NBA Draft.net website stereotyping

[Eoghan]

White guys be playing basketball like this. Black guys always be playing like this. AmIrite?

[Novocaine]

Can you quantify basketball IQ? No. It's a made up term about a game, and it's disproportionately used to insult black men's intelligence.

Can I quantify it? No. But I don't think its all that hard to see who has a great understanding of the game and who doesn't.

And sure I guess some people use it insult black men's intelligence, but I think most are able to separate intelligence from basketball IQ. For instance Westbrook gets criticized for low IQ plays at times, but I think most everyone understands that he is a very intelligent person overall.

But when you start talking about highest basketball IQ's of all-time it's almost all black players with the exception of Bird: Russell, Lebron, Kidd, Magic, Paul.

I'm not saying you are totally wrong, but essentially what you are saying is that lazy and racist people exist. That sucks but it's really got very little to do with basketball IQ.

I mean on the flip side, not all white players hustle really hard and always know where they are supposed to be at all times. But people make negative assumptions about white people's athleticism and figure the only way they make it is for those reasons. It's stupid that direction as well.

The problem is that you can arbitrarily assign the designation of "high IQ" player without having any evidence to back it up. Even defining it is hard, and that arbitrariness of the term is going to lead to racist and garbage takes, which it constantly does.

What on earth? That's just profoundly and deeply stupid. Leave tumbrl out of basketball. If one can only describe players by things that are "quantifiable", one might as well stop trying to describe them. You must have a very low IQ to not figure this out and I don't mean the basketball one. Low basketball IQ doesn't even have to do with how intelligent or unintelligent individuals are off the court.

[Nate505]

White guys be playing basketball like this. Black guys always be playing like this. AmIrite?

White basketball players have names like Lenny,while black basketball players have names like Carl.

[Domejandro]

White guys be playing basketball like this. Black guys always be playing like this. AmIrite?

White basketball players have names like Lenny,while black basketball players have names like Karl.

Fixed that for you.

[beach house]

former nbadraft.net number cruncher here.

when we did player projections we used a combinatory metric that was heavily based off of physical measurements
we used things like the eye test, play styles, stat projections, stat extrapolations, etc
when we lacked data in one area we simply tweaked the metric by voiding the variable set to database cross-correlation coefficient index to account for it

college/overseas/high school to nba stat extrapolation is extremely unreliable. physical measurements, however, translate better. this discrepancy is actually consistent enough to qualify as being "statistically significant" (with confidence interval of 97%)

thing is, many white players are european and thus we lacked data for them so physical measurements often had a disproportionate influence on the players' projections

also, white players with damn good athleticism numbers are common, but many white players still have very short wingspans and standing reaches with respect to height (compared to black players). white players with good athleticism numbers + good physical measurements are even rarer.

so when we compile the data to find matching current players white players are often matched with players with similar physical attributes, especially euro players with missing variable sets where physical attributes have a disproportionate effect on data.

lo and behold white prospects often get compared to former/current players with lower than nba average wingspan/height ratio and athleticism numbers. this latter group consists largely of guess it - white players

there are black players with relatively poor wingspans/standing reach - (monta ellis, kemba walker, etc) but these guys are almost always plus athletes.

[NO-KG-AI]

former nbadraft.net number cruncher here.

when we did player projections we used a combinatory metric that was heavily based off of physical measurements
we used things like the eye test, play styles, stat projections, stat extrapolations, etc
when we lacked data in one area we simply tweaked the metric by voiding the variable set to database cross-correlation coefficient index to account for it

college/overseas/high school to nba stat extrapolation is extremely unreliable. physical measurements, however, translate better. this discrepancy is actually consistent enough to qualify as being "statistically significant" (with confidence interval of 97%)

thing is, many white players are european and thus we lacked data for them so physical measurements often had a disproportionate influence on the players' projections

also, white players with damn good athleticism numbers are common, but many white players still have very short wingspans and standing reaches with respect to height (compared to black players). white players with good athleticism numbers + good physical measurements are even rarer.

so when we compile the data to find matching current players white players are often matched with players with similar physical attributes, especially euro players with missing variable sets where physical attributes have a disproportionate effect on data.

lo and behold white prospects often get compared to former/current players with lower than nba average wingspan/height ratio and athleticism numbers. this latter group consists largely of guess it - white players

there are black players with relatively poor wingspans/standing reach - (monta ellis, kemba walker, etc) but these guys are almost always plus athletes.

