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Tom Moore 2.0

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The Guilty Party
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Re: Tom Moore 2.0 

Post#321 » by The Guilty Party » Fri Jul 10, 2009 1:36 am

If Portland does in fact get Hinrich then that ends all talk of Miller to Portland (if it hasn't ended already). I think, like most of you, I'm getting a tad impatient with the free agency process. We're not getting anything great out of it but this Miller thing has been frustrating for at least 6 months now.
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Re: Tom Moore 2.0 

Post#322 » by ankle420breaker » Fri Jul 10, 2009 1:43 am

The Guilty Party wrote:I think, like most of you, I'm getting a tad impatient with the free agency process. We're not getting anything great out of it but this Miller thing has been frustrating for at least 6 months now.


You're among friends, TGP 8-)
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Re: Tom Moore 2.0 

Post#323 » by Dedicated_76ers_fan » Fri Jul 10, 2009 1:44 am

It reportedly has ended according to SF76. Andy Miller has shot down Miller's value with his insane 3/4 yr 10 M demands that have not gone down inspite of the market.
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Re: Tom Moore 2.0 

Post#324 » by 76erFixer » Fri Jul 10, 2009 2:00 am

I agree. Everyone wants sam out but the reality is our interior D will be pretty poor without him. If we can get a productive player or expiring contract for him then fine, but moving him (for someone elses trash) just to move him makes little sense to me.

As for miller, im fine with Eds wait and see approach. Its boring for us but waiting is just lessening millers leverage, which is a good thing. I wouldnt mind having miller back for another year. He was helping Igoudala grow and you could see it. Iggy wants him back, lou could use a little more learning, and holiday sure could as well. Count me in for the Miller 1 year plan
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Re: Tom Moore 2.0 

Post#325 » by tk76 » Fri Jul 10, 2009 2:06 am

Honestly, I never expected the team to get anything for Miller once the trading deadline passed. It would have been great to get Blake and Outlaw, but SF1976 was the only source of that and no one else ever confirmed it. Sometimes it seems like he floats out the teams wish list as opposed to real opions- but still appreciate what he brings to the board.

I did expect them to use the MLE, but I think the cap going down has killed that (except maybe a 1 year deal.) But I still am looking forward to seeing Thad, Iguodala, Lou, Speights and Holiday next year.

Not really as fixated on a championship as some. Not a realistic option for the Sixers or most NBA teams in the next 3 years. Just want to see an enjoyable product that exceeds expectations.
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Re: Tom Moore 2.0 

Post#326 » by ryst » Fri Jul 10, 2009 2:07 am

so i have been saying for a while that the sixers are cheap and been blasted a few times for it(the Iguodala,brand contracts)
but now we hear that they wont even sign players to more then minimum contracts.
and thats excatly what i mean.

the sixers will pay to be somehow competetive(they want to put buts in seats) but they will not go the extra step , they wil not go over the top to be a contender.

Snider and Stefanski will make this team the Clippers of the east,
a young team with tons of potenial yet wont spend any money more then they have to,now we come to the point that they wont even give the time of day to there own free agents.

this clowns are making fun of us , the fans.
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Re: Tom Moore 2.0 

Post#327 » by KKell2507 » Fri Jul 10, 2009 2:27 am

Kind of random but Iguodala and Thaddeus Young's twitter both said they were working out together today. They apparently had two seperate workouts together with Jason Smith joining them for one of them. Sounds like they were working on jumpers as Young's said they were getting up shots.

So good to hear our two "stars" are working out together as much as they are. Hopefully that chemistry can be shown in the 2/3 spots in the starting lineup next year.
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Re: Tom Moore 2.0 

Post#328 » by tk76 » Fri Jul 10, 2009 2:36 am

I think they are down in Atl working with Mark Price. Lou is probably there too.
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Re: Tom Moore 2.0 

Post#329 » by PhantomX » Fri Jul 10, 2009 2:47 am

I'll give ES a pass this season so long as we do actually land that lottery pick this time around. I'm ok with tanking (which is basically what we'd be doing if we fail to land any impact players or replace Miller and the other depth players that we've lost). We need to get worse to get better and that means sacrificing this season for the good of our overall future. At the same time, we can finally experiment a bit with Lou and Jru at the point and give Speights adequate minutes at the 4. That being said, Brand is the odd man out as far as I'm concerned. With Miller now gone, he has no place on this squad. Here we are in the process of building around younger pieces and yet we've got an oft injured PF on the downside of his career taking minutes away from Speights. This doesn't mesh with the direction our team appears to be headed for.

