T'Wolves long term PG: Rubio or LaVine?

[SF_Warriors]

I think lavine and rubio is their starting backcourt of the future.

They are playing lavine at backup pg because they were giving martin/shabazz/prince most of the minutes at SG early in the season when lavine was struggling a bit. My guess was this was to give him some confidence and have the ball in his hands more.

Good move on mitchells part. Lavine has been playing well as of late.

[ImChillin01]

Spoiler:

Ideally if lavine had any vision and iq he would be way better at the pg.
But he should be the sg for the future.
Perhaps a 6th man if things don't pan out.

As for pg, the wolves need someone else at the corner stone of the most important position.
But might as well run with Rubio during this rebuild for now since he is extended.

PG isnt most important position. Last Finals MVP that was PG was Magic Johnson and that was in 80s

You got me there, I meant to say last Reg MVP and Finals MVP in same season for PG was Magic. But my point stands, PG isnt most important position in NBA

[baldur]

Rubio. Who's a very very good PG with a broken shot. He'll be among the very best pg's if he can start hitting some shots.

People have been saying that since he was a rookie.

people had been saying that since he was 19 playing for barcelona.

[ImChillin01]

Ideally if lavine had any vision and iq he would be way better at the pg.
But he should be the sg for the future.
Perhaps a 6th man if things don't pan out.

As for pg, the wolves need someone else at the corner stone of the most important position.
But might as well run with Rubio during this rebuild for now since he is extended.

PG isnt most important position. Last Finals MVP that was PG was Magic Johnson and that was in 80s

Billups and Parker?

Unless you mean last PG to win mvp in the regular season to win a championship?

Thats what I meant but regardless I don't think PG is most important position in NBA

[Swish4]

Playing LaVine at point is mostly a developmental project. They know he's a SG, but he's learning skills that will help him immensely in the future.

[SF_Warriors]

PG isnt most important position. Last Finals MVP that was PG was Magic Johnson and that was in 80s

Billups and Parker?

Unless you mean last PG to win mvp in the regular season to win a championship?

Thats what I meant but regardless I don't think PG is most important position in NBA

Yea, I tend to agree. It seems to be most of the contenders have versatile forwards who impact the floor on both ends at high levels.
Guys like kawhi, lebron, KD, PG, Draymond, are all essential to be able to adapt to most playing styles and also create favorable mismatches. Wiggins not quite there yet, but I can see him getting to that level.

I am not saying draymond is in the same tier as lebron, but just that he is a high level impact on both ends and falls into the category of versatile forwards. I know he is much less talented skillwise and physically than lebron.

After that tier, you can see how less talented versatile forwards have impacted their teams: Guys like Andre, batum, demarre for the raps, all have helped their respective teams improve even though they arent all stars.

[Worm Guts]

i just mean in today's league.

you need a pg who can pass, drive, and shoot the 3 point shot.
rubio is good at 1 of those 3. maybeeeee driving too but he cant finish...

the pg doesnt have to be the best player, but if you look at all the top teams, their point guard is at least decent in all 3.
(minus cleveland bc of lebron lol)

No, in today's league you need a PG that has a positive impact on the court.

Who the **** cares if he does it with passing and defense or with shooting and driving?

cause in today's league, if you can't shoot and drive as a pg, you're got going to have as much of a positive contribution as another player who can do both + pass. I'm not saying rubio is bad, or that he is a negative on the floor, but a lot of his postives are offset by the glaring holes in his game. Could he be the starting pg in a championship team? sure, but the wolves would probably need 2 other star players, with 1 being a legit superstar (some hope is on wiggins).

besides PG defense is the hardest, and i really can't think of any pg who can consistently slow down another elite pg. So rubio really only has tempo and passing as his strengths.

Rubio has had a positive on/off every year in the league. RPM has had him consistently in the top 10 at the position and someone else posted how he's in the top 10 in RAPM. And yesterday the Wolves ended a 16 game losing streak in games without Rubio.
He makes a huge positive difference for the Wolves and has since his rookie season.

[LesGrossman]

Do you think Rondo is a good shooter now?

No, reject the whole statement - "He'll be among the very best pg's if he can start hitting some shots."

Both are among the very best PG's regardless of their shots, because shooting is not the main skill a PG needs, in general. They bring more than enough to compensate for their lack of shooting; Rondo can still score a bit better at the rim, while Rubio is the better defender.

There are quite a few PG's that are better than both Rondo and Rubio right now.

Quite a few? Go ahead and name them then.

[TheZachAttack]

Rubio. Who's a very very good PG with a broken shot. He'll be among the very best pg's if he can start hitting some shots.

People have been saying that since he was a rookie.

The thing that people like you don't realize is that Rubio would be among the very best PGs if he developed a shot, but even he doesn't he's still a good PG.


It's like alright Rubio is a good PG who could become in the conversation of the elite of the elite if he developed a shot, but that doesn't mean he's bad now...far from it.



