Dream Team vs All-Time World Team

colts18 · Post #1 » by **colts18** » Mon Sep 15, 2014 2:39 am

All of the players in the World team are in their prime.

Nash/Parker
Ginobili/Petrovic
Peja/Schrempf/Kirilenko
Dirk/Gasol
Hakeem/Yao/Mutombo

BlackIce · Post #2 » by **BlackIce** » Mon Sep 15, 2014 3:11 am

I don't have time to write a detailed post (might go back though) but the Dream team wins due to the lack of perimeter defense (relative to competition) on the All World Team. SG is solid enough but MJ is a load and given how much penetration that Hakeem/Yao/Gasol/Dirk would have to help on foul trouble would become an issue. I think the World team fits better offensively though.

RebelWithACause · Post #3 » by **RebelWithACause** » Mon Sep 15, 2014 3:32 am

I love the maekup of Team World. 4 guys in your starting lineupt that shoot the 3 ball around 40 %, with Nash orchestrating the offense and Hakeem anchoring your defense?! Unstoppable
I would prefer Sabonis as the backup to Yao though, Mutombo as well.

Team World would beat the Dream Team by a sizeable margin.

ardee · Post #4 » by **ardee** » Mon Sep 15, 2014 3:46 am

RebelWithACause wrote:I love the maekup of Team World. 4 guys in your starting lineupt that shoot the 3 ball around 40 %, with Nash orchestrating the offense and Hakeem anchoring your defense?! Unstoppable
I would prefer Sabonis as the backup to Yao though, Mutombo as well.

Team World would beat the Dream Team by a sizeable margin.

RebelWithACause · Post #5 » by **RebelWithACause** » Mon Sep 15, 2014 3:51 am

ardee wrote:
RebelWithACause wrote:I love the maekup of Team World. 4 guys in your starting lineupt that shoot the 3 ball around 40 %, with Nash orchestrating the offense and Hakeem anchoring your defense?! Unstoppable
I would prefer Sabonis as the backup to Yao though, Mutombo as well.

Team World would beat the Dream Team by a sizeable margin.

Oh thanks for that reasonable post.
The difference being that all of the players on the World team are in their prime, while the Dream Team has guys like Magic or Bird who are way past it. Under current rules the Dream Team also could have a lot of trouble spacing the floor.

ardee · Post #6 » by **ardee** » Mon Sep 15, 2014 3:59 am

RebelWithACause wrote:
ardee wrote:
RebelWithACause wrote:I love the maekup of Team World. 4 guys in your starting lineupt that shoot the 3 ball around 40 %, with Nash orchestrating the offense and Hakeem anchoring your defense?! Unstoppable
I would prefer Sabonis as the backup to Yao though, Mutombo as well.

Team World would beat the Dream Team by a sizeable margin.

Oh thanks for that reasonable post.
The difference being that all of the players on the World team are in their prime, while the Dream Team has guys like Magic or Bird who are way past it. Under current rules the Dream Team also could have a lot of trouble spacing the floor.

Magic was still one of the better players on the team and Nash has no chance of guarding him.

Jordan, Pippen, who's guarding these guys? Or better yet, is Hakeem going to handle Chuck, Robinson, Malone AND Ewing? He needs to protect the rim, not guard these guys one or one. Either way he'll get into a ton of foul trouble trying to hold down the fort.

The All World team has no perimeter defense whatsoever.

Jaivl · Post #7 » by **Jaivl** » Mon Sep 15, 2014 7:40 am

ardee wrote:Jordan, Pippen, who's guarding these guys?

Kirilenko is a perfect choice to Pippen, but well, I wouldn't be very worried about him. And who's gonna guard Dirk and Hakeem at the same time... with +40% 3P shooters all around them?

ardee · Post #8 » by **ardee** » Mon Sep 15, 2014 7:49 am

Jaivl wrote:
ardee wrote:Jordan, Pippen, who's guarding these guys?

Kirilenko is a perfect choice to Pippen, but well, I wouldn't be very worried about him. And who's gonna guard Dirk and Hakeem at the same time... with +40% 3P shooters all around them?

Hakeem will have Malone, Ewing and Robinson taking turns on him. Pippen and Malone take turns on Dirk. Anyway the individual matchups don't matter it's the team defense. The Dream Team was athletic enough to rotate to the shooters as was necessary. Watch some tape. They wouldn't have moments like a 46-1 run without picture perfect defense. Guys like Peja anyway will only flourish if the initial penetration is made. In a zone with Ewing/Robinson defending the paint? Forget it.

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Darren_Errman · Post #9 » by **Darren_Errman** » Mon Sep 15, 2014 8:38 am

Hard to imagine MJ letting his team lose.

lukekarts · Post #10 » by **lukekarts** » Mon Sep 15, 2014 10:52 am

ardee wrote:
RebelWithACause wrote:
ardee wrote:

Oh thanks for that reasonable post.
The difference being that all of the players on the World team are in their prime, while the Dream Team has guys like Magic or Bird who are way past it. Under current rules the Dream Team also could have a lot of trouble spacing the floor.

Magic was still one of the better players on the team and Nash has no chance of guarding him.

Jordan, Pippen, who's guarding these guys? Or better yet, is Hakeem going to handle Chuck, Robinson, Malone AND Ewing? He needs to protect the rim, not guard these guys one or one. Either way he'll get into a ton of foul trouble trying to hold down the fort.

The All World team has no perimeter defense whatsoever.

Can't you just reverse the argument. How are the likes of Robinson, Ewing, Malone and Chuck going to handle Dirk, Hakeem, even Gasol and Yao. There's enough offensive skill on the World Team (especially given the crazy spacing) that's gonna cause exactly the same problems for the Dream Team. The exact same principles apply to both teams, they're all going to have to defend more cautiously to avoid foul trouble.