Very interesting post, I never really correlated white guys with having short arms, but that's probably because I have orangutan limbs.


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[Xherdan 23]

I got some bad news op, that's what comparison is. would you compare a green apple to a red apple or another green apple? Have some common sense

If you scout a green apple and your best comparison is a watermelon since they're both green and round, you're a moron.
Green apples should be compared to red apples in this context.

[zronv7]

I got some bad news op, that's what comparison is. would you compare a green apple to a red apple or another green apple? Have some common sense

If you scout a green apple and your best comparison is a watermelon since they're both green and round, you're a moron.
Green apples should be compared to red apples in this context.

Where in my post did I mention a watermelon? Two totally different things...comparing a watermelon to an apple is like comparing a human to a horse, pretty bad analogy you came up there, strong first post btw

[Xherdan 23]

I got some bad news op, that's what comparison is. would you compare a green apple to a red apple or another green apple? Have some common sense

If you scout a green apple and your best comparison is a watermelon since they're both green and round, you're a moron.
Green apples should be compared to red apples in this context.

Where in my post did I mention a watermelon? Two totally different things...comparing a watermelon to an apple is like comparing a human to a horse, pretty bad analogy you came up there, strong first post btw

You said comparing a green apple to a green apple is common sense. That's good - you matched the colors correctly
Problem is when comparing basketball players their color is irrelevant, You should be looking at skills.
You're probably one of the people who thinks Bender's NBA comp is Nowitzki.
BTW, just because you spew your opinions in more posts than me doesn't make you right.

[The411]

A white man wants to win first, look good second. A black man wants to look good first, win second.

A black man would rather miss than look bad.

[Isma]

A white man wants to win first, look good second. A black man wants to look good first, win second.

A black man would rather miss than look bad.

2016

[Greatness]

A white man wants to win first, look good second. A black man wants to look good first, win second.

A black man would rather miss than look bad.

I hope you enjoyed your stay here.

[Xherdan 23]

A white man wants to win first, look good second. A black man wants to look good first, win second.

A black man would rather miss than look bad.

You may be white but you're not a man.
You're a pathetic little **** and I'm sorry you exist

[bmurph128]

The problem is that you can arbitrarily assign the designation of "high IQ" player without having any evidence to back it up. Even defining it is hard, and that arbitrariness of the term is going to lead to racist and garbage takes, which it constantly does.

How do you quantify speed? Athleticism? Heart/desire? These are all things that we SEE, but there's never really any quantitative proof that they exist. Take speed for example...

Jerry Rice ran what, a 4.7 40? But he routinely beat guys with his speed, because it's not really quantifiable either. It's something we can see though, just like basketball IQ.

When you watch LeBron or CP3 play, you can see their high basketball IQ. Same with Draymond IMO. Curry? You can see that it's lacking at times. When you watch anyone in any sports, you can see what attributes they have. Bball IQ is no different.

You can actually quantify speed by taking measure of how quickly a player can traverse from one distance to another. "Athleticism" is a term that combines other measurable qualities like leaping ability, speed, short area quickness, change of direction skills. All of which can be quantified and measured.


You can see whatever you want. These players you call low IQ know more about basketball than you ever will.

One, I never said I knew more about basketball than them - what you said is like me saying the slowest NBA player will always be faster than you. That's not breaking news.

You can quantify and measure bball IQ the same way - with a test. That's what you are referring to - are tests designed to measure speed, short area quickness and leaping ability. It's every bit as important to test a players knowledge as it is their athletic traits.

But how a player tests, both in speed and IQ, don't mean much on the court....i.e. my example about Jerry Rice. When a team meets with a player before drafting him I'm sure they are giving him tests or asking him to diagnose plays on a white board. It's really not that different from measuring how fast someone is - they might do poorly when tested for that specific thing but then stand out in games.

