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Jeff Green rant

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Jeff Green rant 

Post#1 » by airjaw » Sat Jan 19, 2013 6:21 am

Ok, I really don't like Jeff Green, but my hatred for him notwithstanding, what is up with Jeff Green standing in the corner all the time?

Let me describe the typical Jeff Green touch on offense.

Jeff Green in corner.
Jeff Green is passed the ball.
Jeff Green holds it for half a second.
Jeff Green passes the ball back, with no move to the basket, pump fake, or any indication that he is alive.

I'm really struggling to understand what exactly Jeff Green's role is in the offense. He doesn't set picks. He doesn't cut. He doesn't handle the ball. He rarely shoots.

The only times Jeff is involved at all is when he has a favorable matchup. And even then his slow, awkward, clumsy footwork takes away much of any advantage he has. He doesn't have any post moves. He's not a great shooter. He's not faster than his defender most of the time. He looks like a 34-year old Paul Pierce, without the talent or drive.

From what I can see, when Jeff Green is doing his corner 'catch the ball and pass it back' thing, he's actually hurting the offense. He's a non-factor and hurts his team as his passivity loses the team offensive opportunities. Ok, the obvious aside, the baffling thing is why the team allows him to get away with this passive behavior? Why doesn't someone coach him how to play or give him a different role?

Jeff Green currently is not a skilled player. He is athletic and may wow with a dunk every now and then but he doesn't know how to play the game. All signs indicate to him not "getting it". He can't be traded fast enough.

EDIT:: actually I'm not sure if he should be traded now, as his stock is probably at an all-time low. If we're trying to win games he shouldn't be playing though. Maybe he should be sent to the D-League where he can learn how to play. I'm not even joking. He doesn't know how to play basketball. He needs another 1-2 years of learning.
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Re: Jeff Green rant 

Post#2 » by Bad-Thoma » Sat Jan 19, 2013 7:19 am

So he didn't get your all-star vote?
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Re: Jeff Green rant 

Post#3 » by PapaIrish » Sat Jan 19, 2013 7:30 am

I feel like him and Terry are in the same boat. They aren't having any offense run for them and they really don't look sure of what they want to do on offense, most of the time they just end up floating doing nothing. When they do get the ball, they look timid, like someone told them it's not their turn to shoot yet. Overall it's quite frustrating.

One solution I've been hoping Doc would input to make them both more comfortable and help the 2nd units offense in general, is running a pick and role with JT and Green similar to how the Mavs would kill teams using the Dirk and JT pick and role. Would force them into being a part of the offense and increase their comfort level IMO. I think just forcing Green to be a part of the offense would benefit him and the team greatly.

We've seen what Green's capable of doing, I think the challenge now is to find a way to get consistent productivity from him. The only other solution I've really thought about would be to start Green over Pierce, but for SOO many reasons I don't think it will happen or is a plausible solution.
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Re: Jeff Green rant 

Post#4 » by ermocrate » Sat Jan 19, 2013 11:19 am

I'm gonna say this is PMS, all time complaining about Green even when your SStar shot 3/6789 from the field... The top of the creativity and of the BBall nonsense is to claim Jeff mostly standing in the corner is his fault, yes he draws the plays with Doc... :roll:
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Re: Jeff Green rant 

Post#5 » by Rondo2Hondo » Sat Jan 19, 2013 1:05 pm

ermocrate wrote:I'm gonna say this is PMS, all time complaining about Green even when your SStar shot 3/6789 from the field... The top of the creativity and of the BBall nonsense is to claim Jeff mostly standing in the corner is his fault, yes he draws the plays with Doc... :roll:


He needs to step outside of the offense and go ham occasionally. We have such a boring and predictable offense.
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Re: Jeff Green rant 

Post#6 » by ermocrate » Sat Jan 19, 2013 1:26 pm

Rondo2Hondo wrote:
ermocrate wrote:I'm gonna say this is PMS, all time complaining about Green even when your SStar shot 3/6789 from the field... The top of the creativity and of the BBall nonsense is to claim Jeff mostly standing in the corner is his fault, yes he draws the plays with Doc... :roll:


He needs to step outside of the offense and go ham occasionally. We have such a boring and predictable offense.

We have to play more motion offense, especially when Rondo, Lee, Green, Bass and (eventually) Wilcox are on the floor, theese are the guys more damaged from our static offense... When did Green would be one relevant option in the team for the tough shot(Doc has to decide this) then he can start to work on ìhis static 1vs1 DURING THE GAMES...

Sincerely remains a mistery to me the reason why Doc uses uptempo and movement of the ball at this poor rate....
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Re: Jeff Green rant 

Post#7 » by Red2 » Sat Jan 19, 2013 2:09 pm

doc was not happy with green last night. late in the game he yanked him for bass and you could see doc telling green that he was not where he was supposed to be.
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Re: Jeff Green rant 

Post#8 » by ermocrate » Sat Jan 19, 2013 3:13 pm

Red2 wrote:doc was not happy with green last night. late in the game he yanked him for bass and you could see doc telling green that he was not where he was supposed to be.

