FreeChef » Sat Nov 22, 2014 3:50 am

makaveli_99 wrote:
42uptop wrote:
NDaATL wrote:Do people not realize how good LeBron James is? Or are they just reading too much into his SI statement about it taking a while, I don't understand it. LeBron had to say what he said in his excerpt, not to promise anything and I get that.

But, Wade is a shell of himself and only played 40 some odd games last year. Bosh has become a soft jumpshooter and is the 2014 version of the Joe Johnson contract. Cleveland is better all around the board than Miami. The only thing Cleveland is missing is 3pt shooters which I'm sure they will not have any trouble adding.

Varajao + Thompson > Bosh + UD or Battier
LeBron = LeBron
Irving > Wade

I don't get it. They are easily a contender. Maybe they don't beat the Spurs but I don't see anyone in the East taking them, and if a team other than SA makes the finals it's a coinflip IMO.


Sooooooo....... have you changed your mind on any of these statements?


wade >>>>> irving
mia lbj >>> cle lbj (cle lbj can't finish anything at the rim)
love can't guard a chair

waiters is jr smith 2.0


Spo >>>> Blatt
Riley >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Griffin
Arison >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Gilbert
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Re: Why are people saying Cleveland is not a contender? 

Post#270 » by BruceO » Sat Nov 22, 2014 5:58 am

FreeChef wrote:
makaveli_99 wrote:
42uptop wrote:
Sooooooo....... have you changed your mind on any of these statements?


wade >>>>> irving
mia lbj >>> cle lbj (cle lbj can't finish anything at the rim)
love can't guard a chair

waiters is jr smith 2.0


Spo >>>> Blatt
Riley >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Griffin
Arison >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Gilbert


Wall >> kyrie
Beal >> waiters
Pierce loves to cock block LeBron
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Re: Why are people saying Cleveland is not a contender? 

Post#271 » by Halcyon » Sat Nov 22, 2014 6:59 am

Cavs are the definition of mediocre. They'll win against terrible teams with their talent, but they have no cohesion on the court, on the offense and defense.
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Re: Why are people saying Cleveland is not a contender? 

Post#272 » by Michael Lucky » Sat Nov 22, 2014 7:03 am

They are a contender because they are in the East. IF they were in the West, I just don't see how they would be. Just not now and i don't think they'll be at the end of the year either. They just have too many defensive liabilities on that team and it doesn't matter how good your talent is on offense if opposing teams are just going to easily score buckets on you.
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Re: Why are people saying Cleveland is not a contender? 

Post#273 » by The Miami Heat » Sat Nov 22, 2014 9:55 am

Wonder how OP feels now seeing their record
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Re: Why are people saying Cleveland is not a contender? 

Post#274 » by atlantabbq99 » Sat Nov 22, 2014 10:00 am

atlantabbq99 wrote:Sun Jul 13, 2014 8:05 am by "atlantabbq99"
NDaATL wrote:Do people not realize how good LeBron James is? Or are they just reading too much into his SI statement about it taking a while, I don't understand it. LeBron had to say what he said in his excerpt, not to promise anything and I get that.

But, Wade is a shell of himself and only played 40 some odd games last year. Bosh has become a soft jumpshooter and is the 2014 version of the Joe Johnson contract. Cleveland is better all around the board than Miami. The only thing Cleveland is missing is 3pt shooters which I'm sure they will not have any trouble adding.

Varajao + Thompson > Bosh + UD or Battier
LeBron = LeBron
Irving > Wade

I don't get it. They are easily a contender. Maybe they don't beat the Spurs but I don't see anyone in the East taking them, and if a team other than SA makes the finals it's a coinflip IMO.



Because Lebron James is not Michael Jordan or Magic Johnson. Cleveland will still be a horrible defensive team. Lebron can probably lift them up from #10 in the east to #4 or #5.

Two years is not enough time to build chemistry with Irving and Wiggins. In addition, Z is no longer around and Varajao will get injured again and only end up playing 50 games.


Hey hey, july 13.... Did i call it or what!!! :D
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Re: Why are people saying Cleveland is not a contender? 

Post#275 » by SlobbaN » Sat Nov 22, 2014 11:21 am

Cavs would be 3-8 in the West and happy with that.
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Re: Why are people saying Cleveland is not a contender? 

Post#276 » by RatherUnique » Sat Nov 22, 2014 12:07 pm

Halcyon wrote:Cavs are the definition of mediocre. They'll win against terrible teams with their talent, but they have no cohesion on the court, on the offense and defense.

You're saying this based on 11 regular season games in the first month of the regular season when the playoffs begin in late April :lol: As if there is no chance that a team that added a couple of elite pieces can't significantly improve within the next several months :lol:
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Re: Why are people saying Cleveland is not a contender? 

Post#277 » by Scrapachenko » Sat Nov 22, 2014 12:36 pm

It's all fun and games to dig this up on Nov 22nd... yuck it up now. It'll be even more fun to look back at this on January 22nd, February 22nd, March 22nd, April 22nd, May 22nd and laugh our (rears) off at all of the Nostradamus' patting themselves on the back after 11 games and pronouncing this team dead.

Does anyone here want to make a bet on the Cavs finishing under .500? If not, then STFU.... because even you know that their record will improve and that in all likelihood they'll be playing in the ECF at a minimum while your team is at home watching and you're complaining about the officials or looking forward to the NBA draft.

Like I said, enjoy it while you can...
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Re: Why are people saying Cleveland is not a contender? 

Post#278 » by Scrapachenko » Sat Nov 22, 2014 12:42 pm

BTW I have the Cavs at 17-10 going into the Heat Christmas day game... Anyone here want to take 12-15(roughly what their current win pct would project to) and we can see who is closer on Christmas day?
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Re: Why are people saying Cleveland is not a contender? 

Post#279 » by BJGOAT3 » Sat Nov 22, 2014 2:14 pm

Funny thing is that they won 2 extremely close games :lol: they could've been 3-8 so easily.

With all the crap Lakers had to deal with in 2013, Nash-Gasol injuries, Dwight-Kobe feud, Marc D'Antoni fiasco, that team won 45 games in the West. No reason to believe that Cavs will be this bad for the rest of the season, they'll probably win around 50 games which should be solid for top3 in East.
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Re: Why are people saying Cleveland is not a contender? 

Post#280 » by Perkele » Sat Nov 22, 2014 3:37 pm

42uptop wrote:
NDaATL wrote:Do people not realize how good LeBron James is? Or are they just reading too much into his SI statement about it taking a while, I don't understand it. LeBron had to say what he said in his excerpt, not to promise anything and I get that.

But, Wade is a shell of himself and only played 40 some odd games last year. Bosh has become a soft jumpshooter and is the 2014 version of the Joe Johnson contract. Cleveland is better all around the board than Miami. The only thing Cleveland is missing is 3pt shooters which I'm sure they will not have any trouble adding.

Varajao + Thompson > Bosh + UD or Battier
LeBron = LeBron
Irving > Wade

I don't get it. They are easily a contender. Maybe they don't beat the Spurs but I don't see anyone in the East taking them, and if a team other than SA makes the finals it's a coinflip IMO.


Sooooooo....... have you changed your mind on any of these statements?


Ouch :lol: :lol: :lol:

Epic bump.

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