2017 Golden State Warriors Thread

[Soca]

That's because they haven't improved on defense. Cavs have had a problem all season sustaining leads including the Pacers series because of their defense. Lebron having to play 40+ plus minutes in every game against the Pacers is also not a good look. That's way too many minutes Lebron is playing against an average at best Pacers team in the first round.

Have you watched the second half of Game 3 and Game 4? The Cavs have switched the defensive flip on and had a pretty elite Defense since Game 3 halftime.
Sure dismiss it because its such a small sample size but its just not true they did not improve. They did massivly improve the last 2 games.

But go on put huge stock in the Regular Season... Everybody crowned GSW last year long before the Finals.. i was laughed at because i warned people "wait till the actual games are played..alot can and will happen we cant predict" .. remember how that turned out?

Should I just dismiss they gave up 70+ in the first half game 3 because they played better defense in spurts?

[crazy_me_87]

That's because they haven't improved on defense. Cavs have had a problem all season sustaining leads including the Pacers series because of their defense. Lebron having to play 40+ plus minutes in every game against the Pacers is also not a good look. That's way too many minutes Lebron is playing against an average at best Pacers team in the first round.

Have you watched the second half of Game 3 and Game 4? The Cavs have switched the defensive flip on and had a pretty elite Defense since Game 3 halftime.
Sure dismiss it because its such a small sample size but its just not true they did not improve. They did massivly improve the last 2 games.

But go on put huge stock in the Regular Season... Everybody crowned GSW last year long before the Finals.. i was laughed at because i warned people "wait till the actual games are played..alot can and will happen we cant predict" .. remember how that turned out?

Should I just dismiss they gave up 70+ in the first half game 3 because they played better defense in spurts?

Nope. And if you read my posts carefully you will find i am still pretty cautious about the Cavs defense and if they can play good defense every Game.

I am just saying they improved since that so until proven otherwise(bad defensive Games next Round) i take that as "oh now they are awake on defense"

It could be all out of the window next Round back to bad defense but i dont believe that..could be wrong of course.. but i doubt it.. the defense will be better on effort alone.

[KD35Brah]

Have you watched the second half of Game 3 and Game 4? The Cavs have switched the defensive flip on and had a pretty elite Defense since Game 3 halftime.
Sure dismiss it because its such a small sample size but its just not true they did not improve. They did massivly improve the last 2 games.

But go on put huge stock in the Regular Season... Everybody crowned GSW last year long before the Finals.. i was laughed at because i warned people "wait till the actual games are played..alot can and will happen we cant predict" .. remember how that turned out?

Should I just dismiss they gave up 70+ in the first half game 3 because they played better defense in spurts?

Nope. And if you read my posts carefully you will find i am still pretty cautious about the Cavs defense and if they can play good defense every Game.

I am just saying they improved since that so until proven otherwise(bad defensive Games next Round) i take that as "oh now they are awake on defense"

It could be all out of the window next Round back to bad defense but i dont believe that..could be wrong of course.. but i doubt it.. the defense will be better on effort alone.

Is shutting down the 15th best offense in the league for 2 games really that big of a deal?

[crazy_me_87]

Is shutting down the 15th best offense in the league for 2 games really that big of a deal?

Compared to that they couldnt even shut down some of the worst offenses the last few months.. yeah.. slice it howerer you want it is an improvement on how trash their defense was..

[SFrush]

That's because they haven't improved on defense. Cavs have had a problem all season sustaining leads including the Pacers series because of their defense. Lebron having to play 40+ plus minutes in every game against the Pacers is also not a good look. That's way too many minutes Lebron is playing against an average at best Pacers team in the first round.

Have you watched the second half of Game 3 and Game 4? The Cavs have switched the defensive flip on and had a pretty elite Defense since Game 3 halftime.
Sure dismiss it because its such a small sample size but its just not true they did not improve. They did massivly improve the last 2 games.