He got to stop talking and start acting...
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Re: Jeff Green rant 

Post#9 » by Celts17Pride » Sat Jan 19, 2013 3:14 pm

ermocrate wrote:I'm gonna say this is PMS, all time complaining about Green even when your SStar shot 3/6789 from the field... The top of the creativity and of the BBall nonsense is to claim Jeff mostly standing in the corner is his fault, yes he draws the plays with Doc... :roll:


You don't get it. Part of the reason Pierce is playing like crap is because the Celtics have to play him all the time because they have no other option. The whole game plan was for Jeff Green to take the heavy load off of Pierce and gradually replace him in the starting lineup and move Pierce to a 6th man role. Think Avery Bradley and Ray Allen last year. Pierce is 36 years old.

The problem is Jeff Green sucks. People can make all the excuses they want for Green but the bottomline is he is not getting it done. Last night he played 19 minutes with 2 points, 0 rebounds, 0 assists, 0 steals, 0 blocks. Doc Rivers had no choice put to keep playing Pierce. Jeff Green is killing the Celtics in more ways than one.
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Re: Jeff Green rant 

Post#10 » by ermocrate » Sat Jan 19, 2013 3:26 pm

Celts17Pride wrote:
ermocrate wrote:I'm gonna say this is PMS, all time complaining about Green even when your SStar shot 3/6789 from the field... The top of the creativity and of the BBall nonsense is to claim Jeff mostly standing in the corner is his fault, yes he draws the plays with Doc... :roll:


You don't get it. Part of the reason Pierce is playing like crap is because the Celtics have to play him all the time because they have no other option. The whole game plan was for Jeff Green to take the heavy load off of Pierce and gradually replace him in the starting lineup and move Pierce to a 6th man role. Think Avery Bradley and Ray Allen last year. Pierce is 36 years old.

The problem is Jeff Green sucks. People can make all the excuses they want for Green but the bottomline is he is not getting it done. Last night he played 19 minutes with 2 points, 0 rebounds, 0 assists, 0 steals, 0 blocks. Doc Rivers had no choice put to keep playing Pierce. Jeff Green is killing the Celtics in more ways than one.

Green doesn't play like Pierce, he is a different player, but plays for his are nowhere to be seen, nowhere... He has the same role on the team than a 14 minutes sub-par player that has to shot 2-3 jumpers while the SStar starter rests. Green is not that type of player, or you threat him like a co-starter or it's a complete waste of talent. It's not that when you need him he has to be a Star and when you don't need he plays 10 minutes, such players are rare, very rare.
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Re: Jeff Green rant 

Post#11 » by Celts17Pride » Sat Jan 19, 2013 3:34 pm

ermocrate wrote:Green doesn't play like Pierce, he is a different player, but plays for his are nowhere to be seen, nowhere... He has the same role on the team than a 14 minutes sub-par player that has to shot 2-3 jumpers while the SStar starter rests. Green is not that type of player, or you threat him like a co-starter or it's a complete waste of talent. It's not that when you need him he has to be a Star and when you don't need he plays 10 minutes, such players are rare, very rare.


Didn't seem to keep Avery Bradley from being productive when he played behind Ray Allen in limited minutes and then pushed Ray Allen to the bench. Just another excuse for Jeff Green. The Celtics have been waiting for Jeff Green to be productive and push Paul Pierce to the bench. It just isn't happening.

I never get this theory of Jeff Green sucks so the problem is Doc Rivers is not running enough plays for him. Makes no sense IMO. Jeff Green has to go out and get it. Right now he is showing no interest that he wants to do that.
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Re: Jeff Green rant 

Post#12 » by ermocrate » Sat Jan 19, 2013 3:46 pm

Celts17Pride wrote:
ermocrate wrote:Green doesn't play like Pierce, he is a different player, but plays for his are nowhere to be seen, nowhere... He has the same role on the team than a 14 minutes sub-par player that has to shot 2-3 jumpers while the SStar starter rests. Green is not that type of player, or you threat him like a co-starter or it's a complete waste of talent. It's not that when you need him he has to be a Star and when you don't need he plays 10 minutes, such players are rare, very rare.


Didn't seem to keep Avery Bradley from being productive when he played behind Ray Allen in limited minutes and then pushed Ray Allen to the bench. Just another excuse for Jeff Green. The Celtics have been waiting for Jeff Green to be productive and push Paul Pierce to the bench. It just isn't happening.

I never get this theory of Jeff Green sucks so the problem is Doc Rivers is not running enough plays for him. Makes no sense IMO. Jeff Green has to go out and get it. Right now he is showing no interest that he wants to do that.

1st Bradley was 20yo

2nd Didn't flourish until Ray got injured, never ever pushed Ray on the bench when Ray was playing and healty

3rd He had several months to put up a decent jumpshot, with Ray teaching him


Jeff Green is a 4 years NBA player, his numbers and game are written in the stone, so let's not pretend he is a19 rookie with potential that hasn't shown anything in the NBA, ok? This just an embarrassment for people head.