It's like there is another argument between the Rubio is the best PG in the league and Rubio is horrible. No, he's not a top 5 PG. But he's also not a bottom 15 PG. He's somewhere in that good, but not elite category...which is fine. And that's offensively. But defensively he is a top 5 PG. Overall? He's probably somewhere around 10 give or take a few spots, but rankings are pretty meaningless.

Whether Rubio is better or not than Rondo has no effect on how good of player Rubio is. They are mutually exlusive entities. And Rubio is the PG of the Wolves future. He fits pretty much perfectly with what we are trying to do. We don't want a Russell Westbrook like PG where he's the leading shooter on the team.

Like I said before, Wiggins, KAT, and Lavine are all going to shoot more than Rubio. All he needs to do is do what he does now and shoot within the flow of the offense and only enough to open up passing games.


You don't always have to drift to the poles and argue extremes.

[Zeitgeister]

No, reject the whole statement - "He'll be among the very best pg's if he can start hitting some shots."

Both are among the very best PG's regardless of their shots, because shooting is not the main skill a PG needs, in general. They bring more than enough to compensate for their lack of shooting; Rondo can still score a bit better at the rim, while Rubio is the better defender.

There are quite a few PG's that are better than both Rondo and Rubio right now.

Quite a few? Go ahead and name them then.

Steph Curry
Russell Westbrook
Chris Paul
John Wall
Damian Lillard
Mike Conley
Jeff Teague
Kyle Lowry
Kyrie Irving - don't particularly like him as a floor general but he's a damned good scorer and that matters too.

I'm sure there are a few others that would be within the discussion as well.

[eagereyez]

There are quite a few PG's that are better than both Rondo and Rubio right now.

Quite a few? Go ahead and name them then.

Steph Curry
Russell Westbrook
Chris Paul
John Wall
Damian Lillard
Mike Conley
Jeff Teague
Kyle Lowry
Kyrie Irving - don't particularly like him as a floor general but he's a damned good scorer and that matters too.

I'm sure there are a few others that would be within the discussion as well.

Bledsoe is pretty comfortably better than them as well. Aside from that group there's a few others that would be borderline.

[LesGrossman]

Quite a few? Go ahead and name them then.

Steph Curry
Russell Westbrook
Chris Paul
John Wall
Damian Lillard
Mike Conley
Jeff Teague
Kyle Lowry
Kyrie Irving - don't particularly like him as a floor general but he's a damned good scorer and that matters too.

I'm sure there are a few others that would be within the discussion as well.

Bledsoe is pretty comfortably better than them as well. Aside from that group there's a few others that would be borderline.

Well if thats your opinion and you seriously believe these guys are better than Rubio and Rondo, then we'll have to agree to disagree.

[TheZachAttack]

Steph Curry
Russell Westbrook
Chris Paul
John Wall
Damian Lillard
Mike Conley
Jeff Teague
Kyle Lowry
Kyrie Irving - don't particularly like him as a floor general but he's a damned good scorer and that matters too.

I'm sure there are a few others that would be within the discussion as well.

Bledsoe is pretty comfortably better than them as well. Aside from that group there's a few others that would be borderline.

Well if thats your opinion and you seriously believe these guys are better than Rubio and Rondo, then we'll have to agree to disagree.

You think Rubio is better than Curry, Westbrook, Paul, Wall, Lilliard, etc.? I'm a huge fan and have been called a homer at times, but I'm going to have to distance myself from you because you are making Wolves fans look bad right now.

[TheZachAttack]

Playing LaVine at point is mostly a developmental project. They know he's a SG, but he's learning skills that will help him immensely in the future.

Plus the Wolves don't really have a backup Pg they can play consistent minutes right now which is the main reason for all of this. The Wolves have a lot more wing options so that's why Lavine gets so many minutes at backup PG.

If they had a legit backup PG who could play 15 minutes a game and be content with that role and successful at it. Lavine would be seeing all of his minutes at the 2.

Andre Miller and Tyus for the opposite reasons cannot be trusted for significant minutes or a consistent role.

[Worm Guts]

Playing LaVine at point is mostly a developmental project. They know he's a SG, but he's learning skills that will help him immensely in the future.

Plus the Wolves don't really have a backup Pg they can play consistent minutes right now which is the main reason for all of this. The Wolves have a lot more wing options so that's why Lavine gets so many minutes at backup PG.

If they had a legit backup PG who could play 15 minutes a game and be content with that role and successful at it. Lavine would be seeing all of his minutes at the 2.

Andre Miller and Tyus for the opposite reasons cannot be trusted for significant minutes or a consistent role.

I don't think that's necessarily true. Miller has been solid in the minutes he's played.

[LesGrossman]

Bledsoe is pretty comfortably better than them as well. Aside from that group there's a few others that would be borderline.

Well if thats your opinion and you seriously believe these guys are better than Rubio and Rondo, then we'll have to agree to disagree.

You think Rubio is better than Curry, Westbrook, Paul, Wall, Lilliard, etc.? I'm a huge fan and have been called a homer at times, but I'm going to have to distance myself from you because you are making Wolves fans look bad right now.