But go on put huge stock in the Regular Season... Everybody crowned GSW last year long before the Finals.. i was laughed at because i warned people "wait till the actual games are played..alot can and will happen we cant predict" .. remember how that turned out?

You have to be trolling us. You need way more game than a game and a half to say their defense has improved massively. That's like saying Andre Roberson has become a massively better shooter because he went 3/3 beyond the arc for a half. Yes It's way too small of a sample size.

LeBron having to play over 40 minutes a game just to edge out the Pacers in 4 close games is indeed a giant red flag.

[Heej]

The thing with the Cavs defense vs GS is that when you metagame the matchups I believe that GS' off ball screen high post facilitating style is ill suited for a long knock down drag it out series.

After game 3 or 4 the other team knows what's coming every time. It may look aesthetically easy when you see one of the splash bros break free for an open 3 or curl to the basket but in between those possessions there are 3 or 4 possessions where every action is sniffed out and opponents become physically proactive to blow up the play. This hammering definitely wears down the warriors as a series goes on.

Compare that to the brutish simplistic space it out and iso offense Cavs will run at Steph curry which harder to defend in the long run and saves wear and tear on players.

[SFrush]

The thing with the Cavs defense vs GS is that when you metagame the matchups I believe that GS' off ball screen high post facilitating style is ill suited for a long knock down drag it out series.

After game 3 or 4 the other team knows what's coming every time. It may look aesthetically easy when you see one of the splash bros break free for an open 3 or curl to the basket but in between those possessions there are 3 or 4 possessions where every action is sniffed out and opponents become physically proactive to blow up the play. This hammering definitely wears down the warriors as a series goes on.

Compare that to the brutish simplistic space it out and iso offense Cavs will run at Steph curry which harder to defend in the long run and saves wear and tear on players.

You're basing this off?

[Heej]

The thing with the Cavs defense vs GS is that when you metagame the matchups I believe that GS' off ball screen high post facilitating style is ill suited for a long knock down drag it out series.

After game 3 or 4 the other team knows what's coming every time. It may look aesthetically easy when you see one of the splash bros break free for an open 3 or curl to the basket but in between those possessions there are 3 or 4 possessions where every action is sniffed out and opponents become physically proactive to blow up the play. This hammering definitely wears down the warriors as a series goes on.

Compare that to the brutish simplistic space it out and iso offense Cavs will run at Steph curry which harder to defend in the long run and saves wear and tear on players.

You're basing this off?

My observations and knowing basketball. There's only so many high post splits you're running on a team until they figure out their optimal strategy for defending it (usually just staying attached and being physical).

Need more of a sample size against competition that pushes them to 6 or 7 games to have a better idea of how correct my thoughts are. But it's definitely something I'm watching for.

[SFrush]

The thing with the Cavs defense vs GS is that when you metagame the matchups I believe that GS' off ball screen high post facilitating style is ill suited for a long knock down drag it out series.

After game 3 or 4 the other team knows what's coming every time. It may look aesthetically easy when you see one of the splash bros break free for an open 3 or curl to the basket but in between those possessions there are 3 or 4 possessions where every action is sniffed out and opponents become physically proactive to blow up the play. This hammering definitely wears down the warriors as a series goes on.

Compare that to the brutish simplistic space it out and iso offense Cavs will run at Steph curry which harder to defend in the long run and saves wear and tear on players.

You're basing this off?

My observations and knowing basketball. There's only so many high post splits you're running on a team until they figure out their optimal strategy for defending it (usually just staying attached and being physical).

Need more of a sample size against competition that pushes them to 6 or 7 games to have a better idea of how correct my thoughts are. But it's definitely something I'm watching for.

Maybe last year. Add Durant in the picture and we're way more complex to defend.

[RSCD3_]

I had something typed up earlier but I guess I didn't actually click send.

The main problem with the evaluation of the Cavaliers defense is that there is only so much that can be achieved purely by effort.

LeBron James is but one man and even though he can try harder and still no all the schemes that doesn't mean everyone else will be able to execute even if they are putting more effort in.