And, he is coming of a full year off and a open heart surgery.
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Re: Jeff Green rant 

Post#13 » by Rondo2Hondo » Sat Jan 19, 2013 4:05 pm

Green and Pierce are completely different players. Pierce could probably thrive in any system, Green needs a system that suits his skills. We are not providing that. We need to get him more involved, and to run more. Our offense is stale - I feel like I could go out there and shout instructions to the opposing team and help them out.
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Re: Jeff Green rant 

Post#14 » by Rondo2Hondo » Sat Jan 19, 2013 4:06 pm

Doc isn't going to change though. Coaches don't change their offense in season ,but by next season it will be too late. KG and Pierce will be too old to lead us anywhere next year
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Re: Jeff Green rant 

Post#15 » by Turgon » Sat Jan 19, 2013 4:21 pm

Just the other day I was sort of defending his contract on the GB and, right on cue, Green pulls two disappearing acts on two straight games. Typical...
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Re: Jeff Green rant 

Post#16 » by Geoffrey P » Sat Jan 19, 2013 5:22 pm

I love how Jeff Green fakes so often because then you know the defender's going to bite on it while Green does nothing about it. Great use for a fake I guess?
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Re: Jeff Green rant 

Post#17 » by airjaw » Sat Jan 19, 2013 7:49 pm

Geoffrey P wrote:I love how Jeff Green fakes so often because then you know the defender's going to bite on it while Green does nothing about it. Great use for a fake I guess?


Jeff Green's fake move is quite nice. gets defenders in the air pretty often.
Jeff Green's first step, after the fake, is not quite so nice. His feet are in molasses, I swear. After Jeff gets his defender in the air he starts moving in slow motion, allowing the defender to recover as soon as he lands.


If Jeff Green is a system player, and he doesn't fit the Celtics system, then doesn't that mean he shouldn't be here? We're not going to change our entire offensive system to revolve around Jeff Green are we? Because that would be laughable. Jeff Green's offensive game is trash.
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Re: Jeff Green rant 

Post#18 » by ermocrate » Sat Jan 19, 2013 7:54 pm

airjaw wrote:
Geoffrey P wrote:I love how Jeff Green fakes so often because then you know the defender's going to bite on it while Green does nothing about it. Great use for a fake I guess?


Jeff Green's fake move is quite nice. gets defenders in the air pretty often.
Jeff Green's first step, after the fake, is not quite so nice. His feet are in molasses, I swear. After Jeff gets his defender in the air he starts moving in slow motion, allowing the defender to recover as soon as he lands.


If Jeff Green is a system player, and he doesn't fit the Celtics system, then doesn't that mean he shouldn't be here? We're not going to change our entire offensive system to revolve around Jeff Green are we? Because that would be laughable. Jeff Green's offensive game is trash.

The C's did have an offensive system? Good to know.
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Re: Jeff Green rant 

Post#19 » by UGA Hayes » Sat Jan 19, 2013 9:24 pm

^ Um we pretty clearly have an offensive system. We have been running the same plays for years.
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Re: Jeff Green rant 

Post#20 » by FirstBallotKG » Sat Jan 19, 2013 9:30 pm

The problem w Jeff Green is that if he's not scoring, then there is very little impact to the game.

If he was a great position defender, he could be used as the C's best perimeter defender w size & length; but, he is not.
If he was a great rebounder, he would be in the lineup when KG leaves to give the C's a great chance of playing one shot and out; but, he's not.
If he was a peerless perimeter threat, he could be used in the lineup to give spacing when KG/Collins/Bass are on the floor; but, he's not.
If he was an athletic freak, where on the break Rondo could just give it to him at any point knowing that he'll come away with a foul or highlight, that would be great for easy baskets; but he's not.
If he was a playmaker, he could be the C's 3rd playmaker [Rondo, Pierce] to give his teammates easy scoring opportunities; but he's not.

I remember someone mentioning Marvin Williams, then the Atlanta Hawks lottery pick over Chris Paul, as similar to Jeff Green.

He's capable of doing any of these things, on occassion, but he can't sustain it for any length.

Jeff Green's biggest problem right now is that with all the athleticism, physical gifts, shooting range, and adequate ball handling skills; he, just doesn't have a gameplan of how to use his talents.

And worse yet, the Celtics don't know what they want from him either. They're asking him to be a star, when they should simplify the game for him.

They should just tell him, to be the first guy down the court in transition on the break - to speed up the tempo of the game. If he can do that in his limited time on the floor at least it will pressure the opposing team to defend him in the open court.

As it is right now, Jeff Green's game is non-descript.

He's the only player on the team that I don't know what production to expect in any given game. Every player on the team has a definitive role [with the core guys taking on multiple responsibilities]. Jeff Green has to figure out how he can help the Celtics without scoring. Maybe play tenacious perimeter defense. Maybe try to have a dominating presence on the glass. Maybe learning to cut, move without the ball to create spacing. Maybe run full sprints on breaks so that the Celtics appear athletic - though they are not.

Right now, the elephant in the room is that: Jeff Green is a great human being, nice guy; but...he hasn't established himself as what he is on the court.

The Jeff Green supporters & critics breakdown simply to this: Critics that wonder If he will ever put it all together? Supporters that believe WHEN he get it, it'll be amazing.

I'm of the former. But wouldn't mind being totally wrong on this.
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