[xRapHeadx]

Can I quantify it? No. But I don't think its all that hard to see who has a great understanding of the game and who doesn't.

And sure I guess some people use it insult black men's intelligence, but I think most are able to separate intelligence from basketball IQ. For instance Westbrook gets criticized for low IQ plays at times, but I think most everyone understands that he is a very intelligent person overall.

But when you start talking about highest basketball IQ's of all-time it's almost all black players with the exception of Bird: Russell, Lebron, Kidd, Magic, Paul.

I'm not saying you are totally wrong, but essentially what you are saying is that lazy and racist people exist. That sucks but it's really got very little to do with basketball IQ.

I mean on the flip side, not all white players hustle really hard and always know where they are supposed to be at all times. But people make negative assumptions about white people's athleticism and figure the only way they make it is for those reasons. It's stupid that direction as well.

The problem is that you can arbitrarily assign the designation of "high IQ" player without having any evidence to back it up. Even defining it is hard, and that arbitrariness of the term is going to lead to racist and garbage takes, which it constantly does.

What on earth? That's just profoundly and deeply stupid. Leave tumbrl out of basketball. If one can only describe players by things that are "quantifiable", one might as well stop trying to describe them. You must have a very low IQ to not figure this out and I don't mean the basketball one. Low basketball IQ doesn't even have to do with how intelligent or unintelligent individuals are off the court.

and just like that, you use low IQ as an insult. Stop using things you can't quantify to describe players. That's entirely my point you racist prick.

[xRapHeadx]

Andrea Bargnani, Eddy Curry

So you can't quantify them?

Lol wtf? Can you quantify ambition? love? hate? You clearly just want to play the victim so whatever

Don't want to play victim. I want people to stop using an insult they can't even prove against black men. Period.

[xRapHeadx]

I'm not sure I agree with this. I think "basketball IQ" is disproportionately used to critique young one and done players' games. Lillard and McCollum were both noted for "crafty and cerebral games" when they came out. What's likely happening is that most young one and done players are black. These players are also underdeveloped, and need time to sort out certain aspects of their game. Long tenured college players are almost always noted for their polish and basketball intelligence, while one and done type players are almost always noted for their athleticism and potential.... for obvious non-racist reasons.

and one and done players are overwhelmingly black. "Low BBIQ" is also an insult for NBA vets like JR Smith who has forgotten more about basketball than the people insulting will ever know.

Correlation does not equal causation.... JR Smith spent about 10 years taking terrible shots... he deserves his rep.

Rep as what? A bad shot taker? See, that's quantifiable. You can observe JR's shooting percentage in certain situations and draw the conclusions that he takes poor shots. It takes a darker turn when you extrapolate that to say he has "low BBIQ"

[Beffiosa]

A white man wants to win first, look good second. A black man wants to look good first, win second.

A black man would rather miss than look bad.

I would assume you are neither black nor white since you have no problem with looking bad while coming across like a loser.

[Novocaine]

The problem is that you can arbitrarily assign the designation of "high IQ" player without having any evidence to back it up. Even defining it is hard, and that arbitrariness of the term is going to lead to racist and garbage takes, which it constantly does.

What on earth? That's just profoundly and deeply stupid. Leave tumbrl out of basketball. If one can only describe players by things that are "quantifiable", one might as well stop trying to describe them. You must have a very low IQ to not figure this out and I don't mean the basketball one. Low basketball IQ doesn't even have to do with how intelligent or unintelligent individuals are off the court.

and just like that, you use low IQ as an insult. Stop using things you can't quantify to describe players. That's entirely my point you racist prick.

Aww, you called someone in a message board a "racist prick" because they disagreed with you. Don't you feel so righteous and morally superior right now?

When every aspect of the game, and in particular every decision every player makes, is quantifiable and quantified, I'll do that. Until then, I'll describe players using "things" that nobody can't quantify with any sort of accuracy and yet still exist and impact the game. And if you think calling people racists will persuade anyone to stop doing it, you have some growing up to do.

[Big Mac Biyombo]

A white man wants to win first, look good second. A black man wants to look good first, win second.

A black man would rather miss than look bad.

Clearly none of these kids trashing you have seen the greatest basketball movie of all time.