The 2001 Lakers we're also 21st in defensive efficiency but they had two players with pretty high defensive ceilings while the Cavaliers only have one.

Sure JR and Thompson are pretty good but they have already been giving effort in the regular season so it's not like there's much more they can provide. Meanwhile Kevin Love is inconsistent and Kyrie Irving while healthy is pretty bad especially off ball. That's not taking into account the rumors that His knee is bothering him.

There's also the players that are new to the team and haven't fully grasped the strategy and they're also not the best defenders already. Lue's style of not having many practices during the regular season also compound this issue.

These are definite issues. While the teams in the Eastern conference may not threaten the Cavs enough to fully expose these issues, these flaws will be more than magnified in the finals likely against the Warriors.




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[SF_Warriors]

With how utterly garbage the Cavs look without Lebron theres a chance these guys go 16-0 TBH

Whats your point when Lebron will play 45 Minutes against GSW anyway and the Cavs have two more Series to get better while GSW might lose its Head Coach, has still no idea when and if KD will be really ready and when they get Livingston and Barnes back?

To be honest right now i think GSW has more question marks than CLE..

The Cavs defense gotten better every Game against the Pacers and if not for an fluke off night on offense would have won Game four 120 - 102 not 106 -102 .. Their defense in Game 4 had a rating of 100.5 wich is pretty good.
The Cavs are healthy and if they can keep improving on defense they will look extremly scary soon..

GSW on the other hand could get into a real dogfight next round with Utah.. Can Mike Brown keep Draymond from totally snapping and getting suspended for the rest of the Playoffs? I dont know what he will do if Utah really pushes GSW around..
Can KD be KD again this Playoffs at all? Will Brown keep playing Zaza way too much instead of Javale?
When does Livingston retourn? They dont have any other real backup Point Guard..

I read in an article today "GSW will be fine without Kerr in the early rounds propably but as the playoffs go on this will become a real Problem.. Kerr most of all has a calming presense but also can light a fire under them.. They can beat Utah,Lac as they are now but against SA,HOU or CLE this will matter alot"

I agree. This is not the sudden end of GSWs Title hopes but people are getting fooled by them still blowing out Portland.. This will become a big factor as the Playoffs roll on. They might overcome it but you cant just dismiss it..

If its utah they will most definitely be in a dog fight. GHill and favors both missed 30+ games each and hood missed 20+
They could easily be a 55+ win team had those guys played closer to 70 games each.

SA who I believe will make the wcf will also be a big challenge if both teams make it that far and then of course there is lebron and co. waiting for the finals

For the warriors, it is not a cakewalk to the finals. Looks like a pretty harsh road especially without kerr

[Heej]

You're basing this off?

My observations and knowing basketball. There's only so many high post splits you're running on a team until they figure out their optimal strategy for defending it (usually just staying attached and being physical).

Need more of a sample size against competition that pushes them to 6 or 7 games to have a better idea of how correct my thoughts are. But it's definitely something I'm watching for.

Maybe last year. Add Durant in the picture and we're way more complex to defend.

Oh absolutely. Once Curry lost his legs and he had no one he could eviscerate on a switch in the PnR the Warriors were pretty much defanged by the end of the series. That's why by Game 7 they regressed into the jump shooting team everyone accused them of being heading into the playoffs.

The game is trending back towards Iso play with all the spacing afforded by the new era of NBA snipers. Durant is the insurance policy the Warriors didn't have last year. I see no conceivable path for defeating the Warriors this year simply because the defense is too stupendous. The only way super teams are beaten are by injuries. Wade's knees were the only reason the Heat didn't coast to a 3peat. Otherwise this team will not be stopped any time soon.

[WestGOAT]

My observations and knowing basketball. There's only so many high post splits you're running on a team until they figure out their optimal strategy for defending it (usually just staying attached and being physical).

