OT: LeBron as a Public Figure

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Re: OT: LeBron as a Public Figure 

Post#81 » by ProfessorJM » Fri Feb 17, 2017 3:39 am

shawn_hemp wrote:You can do a thousand things right for some people, and they will only focus on the one thing you didn't do.

Seriously, what do black people have to complain about in the United States in 2017?


Oh my. I think this last question is way too loaded and probably beyond many posters to reasonably discuss in the proper intellectual context without it getting off the rails completely. Let's stick with sports if we can :)
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Re: OT: LeBron as a Public Figure 

Post#82 » by Duke4life831 » Fri Feb 17, 2017 3:45 am

ProfessorJM wrote:
shawn_hemp wrote:I'm not a fan of LeBron off the court to be honest.

He tries to act like some racial social justice warrior who defied the odds and now empowers young impoverished youth to do the same when in reality he won the genetic lottery and was driving an Escalade in high school because he can control a round object that much better than everyone else.

Charities are really just a way to not have to pay as much taxes. Sure, they help people, but they help the donors as well.

Once you have money it's easier to make money because you can take more risks.

And LeBron had a shoe deal before he ever played an NBA game


That's one perspective to be sure but another is that I think is that LeBron - like other athletes as well - regardless of motivation or intent, are undoubtedly positively impacting young lives and changing them for the better. A lot of people that are famous unfortunately only stay in their sphere and frankly don't do much else but I respect any athlete or other person with fame/and or a platform to influence that makes a difference in young lives. Bottom line is that LeBron (and of course other athletes) are in fact empowering young impoverished youth and the positive impact for me is the bottom line, intent be damned. Improving lives are improving lives.


I agree with intent be damned. In my post I mentioned Lance Armstrong, selfish **** but he may have impacted more lives than any other athlete, Lance Armstrong foundation has raised over 500 million dollars and given over 2.5 million people with free cancer services.

Now I have issues when a lot of celebrities or athletes speak out on a lot of political or social things because many times they clearly haven't done all their research and just spew a couple talking points that they heard that ends up later on not being true. Thats when I start not liking when celebrities speak up, because that can do more damage than good because many of them have a lot of young followers that take everything they say as fact. Now if they show to have done their research and know about the topic beyond just the talking points I will give them credit even if I don't agree with their position.
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Re: OT: LeBron as a Public Figure 

Post#83 » by LeBron_da_Don » Fri Feb 17, 2017 1:26 pm

shawn_hemp wrote:Its really not that hard for urban minorities to get grants for college. They also get accepted to more schools, solely because they are poor and black


Abigail Fisher, is that you?
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Re: OT: LeBron as a Public Figure 

Post#84 » by LeBron_da_Don » Fri Feb 17, 2017 1:35 pm

Biggie Smalls wrote:Wow...a guy thats been acting like a child in the media just two weeks ago, complaining about his teammates coming off a championship run is character wise being compared to Ali now....im done with realgm for today.


What do you actually know about Muhammad Ali? The brash, flamboyant, arrogant, iconoclastic, anti-patriot (not my sentiments but the narrative surrounding him at the height of his legend) or the freedom fighting, civil right pioneer who suffered from Parkinson's (the narrative from his later years).

You might as well change your handle from Biggie Smalls to Marky Mark.
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Re: OT: LeBron as a Public Figure 

Post#85 » by Johnny Firpo » Fri Feb 17, 2017 2:07 pm

Those are all great accomplishments, no doubt, but me personally, like to pay attention to the little details, when someone's true character comes out. And in that regard, Lebron is definitely not an all-time great. When he implied that a lot of fans are losers that live a boring and meaningless life, it was not a great human moment. Can you imagine a genuinely humble superstar saying something like that? A Roger Federer? A Tim Duncan? Because I sure can't, and don't tell me it was only a moment after a losing final series.