I believe Curry and Lillard are the best package right now along with Wall. Westbrook isnt even a point guard in my opinion, he is a good scorer but if you think about putting Ricky or Rondo in some of these past teams where Durant had to beg for every chance to shoot one might wonder wether the outcome wouldnt have been better.

Guys like Teague, Lowry or Bledsoe are by no means "comfortably better" than Ricky or Rondo, thats just trolling imho. The claim was that there are "quite a few" better point guards out there and knowing who it came from i wasnt surprised to see these guys on the list. I wonder by which measures Bledsoe would be "comfortably better" except for scoring more points but then again its a pointless discussion that has been lead over and over. Basically if what you beliieve in is the "me first" type scoring point guard then you'll be disappointed by pass first players.That has little to do with homerism tbh.

[MoneyTalks41890]

Well if thats your opinion and you seriously believe these guys are better than Rubio and Rondo, then we'll have to agree to disagree.

You think Rubio is better than Curry, Westbrook, Paul, Wall, Lilliard, etc.? I'm a huge fan and have been called a homer at times, but I'm going to have to distance myself from you because you are making Wolves fans look bad right now.

I believe Curry and Lillard are the best package right now along with Wall. Westbrook isnt even a point guard in my opinion, he is a good scorer but if you think about putting Ricky or Rondo in some of these past teams where Durant had to beg for every chance to shoot one might wonder wether the outcome wouldnt have been better.

Guys like Teague, Lowry or Bledsoe are by no means "comfortably better" than Ricky or Rondo, thats just trolling imho. The claim was that there are "quite a few" better point guards out there and knowing who it came from i wasnt surprised to see these guys on the list. I wonder by which measures Bledsoe would be "comfortably better" except for scoring more points but then again its a pointless discussion that has been lead over and over. Basically if what you beliieve in is the "me first" type scoring point guard then you'll be disappointed by pass first players.That has little to do with homerism tbh.

Westbrook isn't a PG? You clearly haven't watched him... Sigh...

[NaturalBuns]

LaVine is not a PG.

I'm not saying your wrong.
But I could probably pull up numerous threads and or quotes of people saying Westbrook is not a pg.

Fast forward two or three years and he leads the league in assist. Nobody saw that coming from a dude who loves to shoot

[LesGrossman]

You think Rubio is better than Curry, Westbrook, Paul, Wall, Lilliard, etc.? I'm a huge fan and have been called a homer at times, but I'm going to have to distance myself from you because you are making Wolves fans look bad right now.

I believe Curry and Lillard are the best package right now along with Wall. Westbrook isnt even a point guard in my opinion, he is a good scorer but if you think about putting Ricky or Rondo in some of these past teams where Durant had to beg for every chance to shoot one might wonder wether the outcome wouldnt have been better.

Guys like Teague, Lowry or Bledsoe are by no means "comfortably better" than Ricky or Rondo, thats just trolling imho. The claim was that there are "quite a few" better point guards out there and knowing who it came from i wasnt surprised to see these guys on the list. I wonder by which measures Bledsoe would be "comfortably better" except for scoring more points but then again its a pointless discussion that has been lead over and over. Basically if what you beliieve in is the "me first" type scoring point guard then you'll be disappointed by pass first players.That has little to do with homerism tbh.

Westbrook isn't a PG? You clearly haven't watched him... Sigh...

If you feel better i'll add westbrook, too. That makes four guys who are clearly ahead. I'm fine with Ricky being among the top5 - top10 PG in the league, i just disagree with the message that he is mediocre or less than mediocre (other guys here stated hilariously he wouldnt even start on any other team) just because he does not score in bunches. Lavine on the other hand will not get there in my opinion because he lacks the mental abilities those other guys have. He will become a good scoring guard if he keeps working hard especially on his decision making.

[bondom34]

I believe Curry and Lillard are the best package right now along with Wall. Westbrook isnt even a point guard in my opinion, he is a good scorer but if you think about putting Ricky or Rondo in some of these past teams where Durant had to beg for every chance to shoot one might wonder wether the outcome wouldnt have been better.

Guys like Teague, Lowry or Bledsoe are by no means "comfortably better" than Ricky or Rondo, thats just trolling imho. The claim was that there are "quite a few" better point guards out there and knowing who it came from i wasnt surprised to see these guys on the list. I wonder by which measures Bledsoe would be "comfortably better" except for scoring more points but then again its a pointless discussion that has been lead over and over. Basically if what you beliieve in is the "me first" type scoring point guard then you'll be disappointed by pass first players.That has little to do with homerism tbh.

Westbrook isn't a PG? You clearly haven't watched him... Sigh...

If you feel better i'll add westbrook, too. That makes four guys who are clearly ahead. I'm fine with Ricky being among the top5 - top10 PG in the league, i just disagree with the message that he is mediocre or less than mediocre (other guys here stated hilariously he wouldnt even start on any other team) just because he does not score in bunches. Lavine on the other hand will not get there in my opinion because he lacks the mental abilities those other guys have. He will become a good scoring guard if he keeps working hard especially on his decision making.

He's a solid starter, but he's maybe (maybe) top 10-15.