Need more of a sample size against competition that pushes them to 6 or 7 games to have a better idea of how correct my thoughts are. But it's definitely something I'm watching for.

Maybe last year. Add Durant in the picture and we're way more complex to defend.

Oh absolutely. Once Curry lost his legs and he had no one he could eviscerate on a switch in the PnR the Warriors were pretty much defanged by the end of the series. That's why by Game 7 they regressed into the jump shooting team everyone accused them of being heading into the playoffs.

The game is trending back towards Iso play with all the spacing afforded by the new era of NBA snipers. Durant is the insurance policy the Warriors didn't have last year. I see no conceivable path for defeating the Warriors this year simply because the defense is too stupendous. The only way super teams are beaten are by injuries. Wade's knees were the only reason the Heat didn't coast to a 3peat. Otherwise this team will not be stopped any time soon.

Great point, never thought about that in such context. With the new defensive rules, i.e lack of "illegal" defense, more soft double teams, it became almost impossible to rely solely on isolation plays like in the MJ, Iverson, Kobe years, especially with a big-man. I still doubt if the iso-game will come back any time soon for big-man, but teams will definitely excel if they have a ball-dominant player and surround them with a bunch of 3&D players, like Harden in Houston, or Westbrook or Giannis in the future if their teams build around them properly. Such is the cyclic nature of the NBA.

[ardee]

Interesting factoid: in Klay's 30 highest game score games, the Warriors are 29-1. 43-3 in the top 46.

[JulesWinnfield]

All the talk about the "easy east", but I swear I've never seen a team so lucky as the warriors the last few years when it comes to playoff injuries. 2015 was a joke of epic proportions where literally everyone they played was hampered as well as potential threats who never even got to play them due to said injuries. And of course it culminated with the biggest break in the finals anyone has ever seen with the Cavs reduced to delly as Brons sidekick. Now this year it's Portland with no nurkic most of the way (he was a game changer for them). Then it's Utah without George hill. Now it's going to be San Antonio with a hampered Kawhi and no Parker, or Houston without nene

They are talented enough as it is. They don't need this endless stream of breaks. But warrior fans have the nerve to cry tears that steph was less than 100% last postseason (but still played, and was highly effective before the finals). This team just has the red carpet rolled out for them time after time in addition to being over the top talent wise. I'm awaiting the inevitable Kyrie or Kevin Love injury now

[Goudelock]

I'm awaiting the inevitable Kyrie or Kevin Love injury now

I never root for injuries...........but watching LeBron turn into a one man army against the most stacked team in NBA history would be amazing to watch (if/when Kyrie and Love get hurt).

[Rust In Peace]

All the talk about the "easy east", but I swear I've never seen a team so lucky as the warriors the last few years when it comes to playoff injuries. 2015 was a joke of epic proportions where literally everyone they played was hampered as well as potential threats who never even got to play them due to said injuries. And of course it culminated with the biggest break in the finals anyone has ever seen with the Cavs reduced to delly as Brons sidekick. Now this year it's Portland with no nurkic most of the way (he was a game changer for them). Then it's Utah without George hill. Now it's going to be San Antonio with a hampered Kawhi and no Parker, or Houston without nene

They are talented enough as it is. They don't need this endless stream of breaks. But warrior fans have the nerve to cry tears that steph was less than 100% last postseason (but still played, and was highly effective before the finals). This team just has the red carpet rolled out for them time after time in addition to being over the top talent wise. I'm awaiting the inevitable Kyrie or Kevin Love injury now

What's funny is that you could combine the Spurs and Rockets rosters and it still wouldn't be competitive enough in a series with Golden State. The combined rosters of the 2nd and 3rd seed being worse than the first seed. Haha.

The current NBA product is unwatchable. The only interesting series has been the Spurs and Rockets who are both built like a traditional team(one all-star on each with a supporting cast of role players). Expecting either to match up against a team USA type roster with four all-stars is mind-boggling. And that's without talking about the injury asterisks.

