Which versions of Kobe are better than '16 Kawhi?

[G35]

Kobe would have never been on a super team with the way he plays. He had so many opportunities with good/great teams and none of them were close to sniffing 10 SRS. I don't know why some people are so dismissive of Kobe's weaknesses.

This comment makes no sense.

So Kobe's teams did not sniff a 10 SRS, which who really cares about anyway? What does a high SRS say about a team? Not one Celtic team from the 60's had an SRS over 9, and many of them were in the 4-7 range. During Tim Duncan's prime none of those Spurs teams came close to a 10 SRS....so does that make Kawhi better than Tim? None of those Laker/Celtics teams of the 80's approached an SRS of 10 either.

Kareem's 1971 Bucks have the all time best SRS at 11.91 which is over a full point better than this year's Warriors...so what does that mean? Then half the time the team leading in SRS does not even win the title. And (OMG...this is horrible news) but Lebron has never had a team whose SRS is over 9...and only once has his team been over 8...and we ABSOLUTELY CANNOT attribute SRS to talent because that Lebron-led team was the 2009 Cavaliers and we all know that team had zero talent outside of Lebron. Then of course we cannot make excuses for teams because injuries right? Because then we would have to admit that Shaq (another guy whose teams did not have an SRS of 10) was injured nearly every year that he and Kobe were together.

What I don't understand about the poor analysis of people on the PC board is they take a number as gospel. SRS is suppose to really mean something? Because if that is the case there is no way OKC-SAS should be tied 2-2 right now......

[ils411]

All versions of Kobe in between rookie Kobe and old man kobe because he's "Kobe".

Actually, scratch that... Kobe >>>> Pippen and there is no clear cut argument that can be made that Kawhi is better than Pippen...

so yeah.. you people can bring up analytics and shyet all day long but at the end of the day, Kawhi would get eaten alive if he were to go up against Kobe.

[Ballerhogger]

I think it depends on what kind of team they would play for. In a vacuum, I'd say '01, '03, '06-'09 Kobe is a little bit better than current Kawhi, but it's close, and if you want to build a balanced offensive team like the Spurs (or Hawks, for instance), Kawhi is a better choice.

In general, I would choose Kobe as #1 option and Kawhi as #2 option.

If peak Kobe is 95/100, then Kawhi is like 92 or 93. Not a big gap at all.

actually the hawks would be better with kobe since he brings the offense and star power they sorely need. Offensively khawi isn't there yet

[Ballerhogger]

I think it depends on what kind of team they would play for. In a vacuum, I'd say '01, '03, '06-'09 Kobe is a little bit better than current Kawhi, but it's close, and if you want to build a balanced offensive team like the Spurs (or Hawks, for instance), Kawhi is a better choice.

In general, I would choose Kobe as #1 option and Kawhi as #2 option.

If peak Kobe is 95/100, then Kawhi is like 92 or 93. Not a big gap at all.

actually the hawks would be better with kobe since he brings the offense and star power they sorely need. Offensively khawi isn't there yet

[Asianiac_24]

actually the hawks would be better with kobe since he brings the offense and star power they sorely need. Offensively khawi isn't there yet

Yeah, with Kobe replacing their starting SG (Korver?), LeBron and Kobe would be taking turns to the Finals every single year.

[2klegend]

Kawhi is not even better than Pip, let alone Kobe. But I give Kawhi a lot of credit for playing to his strength with the Spurs system. Not a lot of guys can maximize their potential playing under the right system. He takes full advantage of it.

I don't know, I think you could argue he's also constrained by the Spurs system too.

If Kawhi was unleashed on a much poorer team, he might put up even more gaudy stats if a team convinced him to take on that role, though of course his impact might not necessarily be as high. It would nonetheless raise the profile of his capability and talent.

I don't know about that. If Kawhi forced to handle the ball more and create plays for himself and his teammate, he won't likely be efficient. Beside his arsenals of skills are pretty limited to average 30ppg on high efficiency..He needs to work a lot more on handle and playmaking to be compare with Kobe offensively.

[E-Balla]

I'm not sure any version of Kobe was better than current Kawhi.

Sent from my Nexus 6 using Tapatalk

The disrespect is real.

'01, '03, '06, '07, '08 and '09 is my answer.

I'd say 2010 too. Weird no one is mentioning that year in here. He might've rested until the postseason but in the playoffs he was as good as in 08 and 09.

[HeartBreakKid]

Kawhi is not even better than Pip, let alone Kobe. But I give Kawhi a lot of credit for playing to his strength with the Spurs system. Not a lot of guys can maximize their potential playing under the right system. He takes full advantage of it.

