Re: Atlanta Hawks Official Trade Ideas Thread
Posted: Tue Nov 13, 2012 6:29 am
Can we come up with a response that we post whenever Gasol to Atlanta is proposed so we can just post it.
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Jajwanda wrote:If it does happen it'll be quite the upset. That said I'm not going to try to convince you of the deal, but it's incorrect to think he wouldn't work next to Horford. They'd be excellent together.
A three-way deal might do it though. Who would Atlanta want for Josh?
parson wrote:Another argument for waiting: if Dwight Howard DOES re-sign with the Lakers, we can easily SNT Smith to them then.
Jajwanda wrote:There's no reason for you take Gasol. However as the playoff hunt emerges I could very well see a team taking on the last year of Pau's deal to have a nice playoff run. Milwaukee, Cleveland, Minnesota, and Houston are not cities that attract FAs very often but they're in the playoff hunt right now.
Monta Ellis?
Al Jefferson?
Jefferson would be a nice fit with Horford as a 4-5, plus he is an expiring so you get to try out the fit to see if it works for you.
ATLHawksfan21 wrote:Jajwanda wrote:There's no reason for you take Gasol. However as the playoff hunt emerges I could very well see a team taking on the last year of Pau's deal to have a nice playoff run. Milwaukee, Cleveland, Minnesota, and Houston are not cities that attract FAs very often but they're in the playoff hunt right now.
Monta Ellis?
Al Jefferson?
Jefferson would be a nice fit with Horford as a 4-5, plus he is an expiring so you get to try out the fit to see if it works for you.
No thanks. Ellis and Jefferson aren't the type of players that will make a team a contender.
MaceCase wrote:I would seriously love to know where I mentioned us taking Pau. I turned Josh into 5 prospects, you know, guys with actual potential unlike 9 year vets.
parson wrote:MaceCase wrote:I would seriously love to know where I mentioned us taking Pau. I turned Josh into 5 prospects, you know, guys with actual potential unlike 9 year vets.
You didn't mention Gasol. I was summarizing the options as I see them. I don't think much of your "5 prospects" idea. It leaves us with 5 talents who are each worse than Smith. Each player is a prospect to - at best - become a starter, not an allstar. 4 PFs and a Center? You're only giving one of the PFs a chance to develop into anything interesting - and I already told you that Aldrich didn't impress OKC. Essentially, you're trading for bench players.
MaceCase wrote:No, you need to set up a basis as for why you consider them "lousy" prospects. The burden of proof is on you. Are they not younger that Josh?
MaceCase wrote:Were they not selected before or right around where Josh was selected in the draft? Is that not a sign of greater than or comparable potential?
MaceCase wrote:In the case of Aldrich and Morris are they not putting up comparable stats in their 3rd and 2nd season than Josh is in his 9th? Doesn't that allow for the discussion of them having further potential to improve from there?
MaceCase wrote:Are they not immensely cheaper than Josh is now and whatever he'll be asking for come next year?
MaceCase wrote:But oh, you consider them lousy.....based on what exactly?
Can I deduce, since you believe I have to be a Josh Smith lover to hold my opinion, that you are the opposite? Isn't it reasonable, that if you insult my intelligence and say my likes determine my opinion, that your hates determine yours?MaceCase wrote: Oh yea, you like Josh is why.
parson wrote:You get so angry whenever people disagree with you. Can't I just disagree without you spewing acid?
"Younger" means they're better prospects than Smith? Does not sound right to me. I would assume there'd be more than just youth involved. Talent, maybe? But you don't seem to be concerned with that. At least, you're not talking about their respective talents.
Absolutely not. Kobe Bryant was drafted 16th overall. Are you saying that your 5 have "greater than or comparable potential"? Draft position means little when different years have different values to the draft classes. There are good draft years and poor draft years. Do they have the talent of Kobe Bryant? Do they have the talent of Josh Smith? Nope.
So please then, if you are going to make the argument of draft years then don't stop. Actually make a point on their individual years and the circumstances surrounding them. You follow such a vague argument with such a definitive statement on talent. Really? What was Josh projected as because I remember clearly him being mentioned as most likely to bust at the moment he was selected.
Are you counting the stats from the time Aldrich spent in the Developmental League? I don't know if I ever saw Smith in the DL.
Josh Smith's 2012 PER: 12.9
Cole Aldrich's 2012 PER: 12.7
Why no mention of the season that stumpy armed Morris is having? What about the direct matchup he had against Smith?
.Inferior players are usually cheaper.
No, this is just an inferior argument. Rookies follow a pay scale bellow that of vets.Can I deduce, since you believe I have to be a Josh Smith lover to hold my opinion, that you are the opposite? Isn't it reasonable, that if you insult my intelligence and say my likes determine my opinion, that your hates determine yours?
As with all of your deductions they are downright terrible. You've reached a definitive stance a dozen times based throughout that goes against all logic, common sense and probability. Someone makes an argument utilizing those things......clear it was born entirely of hate.You can call the 4 PFs 3/4s or 4/5s but they're PFs. That's their best position. That's where they are most likely to develop - and developing is what "prospects" are all about, right? It's not reasonable to talk about their potential if you're not going to play them where they can be best used. You are trading for 4 PFs and one Center. It seems likely to me that at least 3 of the 4 PFs are not going to develop at their best position.
Right, so despite their draft profiles determining them as tweeners (like Josh who for some reason Parson believes can be a SF) you have already made the determination for where they can fit? See what I talk about being a major hypocrite? You don't notice because your homerism blinds you.As for Aldrich, if he cannot beat out Perkins, then he is not a major prospect. Maybe he (as I posted earlier) can grow into a starter at Center but I don't see anything that leads me to think he'll ever be above-average, and that's at best.
You don't see anything that would lead you to positive opinion on Aldrich yet you stand by the most asinine reasons. "Oh, a rookie big man can't get time over a highly paid veteran? Scrub"Morris has "the shortest wingspan of any power forward drafted in the first round according to" the DraftExpress database. That's shortest of all PFs EVER drafted.
So his wingspan is a determinant of his talent now? Explain his season then.Royce White is a mess: poor athlete, too short for PF, waaaay too heavy for SF with a mental disability and a pitiful attitude. The guy's talking about walking away from the NBA. Really, Mace?
Really Parson, my mentioning that he's a throwaway filler in the deal didn't register to you the twice that I said it?Now, Patrick Patterson is a decent prospect. I'll grant that.
MaceCase wrote:parson wrote:You get so angry whenever people disagree with you. Can't I just disagree without you spewing acid?
Don't confuse your own sensitivity with others being emotional.