[clyde21]

All the talk about the "easy east", but I swear I've never seen a team so lucky as the warriors the last few years when it comes to playoff injuries. 2015 was a joke of epic proportions where literally everyone they played was hampered as well as potential threats who never even got to play them due to said injuries. And of course it culminated with the biggest break in the finals anyone has ever seen with the Cavs reduced to delly as Brons sidekick. Now this year it's Portland with no nurkic most of the way (he was a game changer for them). Then it's Utah without George hill. Now it's going to be San Antonio with a hampered Kawhi and no Parker, or Houston without nene

They are talented enough as it is. They don't need this endless stream of breaks. But warrior fans have the nerve to cry tears that steph was less than 100% last postseason (but still played, and was highly effective before the finals). This team just has the red carpet rolled out for them time after time in addition to being over the top talent wise. I'm awaiting the inevitable Kyrie or Kevin Love injury now

Oh God here we go.

[clyde21]

All the talk about the "easy east", but I swear I've never seen a team so lucky as the warriors the last few years when it comes to playoff injuries. 2015 was a joke of epic proportions where literally everyone they played was hampered as well as potential threats who never even got to play them due to said injuries. And of course it culminated with the biggest break in the finals anyone has ever seen with the Cavs reduced to delly as Brons sidekick. Now this year it's Portland with no nurkic most of the way (he was a game changer for them). Then it's Utah without George hill. Now it's going to be San Antonio with a hampered Kawhi and no Parker, or Houston without nene

They are talented enough as it is. They don't need this endless stream of breaks. But warrior fans have the nerve to cry tears that steph was less than 100% last postseason (but still played, and was highly effective before the finals). This team just has the red carpet rolled out for them time after time in addition to being over the top talent wise. I'm awaiting the inevitable Kyrie or Kevin Love injury now

What's funny is that you could combine the Spurs and Rockets rosters and it still wouldn't be competitive enough in a series with Golden State. The combined rosters of the 2nd and 3rd seed being worse than the first seed. Haha.

The current NBA product is unwatchable. The only interesting series has been the Spurs and Rockets who are both built like a traditional team(one all-star on each with a supporting cast of role players). Expecting either to match up against a team USA type roster with four all-stars is mind-boggling. And that's without talking about the injury asterisks.

I don't get it. Should the Warriors apologize for being too good?

[Dr Positivity]

All the talk about the "easy east", but I swear I've never seen a team so lucky as the warriors the last few years when it comes to playoff injuries. 2015 was a joke of epic proportions where literally everyone they played was hampered as well as potential threats who never even got to play them due to said injuries. And of course it culminated with the biggest break in the finals anyone has ever seen with the Cavs reduced to delly as Brons sidekick. Now this year it's Portland with no nurkic most of the way (he was a game changer for them). Then it's Utah without George hill. Now it's going to be San Antonio with a hampered Kawhi and no Parker, or Houston without nene

They are talented enough as it is. They don't need this endless stream of breaks. But warrior fans have the nerve to cry tears that steph was less than 100% last postseason (but still played, and was highly effective before the finals). This team just has the red carpet rolled out for them time after time in addition to being over the top talent wise. I'm awaiting the inevitable Kyrie or Kevin Love injury now

While a lot of this is true, the Warriors probably lost 2016 title because of injury, so it came back to them a little bit. Also Nurkic and Hill being injured doesn't matter that much in terms of GSW luck cause those series were no brainers anyways. Maybe GSW gets through it in 9 games instead of 8 if they're healthy. GSW deserves one of the last two titles, even if you gave Cleveland 16 finals if healthy (GSW is inexperienced, Lebron catches them like he did the Thunder), GSW is very hard to beat in 17 if you made them both healthier and hungrier and probably not as driven by the record in the RS. You can say 2016 Warriors didn't beat anyone to prove they're a champion but 2017 Warriors beating Thunder and getting to coinflip Game 7 with Cavs proved that season was championship level. In the end 1-1 turned out fair for both teams.