I don't know, I think you could argue he's also constrained by the Spurs system too.

If Kawhi was unleashed on a much poorer team, he might put up even more gaudy stats if a team convinced him to take on that role, though of course his impact might not necessarily be as high. It would nonetheless raise the profile of his capability and talent.

I don't know about that. If Kawhi forced to handle the ball more and create plays for himself and his teammate, he won't likely be efficient. Beside his arsenals of skills are pretty limited to average 30ppg on high efficiency..He needs to work a lot more on handle and playmaking to be compare with Kobe offensively.

Limited arsenal of moves? Leonard has so many moves, there's hardly any thing he can't do scoring wise.

[Laimbeer]

Kobe was a lead perimeter player, far more impactful on the offensive end than Kawhi. And his defense was elite, like Kawhi's. Any close-to-prime version of Kobe is better.

[Alphabet]

I'm not sure any version of Kobe was better than current Kawhi.

Sent from my Nexus 6 using Tapatalk

The disrespect is real.

'01, '03, '06, '07, '08 and '09 is my answer.

I'd say 2010 too. Weird no one is mentioning that year in here. He might've rested until the postseason but in the playoffs he was as good as in 08 and 09.

2010 definitely has an argument here too, though not sure if I would put that season over 2016 Kawhi. I'd say it's probably a tie.

Prior to playing the Celtics in both postseasons, Kobe averaged 31.9 PPG, 6.1 RPG, 5.8 APG, 1.3 SPG, and 0.5 BPG on .509 FG% (.605 TS%) in 2008 and 29.4 PPG, 5.1 RPG, 6.2 APG, 1.0 SPG, and 0.7 BPG on .483 FG% (.586 TS%) in 2010. So playing the Celtics, who were one of the most dominant defensive teams in the modern era, really hurt his playoff averages and what otherwise would have been a dominant playoff run. Keep in mind that this Boston team also severely limited LeBron James in those two seasons.

[soxfan2003]

Factoring in the importance of defense and even acknowledging you Kobe was a very good defender, I don't think Kobe has had a season better or probably as good as this years Leonard.

But this isn't meant to be a disrespect to Kobe since Leonard would have been a very good MVP selection in a normal year.

I do think Kobe has had several years better than Leonard's next best year. For a long time -- since his rookie year -- I've really liked Leonard. I wasn't really that surprised with anything he did until this year.

With Leonard, there is the serious question of whether he can keep up this hot 3 point shooting.

[microfib4thewin]

Kobe would have never been on a super team with the way he plays. He had so many opportunities with good/great teams and none of them were close to sniffing 10 SRS. I don't know why some people are so dismissive of Kobe's weaknesses.

Do you live in a parallel universe where teams success is measured by SRS and not by championships?

Everyone has their own standards of team success, and not all championship teams are created equal. A low SRS team that won a title in one season is very likely to be weaker than another title team with a higher SRS. Low SRS teams can win titles with a greater amount of luck.

So Kobe's teams did not sniff a 10 SRS, which who really cares about anyway? What does a high SRS say about a team? Not one Celtic team from the 60's had an SRS over 9, and many of them were in the 4-7 range. During Tim Duncan's prime none of those Spurs teams came close to a 10 SRS....so does that make Kawhi better than Tim? None of those Laker/Celtics teams of the 80's approached an SRS of 10 either.

The SRS argument is about how we cannot directly compare Kobe and Kawhi's numbers. It is harder to produce individually impressive numbers on a team that functions at a higher level. It is no surprise that Kobe's best RS numbers are on teams with low SRS(03, 06, 07). If Kawhi is on a worse team his numbers are going to look better.

[ATTL]

I never thought I'd see the day when Kobe would be underrated.

[Montavious Bart]

Every heathy version of Kobe is better.

Kawhi is the product of a great system, and I'm not convinced that he is anything more than a solid role player without Pop and Co.

Glorified Demarre Carroll.

[Arman_tanzarian]

Prime Kobe is much better than leonard.

[BullBearBidness]

(spo)Some guys are crying...(/spo)

[deezerweeze]

Yep. Clearly better than Bryant ever was.

[2klegend]

The thread ends today.

[carlquincy]

SRS is king.

Spurs/Kawhi are just unlucky

[GSP]

01, 03, 06-10

I think 16 Kawhi is a very similar player in impact to 94 Pippen (of course the shooting and nonplaymaking/passing version). Great all around player but not better than Kobes best.