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Re: Tom Moore 2.0 

Post#330 » by 76STholder » Fri Jul 10, 2009 2:48 am

Tom,

Ed stated last season that he is going to hire a shooting coach this coming year. Can you ask Ed if he knows who it will be (assuming he was telling the truth earlier this year to the Season Ticket Holders).

Thank you!
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Re: Tom Moore 2.0 

Post#331 » by corwin » Fri Jul 10, 2009 3:06 am

tmoore wrote:
Sounds like Dalembert plans on talking to Eddie Jordan while he's in Central Florida (Orlando Pro Summer League ends Friday).


Jordan is supposed to be such a great communicator. Hey, let's hope he talks back to Sam. IMO Sam's staying & Jordan will have to figure out how to get the most out of him or how to keep him happy while he's riding the pine. Should be interesting!
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Re: Tom Moore 2.0 

Post#332 » by tk76 » Fri Jul 10, 2009 3:08 am

EJ had one on staff for the Wiz- can't recall the name (Dannie and reclinerGM metioned him.) Likely the same guy.
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Re: Tom Moore 2.0 

Post#333 » by psykosacul » Fri Jul 10, 2009 4:13 am

The Guilty Party wrote:I I'm getting a tad impatient with the free agency process. We're not getting anything great out of it but this Miller thing has been frustrating for at least 6 months now.


It was clear last year when miller did the radio interview and danced around the question of wanting to come back and liking to play here that he did NOT want to return. I gave up on him returning then. Odd that money is now the reason as opposed to him finding another team that wants him, but still, it saved me a lot of agonizing about whether he would return or not.

and honestly... if miller is a no go, i would try to find a team would use brand to get over the hump and be a title contender. Im a big fan of brand, and signing him, but with no PG, i dont see the point of not blowing it up.
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Re: Tom Moore 2.0 

Post#334 » by psykosacul » Fri Jul 10, 2009 4:20 am

tmoore wrote:Was just told this: "There is nothing going on (sign-and-trade wise) in Portland. There never was."

Asked where Miller will end up and was told it's unclear because he wants more than the MLE.


Thanks for these kinds of notes. This and the "miller was only ever offered 1yr/6mill. are the kinds of info we always question because they clear up rumors that float around and become fact.

much appreciated
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Re: Tom Moore 2.0 

Post#335 » by ryst » Fri Jul 10, 2009 5:11 am

maybe i am delusional , maybe i dont know what i am talking about

but i dont know how you guys can give Stefanski a pass for the no show he is doing this summer.
this team can be turned into contender and its not even that hard.

you trade Thad and Dalembert for Amare stoudemire(lets face it ,most likely Thad will never be as good as Amare, the suns will take Sam because of the high value and future of Thad Young)

then you trade brand for a top notch SG with a big contract as well(please dont give me the Dalmebert line that his contract is untradeable , thats bull) and there are many options(redd,kevin martin,caron butler,monta ellis,jason richardson)

you resign Miller,let Speigths and Jason smith play center, sign some key veterns who will come to a contending team(like they came to boston),and a couple of minimium guys to fill the bench and there you have it.
a line up of:
Miller/williams/holiday
SG/williams/green
Iguodala/Kapono/filler(Carney?)
Amare/smith/filler
Speights/smith/filler

this team will contend , and this is just one idea
there are planty of moves to be made and planty of chances

the owner dont want to spend more money and the GM is clueless
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Re: Tom Moore 2.0 

Post#336 » by Westbrook36ptII » Fri Jul 10, 2009 5:15 am

lmao...

Not sure where to even start with that post Ryst.

This isn't NBA Live for starters. Maybe you have been playing too much.
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Re: Tom Moore 2.0 

Post#337 » by ryst » Fri Jul 10, 2009 5:25 am

Westbrook36ptII wrote:lmao...

Not sure where to even start with that post Ryst.

This isn't NBA Live for starters. Maybe you have been playing too much.


i have been playing a lot

last game i was the magic and i traded a rookie and expiring conracts to get vince carter

after that i was the spurs and traded 3 expiring contracts for richard jefferson

i gave a shot with cleveland and was able to trade scrubs like pavlovic and ben wallace for shaq

then i was dallas and somehow made a very complicated 4 team trade with 8 players that can only be done in NBA live(no one will ever do it in real life huh) including 2 s&t ,cash changing hands,players to be moved,players to be cut, the best fantasy trade i ever did

all that in two weeks of work , can you belive it?
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Re: Tom Moore 2.0 

Post#338 » by radrmd216 » Fri Jul 10, 2009 5:27 am

Corwin, I think player's agnts demand escalating contracts becuase a new contract can be based on the previous one. I know Tom knows the actual numbers, but it might be something like a certain starting salary for years of sevice or 125% of the previous contract so Brand and Iggy would definitely want the last year of their contract to be very expensive.