In my opinion, those moments tell you a whole lot more about a star than how much they give to charities, or what they say in a newspaper piece, where they edit the crap out of the content, making them look better and more intelligent. I have tremendous respect for Lebron as a player and businessman, but he is not a great role model, period. And in order to truly become a well-respected public figure, I think you need to check that box too. Anyway, feel free to disagree with me, and again, he is a walking success story, no one can deny that.
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Re: OT: LeBron as a Public Figure 

Post#86 » by DievsZingis » Fri Feb 17, 2017 2:33 pm

ItsThatEasy wrote:LeBron is looking more and more like some unholy combination of Michael Jordan level greatness and Magic Johnson level off the court success.

The guy is undeniably one of the best players to ever touch a basketball but his moves off the court are really unprecedented.

He took his childhood friends and made them businessmen (no posse comments please).

They had some bumps and bruises along the way (The Decision was their idea) but as of now the things LeBron is doing are truly amazing:

Lifetime Nike Deal worth $1 Billion
Received $30 Million from investing in the Beats/Apple deal.
Producer of Survivors Remorse, now in its 4th season on Starz
Producer of Cleveland Hustles, picked up CNBC
Producing an HBO documentary about Muhammad Ali
Currently developing a film with New Line Cinema about a guy pretending to be an NBA draft pick
Owner of Uninterrupted, a company he signs other athletes to, even his rival Draymond Green
Minority shareholder of Liverpool (Only active pro athlete to do so)
Actively speaks on social issues and does not shy away from controversial issues
Has been a model citizen off the court throughout his entire career

Somehow someway I'm more excited about this guys Post-NBA career than his current quest to catch Jordan on the court.

20 years from now LeBron's finals record will be in the back of people's minds, he's truly a mogul and I just think it's cool to watch it happen.


His I Promise campaign will be the legacy he leaves behind, though. He's helping educate children who would otherwise become a statistic, and changing not just their lives, but generations to come. And it seems genuine, it's not like he's serving turkey dinners on Thanksgiving and calling it giving back.
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Re: OT: LeBron as a Public Figure 

Post#87 » by DievsZingis » Fri Feb 17, 2017 3:25 pm

shawn_hemp wrote:You can do a thousand things right for some people, and they will only focus on the one thing you didn't do.

Seriously, what do black people have to complain about in the United States in 2017?


I think you meant "you can do a thousand things wrong for some people, and they won't focus on the one thing you did right".

You might think black people have no right to complain about things now, but lets not pretend like they were just dropped off in this country 53 years ago.

Where are the black people that have generational wealth? Empires? Land? Property? Educational institutions? Things they can pass on from generation to generation? They weren't afforded this opportunity, it was taken away from them, they are behind, even though they landed in this country hundreds of years ago. And here you are discrediting a guy who is empowering the children of his generation, being a great example to them as to how to conduct yourself (*disclaimer-off the court :lol: :wink: ), a person whose people weren't allowed to drink the same water as you just five decades ago.

Check out this article, about Cornell, who has a 6 billion endowment, receiving 150 million dollars from an individual. The last time a historically black university received a large gift was 20 years ago from Bill Cosby for 20 million.

http://www.nydailynews.com/opinion/colleges-rich-richer-black-colleges-lack-article-1.2974916

There is a lot of talk about restitution. But it doesn't have to come in the form of a handout. How about the right to the same education that white people can afford, that wouldn't be so hard, would it? As a matter of fact, if that is the only one major thing you could do to help them, it would go a long way.

But no, white citizens changed school zones after segregation ended so the black kids wouldn't end up at their schools. It was the start of the "ghetto education" we see today. There's racial oppression, like there was in the days of slavery and segregation, then when laws are passed, there is systematic oppression to keep it going. It's how the school to jail pipeline comes to life, it's created, it didn't just happen. This is why it's so absurd when people cross their arms and say "well, **** ain't so bad now, though".


A good book to read is Tears We Cannot Stop: A Sermon to White America by Michael Eric Dyson.