Secondly, I don't agree that there's no perimeter defence on Team World. Manu was no slouch and will be taking the majority of SG minutes. I'd expect Kirilenko to get a lot of minutes too if perimeter D was a problem.

Again, the legitimate question arises - you've got a Nash/Manu/Peja/Dirk/Hakeem offense running at Team USA, that is going to be absolutely lethal. On paper, they're more efficient in their peaks.

Offensively, team World have 4 of the 6 most efficient scorers in this matchup.

Under FIBA rules, I'd say Team World handily.

Under NBA rules, exceptionally close and maybe too close to call.

RebelWithACause · Post #11 » by **RebelWithACause** » Mon Sep 15, 2014 12:40 pm

ardee wrote:
RebelWithACause wrote:
ardee wrote:

Oh thanks for that reasonable post.
The difference being that all of the players on the World team are in their prime, while the Dream Team has guys like Magic or Bird who are way past it. Under current rules the Dream Team also could have a lot of trouble spacing the floor.

Magic was still one of the better players on the team and Nash has no chance of guarding him.

Jordan, Pippen, who's guarding these guys? Or better yet, is Hakeem going to handle Chuck, Robinson, Malone AND Ewing? He needs to protect the rim, not guard these guys one or one. Either way he'll get into a ton of foul trouble trying to hold down the fort.

The All World team has no perimeter defense whatsoever.

Think about it, it goes both ways, how is Magic gonna chase Nash or Parker around the screens. Hint: He cannot.

Pippen is not that potent as a scorer that you especially need a lockdown guy to contain him. Honestly?

Besides, Manu and Kirilenko are both very good to elite defenders on the perimeter.

You make it sound like we are playing Dream Team on offense against World Team on defense. The mismatches on the other side are just as great.

If World Team has a good shooting night, the Dream Team can pack it in.

Joao Saraiva · Post #12 » by **Joao Saraiva** » Mon Sep 15, 2014 1:02 pm

I go with the world team. Spacing is really important for me and one if not the most important concept of the game today.

The dream team was great, but team world seem ideal to me in terms of spacing.

I don't know what ardee is talking about with Hakeem taking turns on Ewing and Robinson and Malone, etc. Is Dirk on vacation on D? Are there no backup great C's in the World team? No, they're not taking turns like you're suggesting.

As crazy as it seems I believe they can outscore the dream team. No team is really stopping the other.

RightToCensor · Post #13 » by **RightToCensor** » Mon Sep 15, 2014 1:29 pm

Dream Team gets overrated so much.

Post Prime Magic
Post Prime Bird
Pre Prime Pippen
Scrub Christian Laettnar

That leaves..

Stockton
Jordan-Drexler
Barkley-Mullen
Malone
Robinson-Ewing

to be effective.

Any team with PG play and floor spacing has a chance of beating them. Playing defense against them is just like Slovenia, prevent the drive and pick-and-rolls.

colts18 · Post #14 » by **colts18** » Mon Sep 15, 2014 3:31 pm

For those who are taking the Dream Team, Do you think the 2012 Olympic team could beat the All-Time World Team?

CP3/Westbrook/Williams
Kobe/Harden
LeBron/Durant/Iguodala
Love/Melo
Chandler/Davis

Darren_Errman · Post #15 » by **Darren_Errman** » Mon Sep 15, 2014 6:24 pm

colts18 wrote:For those who are taking the Dream Team, Do you think the 2012 Olympic team could beat the All-Time World Team?

CP3/Westbrook/Williams
Kobe/Harden
LeBron/Durant/Iguodala
Love/Melo
Chandler/Davis

To be honest, that 2012 team didn't fit great despite stars everywhere. And it showed on the court. Too many redundant overlapping skills. They'd probably lose to the 2014 USA squad.

I always felt like this 2014 squad was very underrated even before they crushed the tournament. The floor spacing and fit were fantastic IMO. You have arguably the top 2 ball handlers in the NBA (Kyrie, Curry), the best foul-drawer (Harden), arguably the best 3-and-D guy (Klay), best energy guy (Faried), versatile MPV-talent Davis, most gifted scoring center (Cousins), GOAT-level shooters with the Splash Bros. They could score inside and out and the floor spacing is second to none. They moved the ball (led the tournament in assists) and pushed the pace relentlessly. If you look at the 2008 and 2012 squads, despite the star studded rosters, the floor spacing wasn't as good and they failed to force their pace on the opponents. I remember some of those games vividly. The ball movement was really awkward at times and guys waited for their turn to pound the rock. The ball died in someone's hand for 4, 5 seconds at a time. Too many first-option guys and only one ball. The Spurs wouldn't be as good as they are if Duncan, Manu, Parker, and Kawhi all play like they're first option.

Sagittaron · Post #16 » by **Sagittaron** » Mon Sep 15, 2014 8:05 pm

colts18 wrote:All of the players in the World team are in their prime.

Nash/Parker
Ginobili/Petrovic
Peja/Schrempf/Kirilenko
Dirk/Gasol
Hakeem/Yao/Mutombo

I would only keep one of Nash / Parker and Yao / Mutombo and add Diamantidis and Sabonis to team world. This way I will have two lockdown perimeter defenders (Diamantidis, Kirilenko). Diamantidis also has no problem playing off the ball which would allow Ginobili to play alongside him and handle the ball and Sabonis is way better offensively than Mutombo

I don't think Team World will beat the Dream Team in a 7 game series because of I have trouble picking a team this talent with prime Michael Jordan to lost in a series. In a knock out match everything is possible though