Sixerfan, I know as fan you want the sxiers to make a move but the sixers are a business so adding an overpaid older player doesn't seem like a good move from a business standpoint.

It does seem like adding Brand last year an now not re-signing Miller are contradictory but a lot has happened over the past year. I'm sure the front office thought Brand would put the sixers into title contention and put people in the seats but neiher happened, so at this point Ed wants to keep his job (which is understandable), he wants to add very little salary (which is understandable), and he might be looking to the future. maybe Ed wants Brand to get back some trade so a move at the deadlin is possible.

There is no move at all to be made right now regarding Brand, so we has fans have to let time pass and see how Ed can furher manipulate the roster. I don't know why Ed doesn't want to sign an MLE type player for one year though. Ed doesn't want to guarentee salary for mroe than 2 years which is a very good move. The NBA's algorithm to derive the cap number and luxury tax is heavily weighted by advertising and league revenue, so I think Ed now sees the Sixers are not a contender and thinks adding salary when he knows the cap and luxury tax number will go down is a bad move.

I think it was Tom who said on July 1st Ed was offering a 1 year contract to Miller so obviosuly Ed knew the cap was going down this year and next year.

I think when we all look back on this offseason we will be happy because the Sixers did not tie up salary is MLE players that wouldn't do a whole lot if regards to winning a championship. The Raptors and possibly Rockets have made signings in Hedo and Ariza becuase they paid to much and they not on the verge of winning a championship. Other teams are going to overpay also in signing Lee and Millsap so us not wasting money is a very good sign for the future. As fans we need a Gm that is a shrewd businessman becuase the last guy wasn't at all. Just becuase the Sixers can afford to use the MLE doesn't mean it should be used. the sixers need to make smart calculated decisions. We should have a thread asking the fans of the teams that signed all the free agents all the ticket prices and merchandise prices are in an economic time like this.

Bottom line is we are not contending with such a young team and we need to give Ed more time becuase the direct decisions made by Billy Kind haven't even ended yet. In a few years when the sixers don't have horrble contracts to unload we will be happy as fans the sixers did not frivolously spend money in the summer of 09.

Sorry for the really long post but there was a lot of questions and comments to be talked about.
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Re: Tom Moore 2.0 

Post#339 » by tk76 » Fri Jul 10, 2009 5:32 am

"We're in a situation where we have a young nucleus of guys who have playoff experience, but we're going to grow with them," said Sixers general manager Ed Stefanski. "And to go long term on a contract with an older point guard, we don't see that as being a viable option."


I seem to recall last summer they felt "to go long term on a contract with an older"... PF for 80M was , " a viable option."

Can't really fault either decision at the time, but its hard to miss the sudden reversal. The team is rapidly becoming Elton Brand and the kids.

Now every team needs a balance of vets and youth, but...

12M total: Holiday+Young+Speights+Lou+Smith (ages 19-23)
12M: Iguodala(age 25)

11M: Sam(28):
11M total: Green+Kapono (Age 28)
15M: Brand (Age 30)

So they are building around youth while committed to 37M for 4 guys 28+ who are either highly flawed role players or have not made a significant NBA contribution since 2006/7 back when Brand was 27.

At least in 2 years Sam, Green and Kapono all come off the books.
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Re: Tom Moore 2.0 

Post#340 » by radrmd216 » Fri Jul 10, 2009 5:43 am

Ryst, sorry to say but from your post above you are delusional. There is no way the sixers could make those trades. he sixers could not contend with Smith and Speights as the centers and that the team would at least need a year to gel together.

If you want to post moves that can be made make them realistic. The Suns would laugh at Ed if all he offered for Amare was a horrible contract and a young prospect. Tom has already told us conforiming what we already knew that Brand has virtually no trade value around the league. You have to look from the perspective of the otehr team, and if Amare was on the sixers and the Suns offered us Dalembert and Young we would luagh in their face.

Ryst in those 4 trades you mentioned there is one huge common denominator EXPIRING contracts. The sixers do not have any. Also the sixers can not be called cheap after just giving a free agent to an $80 million contract the previous summer. It must suck to be an NBA owner and have fans love moves you make one minute then hate them when they do not result in a championship. We must all remeber the Sixers are a BUSINESS.

The only moves to be made are 1 year contracts for MLE. That's what Ed needs to get done but those types of players arent that great anyway, so the sixers have very few moves to make.

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