There's more to things than what you just see in front of you. Hope you check them out, even if you don't agree. If you have something to share that would strengthen your argument, feel free to share, because even in disagreement, it's ok to understand where others are coming from. Cheers.
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Re: OT: LeBron as a Public Figure 

Post#88 » by Biggie Smalls » Fri Feb 17, 2017 4:59 pm

LeBron_da_Don wrote:
Biggie Smalls wrote:Wow...a guy thats been acting like a child in the media just two weeks ago, complaining about his teammates coming off a championship run is character wise being compared to Ali now....im done with realgm for today.


What do you actually know about Muhammad Ali? The brash, flamboyant, arrogant, iconoclastic, anti-patriot (not my sentiments but the narrative surrounding him at the height of his legend) or the freedom fighting, civil right pioneer who suffered from Parkinson's (the narrative from his later years).

You might as well change your handle from Biggie Smalls to Marky Mark.


I know he wasn´t crying to the media like an insecure kid. He loved being the underdog. And by the way, looking up to someone you like is cool. But the height it has reached with you seems unhealthy......lebron is cool, but so are you bro. Be you. Be proud of you. You can be great aswell at what you do. I know this is going to sound crazy to you but hes just a man with two legs, two arms and two eyes, just like you and i. Being a fan is okay but stop this senseless riding like theres no tomorrow....
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Re: OT: LeBron as a Public Figure 

Post#89 » by shukle » Fri Feb 17, 2017 5:32 pm

All I know is someday, Lebron is going to retire. Someday soon, the NBA season will start and LBJ won't be playing. That day, all the haters will realize how much more entertaining the NBA was because of him. He's the face of the game and has been for almost 10 years. Jealousy and fatigue settles in and hatred spreads... But the day he retires will be a sad day for the NBA.
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Re: OT: LeBron as a Public Figure 

Post#90 » by LeBron_da_Don » Fri Feb 17, 2017 5:43 pm

Biggie Smalls wrote:
LeBron_da_Don wrote:
Biggie Smalls wrote:Wow...a guy thats been acting like a child in the media just two weeks ago, complaining about his teammates coming off a championship run is character wise being compared to Ali now....im done with realgm for today.


What do you actually know about Muhammad Ali? The brash, flamboyant, arrogant, iconoclastic, anti-patriot (not my sentiments but the narrative surrounding him at the height of his legend) or the freedom fighting, civil right pioneer who suffered from Parkinson's (the narrative from his later years).

You might as well change your handle from Biggie Smalls to Marky Mark.


I know he wasn´t crying to the media like an insecure kid. He loved being the underdog. And by the way, looking up to someone you like is cool. But the height it has reached with you seems unhealthy......lebron is cool, but so are you bro. Be you. Be proud of you. You can be great aswell at what you do. I know this is going to sound crazy to you but hes just a man with two legs, two arms and two eyes, just like you and i. Being a fan is okay but stop this senseless riding like theres no tomorrow....


Sounds great. Now lets backtrack to what you actually know about Muhammad Ali and activism.
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Re: OT: LeBron as a Public Figure 

Post#91 » by bmurph128 » Fri Feb 17, 2017 5:54 pm

Johnny Firpo wrote:Those are all great accomplishments, no doubt, but me personally, like to pay attention to the little details, when someone's true character comes out. And in that regard, Lebron is definitely not an all-time great. When he implied that a lot of fans are losers that live a boring and meaningless life, it was not a great human moment. Can you imagine a genuinely humble superstar saying something like that? A Roger Federer? A Tim Duncan? Because I sure can't, and don't tell me it was only a moment after a losing final series.

In my opinion, those moments tell you a whole lot more about a star than how much they give to charities, or what they say in a newspaper piece, where they edit the crap out of the content, making them look better and more intelligent. I have tremendous respect for Lebron as a player and businessman, but he is not a great role model, period. And in order to truly become a well-respected public figure, I think you need to check that box too. Anyway, feel free to disagree with me, and again, he is a walking success story, no one can deny that.



Yea, I'm going to disagree. This is only my personal preference, but when you start talking about "little details", it gets dicey for me. I'll just throw out some random examples off the top of my head:

MJ - just as rude at times as LBJ, gambling, and divorced his wife after having kids

Kobe - rape case which actually didn't bother me as much as it did that we all accepted plainly that he cheated on his wife - that it was so public....yikes. Not a guy I want my kids looking up to

Duncan - for all the talk about him, guy got divorced - having kids. This is probably just my personal preference, because divorce has become disturbingly normalized today, but IMO there's not much worse you can do than subjecting your children to a broken family. Definitely not a good role model by the same standards you hold to LBJ.

Tiger - obvious

Lance Armstrong - obvious

These are guys that he was often compared to, either in basketball or being all time greats at their peak. And the worst thing LeBron has ever done is...............a comment he made about fans.


And on top of all that, I'm pretty sure LeBron came from a worse place than any of these guys - and yet he's been a better person all around than all of them. This shows the bias some people have toward LeBron IMO.
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Re: RE: Re: OT: LeBron as a Public Figure 

Post#92 » by Clay Davis » Fri Feb 17, 2017 6:44 pm

bmurph128 wrote:
Johnny Firpo wrote:Those are all great accomplishments, no doubt, but me personally, like to pay attention to the little details, when someone's true character comes out. And in that regard, Lebron is definitely not an all-time great. When he implied that a lot of fans are losers that live a boring and meaningless life, it was not a great human moment. Can you imagine a genuinely humble superstar saying something like that? A Roger Federer? A Tim Duncan? Because I sure can't, and don't tell me it was only a moment after a losing final series.

In my opinion, those moments tell you a whole lot more about a star than how much they give to charities, or what they say in a newspaper piece, where they edit the crap out of the content, making them look better and more intelligent. I have tremendous respect for Lebron as a player and businessman, but he is not a great role model, period. And in order to truly become a well-respected public figure, I think you need to check that box too. Anyway, feel free to disagree with me, and again, he is a walking success story, no one can deny that.



Yea, I'm going to disagree. This is only my personal preference, but when you start talking about "little details", it gets dicey for me. I'll just throw out some random examples off the top of my head:

MJ - just as rude at times as LBJ, gambling, and divorced his wife after having kids

Kobe - rape case which actually didn't bother me as much as it did that we all accepted plainly that he cheated on his wife - that it was so public....yikes. Not a guy I want my kids looking up to

Duncan - for all the talk about him, guy got divorced - having kids. This is probably just my personal preference, because divorce has become disturbingly normalized today, but IMO there's not much worse you can do than subjecting your children to a broken family. Definitely not a good role model by the same standards you hold to LBJ.

Tiger - obvious

Lance Armstrong - obvious

These are guys that he was often compared to, either in basketball or being all time greats at their peak. And the worst thing LeBron has ever done is...............a comment he made about fans.


And on top of all that, I'm pretty sure LeBron came from a worse place than any of these guys - and yet he's been a better person all around than all of them. This shows the bias some people have toward LeBron IMO.

I don't think that divorce is such a huge deal. Imagine getting twice the Christmas presents and both of your parents are filthy rich
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Re: OT: LeBron as a Public Figure 

Post#93 » by TheOUTLAW » Fri Feb 17, 2017 7:01 pm

shawn_hemp wrote:LeBron hit the genetic jackpot though

I don't like how he feels the need to be more than a basketball player.

But I also don't see athletes as role models because you don't know them on a personal level.


Every single professional athlete has won the genetic lottery. How is this something to dislike someone for.
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Re: OT: LeBron as a Public Figure 

Post#94 » by Johnny Firpo » Fri Feb 17, 2017 7:04 pm

bmurph128 wrote:Yea, I'm going to disagree. This is only my personal preference, but when you start talking about "little details", it gets dicey for me. I'll just throw out some random examples off the top of my head:

MJ - just as rude at times as LBJ, gambling, and divorced his wife after having kids

Kobe - rape case which actually didn't bother me as much as it did that we all accepted plainly that he cheated on his wife - that it was so public....yikes. Not a guy I want my kids looking up to

Duncan - for all the talk about him, guy got divorced - having kids. This is probably just my personal preference, because divorce has become disturbingly normalized today, but IMO there's not much worse you can do than subjecting your children to a broken family. Definitely not a good role model by the same standards you hold to LBJ.

Tiger - obvious

Lance Armstrong - obvious

These are guys that he was often compared to, either in basketball or being all time greats at their peak. And the worst thing LeBron has ever done is...............a comment he made about fans.


And on top of all that, I'm pretty sure LeBron came from a worse place than any of these guys - and yet he's been a better person all around than all of them. This shows the bias some people have toward LeBron IMO.


I feel like you gave me a strawman argument. I never said he is the worst, or that the names you mentioned are exemplary guys. You mentioned Duncan, I don't agree that divorcing your wife is a crime. Not even a little. There could have been influencing factors that might have been bad, but we know nothing about them. Otherwise I agree, those athletes are flawed, no doubt. MJ is clearly a POS, I mean if the "can I screw your wife?" story is the only thing you know about him, you can already confirm that he is a POS. But again, I didn't argue otherwise. I mentioned two examples, Roger Federer, and Tim Duncan.
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Re: OT: LeBron as a Public Figure 

Post#95 » by TheOUTLAW » Fri Feb 17, 2017 8:18 pm

Johnny Firpo wrote:
bmurph128 wrote:Yea, I'm going to disagree. This is only my personal preference, but when you start talking about "little details", it gets dicey for me. I'll just throw out some random examples off the top of my head:

MJ - just as rude at times as LBJ, gambling, and divorced his wife after having kids

Kobe - rape case which actually didn't bother me as much as it did that we all accepted plainly that he cheated on his wife - that it was so public....yikes. Not a guy I want my kids looking up to

Duncan - for all the talk about him, guy got divorced - having kids. This is probably just my personal preference, because divorce has become disturbingly normalized today, but IMO there's not much worse you can do than subjecting your children to a broken family. Definitely not a good role model by the same standards you hold to LBJ.

Tiger - obvious

Lance Armstrong - obvious

These are guys that he was often compared to, either in basketball or being all time greats at their peak. And the worst thing LeBron has ever done is...............a comment he made about fans.


And on top of all that, I'm pretty sure LeBron came from a worse place than any of these guys - and yet he's been a better person all around than all of them. This shows the bias some people have toward LeBron IMO.


I feel like you gave me a strawman argument. I never said he is the worst, or that the names you mentioned are exemplary guys. You mentioned Duncan, I don't agree that divorcing your wife is a crime. Not even a little. There could have been influencing factors that might have been bad, but we know nothing about them. Otherwise I agree, those athletes are flawed, no doubt. MJ is clearly a POS, I mean if the "can I screw your wife?" story is the only thing you know about him, you can already confirm that he is a POS. But again, I didn't argue otherwise. I mentioned two examples, Roger Federer, and Tim Duncan.


IMO, LeBron has been placed under way more scrutiny and pressure than the guys you've mentioned. Does that absolve him of the misstep? No, but it does kind of explain it.
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Re: OT: LeBron as a Public Figure 

Post#96 » by fourtyounce48 » Sat Feb 18, 2017 5:45 am

ItsThatEasy wrote:
Manute Lol wrote:
ItsThatEasy wrote:Funny how people said the same about Ali during his career and now he's viewed as a national hero.

Bringing visibility to social injustice has no downside.

It did for Ali, who went to prison for his beliefs. Comparing LeBron to Ali just shows your lack of historical perspective. LeBron's desultory comments on social issues are less than insignificant compared to Ali's.


You can only respond to the climate you're currently in. I have no doubts LeBron would do the same had he been a prominent athlete during Ali's era.


Are you kidding me? This is the same guy who wouldn't sign his teamates petition protesting the genocide is Darfur because he didn't want to risk alienating the Chinese market.
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